I see this problem more from younger crowd who have played NPC neutral MMOs for years. Old hats are used to sociopath pirates in previous games.
Griefers hiding as NPCs
- Thread starter CaptainSodom
- Start date
I see this problem more from younger crowd who have played NPC neutral MMOs for years. Old hats are used to sociopath pirates in previous games.
The MMOs I've played (WoW and SWTOR) both have sociopathic NPCs (not all of the, of course). Old hats are not used to sociopathic PC pirates, and as is clear from other threads, some seem to take a dim view of ever getting offed by a PC.
lol
All MMOs have "neutral" NPCs. They won't seek you out and attack you. That's HUGE difference from what ED will have.
Also previous Elite games had NPCs who just attacked you when you where on your way somewhere.
I don't see how they will avoid repercussions. All the transponder is going to do is make your icon hollow or not. Sucks for you cmdrs and those who will have an obnoxious name since a quick scan will give you away.
Don't understand why everyone is so butt hurt over this. Just because they killed you doesn't mean they are greifers. Only thing that qualifies as greifing is camping a station. But out in space and especially in lawless areas... getting killed is not greifing.
Don't understand why everyone is so butt hurt over this. Just because they killed you doesn't mean they are greifers. Only thing that qualifies as greifing is camping a station. But out in space and especially in lawless areas... getting killed is not greifing.
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I'm hoping that the NPCs will pretty much behave like PCs..as close as is possible. So NPCs will be making decisions as well; whether to attack you or that big juicy Lakon...not caring whether it is a PC or an NPC.
Both games I mentioned have a huge subset of NPCs which will attack you on sight.
Just to fully clarify the Transponder operation.
Disabling the transponder does 2 things.
Firstly it prevents you from being shown as a player (hollow shape) on other player's scanners.
However the second action is to prevent any other player showing as a hollow shape on your own scanner.
How can they grief you when they can't tell you are human?
Disabling the transponder does 2 things.
Firstly it prevents you from being shown as a player (hollow shape) on other player's scanners.
However the second action is to prevent any other player showing as a hollow shape on your own scanner.
How can they grief you when they can't tell you are human?
There is a problem here, which is one of perception. In a situation where I see the word griefing being thrown around and fear of griefing having such a design impact on the game and the culture here, people being unable to distinguish between completely legitimate gameplay, in this case by an NPC and coming on the forums to complain about it (not realising it's an NPC) shows just how prevalent this fear of griefing has become.
So for me, yes. It is a problem.
The definition of Griefing here needs to change, because there are legitmate griefing conerns.
Sandbox definition of griefing: Attacking new players in known new play starting zones or repeatedly attacking a single specific player for no in-game benefit.
Beyond that definition, any player (or in this case NPC) actions are a legitimate mechanic in the game. The culture needs to change to where people can say GG and realize what happened is legit. The game just needs to be holistically balanced so over a long period of time risk/reward is there for both sides.
On sight if you are going in their territory. As I said you can pretty much avoid that if you stick with main roads.
In ED there's potential to be attacked by NPC even in safe system.
No, those aren't legitimate griefing concerns. In this game, *everything* goes, basic core rule of the game - you can do everything you want if you don't cheat or break the game trough third party means. However there are *consequences*.
It means that if there's concern with player attacks it is solved like in real life - with more *security*.
We don't put all hope to people behave properly in real life - why we would expect that to happen in online world?
That's why you implement in-game rules and make sure they aren't abused or otherwise they need to be strengthened and tweaked to make police more powerful for example. It also means that if pirate attacks become more active in system PU background sim can call in military to take care.
While I don't really disagree per se. If we follow that here, we'll have the same problem EVE has with new player retention. Make no mistake about it, i'm 100% for completely emergent gameplay where any role or action a player wants to take is legit. But I know what I saw in EVE and something that doesn't encourage new players to stay awhile is bad.
The other thing I mentioned refers more to things crossing in to RL bullying as opposed to playing the game. That does not refer to a group of players that become adversarial based on events in game. Great example is a group of players are doing things in game that may lead to a system falling to another faction based on the background simulation. Another group in the other faction realizes this and effectively goes to war against the other side... As far as I'm concerned kill them all you want and use the mechanics to the fullest. But if it amounts to stalking a single player and effectively letting them do nothing in game... that's not good for the longevity of the game.
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Eve has horrible player retention because it's time based... you are only allowed to advance as fast as they allow you too which = guaranteed subscription fees for those who want to truly advance.
In Elite you should be able to advance as fast as you want to in any role without messing with pointless skill trees.
In Elite you should be able to advance as fast as you want to in any role without messing with pointless skill trees.
Go back and read my last comment and read the link I provide on my thread that will show you the true meaning of griefing. Or shall I create a new thread to poke fun at the lack of knowledge you show on the subject? Yes lets all create a thread to make fun of another thread. Shows the maturity level here.
Dude...you linked a wiki article...I can edit it and link it with a side note at the bottom saying "except what ipaxton says is griefing" and will be days before anyone really notices or cares. Griefing is closer to his definition than yours as yours had you running screaming to the forum before you even thought to check what is or is not possible in this beta build...christ I knew it was not possible and I am not in it.
I'm sorry man, but NPCs can't grief. The humour here (and I'm REALLY sorry that you aren't taking it all as 'oops, I made a mistake, silly me!') comes from the simple fact you're accusing NPCs of griefing ya. Which... obviously they can't, not in the 'delibrately trying to spoil your fun' unless skynet is online. Is Skynet online?!
I know what EVE is and why there's concerns. What I have seen that CCP have done very little if anything to address those concerns. Also there are some fundamental design issues within EVE to solve it properly.
Regarding stalking I already said - I will consider griefing anything which will constitute breaking forth wall. Singling out single player for long time seems to be case for intervention. I hope FD will come with clear cut corner cases when they will investigate and act upon information.
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Or possibly the case could be oh gee I dunno that maybe I didn't know, that I didn't turn around and ask who are you why are you shooting me? I can see the humor side of it but to blatantly create another thread to make fun of someone goes beyond humor.