Deliberate Ramming

[Bunkerkind Anni]

Wait, so the solution is not to make cops more dangerous and bounties higher, but to ban players who kill clean ships?

Seriously? I pirate players (without my cargo racks) and have to kill ones who do not comply, and after this is introduced I will get BANNED for killing them?!

Maybe the game should be called Elite: Fluffy Kittens and Rainbows instead? Why not focus on a proper issue like combat logging?

how can you pirate without cargo racks? whats the benefit?
and you wont be banned for piracy - where did you get that idea from

i seriously dont get this in my mind.
at the one hand, there are those self declared "pirates" start to demand that "bad karma" gives them benefits,
and on the other hand they kill unwanted targets for naught? leaving the "benefit" floating in space?

 

[nrage]

Judging from some of the posts here, I'm starting to think a karma system will be nearly impossible to implement without either;

A) killing piracy

Not true.

I came up with a relatively simple idea which would allow the karma system to "ignore" valid piracy attempts. It would also give traders some assurances, making them more likely to comply (win). It does not seem (at first glance) to be something a griefer could use to commit wanton murder.

See:
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...rate-Ramming?p=5477489&viewfull=1#post5477489

Say, the pirate issues a "request" for X tonnes of cargo, the manifest scan results UI would be used to make the request, and so long as the trader complies then any subsequent murder would incur bad karma. But, if the trader refuses the pirate can destroy them with minimal or no bad karma. So, pirates still have to be careful not to destroy ships prior to completing the manifest scan and "request" but once they manage that step they retain their leverage over the trader who would then be best off complying, knowing that the pirate is unlikely to kill them. A griefer is unlikely to bother with the manifest scan or request, and even if they did the trader would still comply and any subsequent murder would be punished.

I think the only alteration I'd make to this idea is to introduce a 30 second timer which starts when the cargo demand is made, and runs until the trader tries to run for it, or the cargo is dropped. Any attempt to engage engines/FSD would 'decline' the offer and the pirate could destroy the trader without incurring karma penalty.

 

[Maxmilian Czhilli]

While I do agree that it is a game, people get personally attached to stuff in games. It's the reason why we play them. Like travelling hours to get to a station and then have someone ram you to death for no reason at all and then having to start all over again can be annoying, upsetting or could get you angry and frustated, or could make someone not want ot play the game anymore.

Yes it's a game, but having someone else just completely wast the 2 hours of game time you had for a quick laugh is demoralising. Can you not see the issue there.

I'm pretty sure that Besiger is well aware of the upset caused to other players. Provoking emotional reactions is one of the pleasures of PvP. Troll type behaviour in games is about provoking even more heightened emotional reactions that some seek for their own satisfaction. They like the idea that people are getting upset about, what is after all, "just a game". I won't get too armchair-psychologist here because I know that Besieger has a well founded antipathy to it. But I will have a little poke by pointing out the emotional reactions of this player type when confronted by what is, after all, just suggested changes to "just a game".

 

[Imperial Guard]

Let’s talk piracy…

Then the goal is what?

a. Just steal their cargo?
b. Dump their crew in an escape pod, assume command of their vessel and either add it to your own fleet or scuttle it?

Seeing as the latter is not possible, this leaves just stealing somebody’s cargo.
And you still need a compliant victim.

I cannot imagine that anybody actually wants to be pirated.

If all you do is pull them over, murder them in cold blood and fly off, then that is assassination, not piracy.

 

[nrage]

While I do agree that it is a game, people get personally attached to stuff in games. It's the reason why we play them. Like travelling hours to get to a station and then have someone ram you to death for no reason at all and then having to start all over again can be annoying, upsetting or could get you angry and frustated, or could make someone not want ot play the game anymore.

Yes it's a game, but having someone else just completely wast the 2 hours of game time you had for a quick laugh is demoralising. Can you not see the issue there.

I'm pretty sure that Besiger is well aware of the upset caused to other players. Provoking emotional reactions is one of the pleasures of PvP. Troll type behaviour in games is about provoking even more heightened emotional reactions that some seek for their own satisfaction. They like the idea that people are getting upset about, what is after all, "just a game". I won't get too armchair-psychologist here because I know that Besieger has a well founded antipathy to it. But I will have a little poke by pointing out the emotional reactions of this player type when confronted by what is, after all, just suggested changes to "just a game".

One of the issues Elite has always had is that it's not "just a PvP" game, not like PUBG for example. So, there are many and varied player types in the game and .. here's the key point, all of them have an equal right to "play their own way".

The question is, how far does that right extend?

Can one commander pursue their path at the expense of another, and by how much?

Given we're all equal in this, the answer is going to have to involve a compromise of some sort. The issue we have is that some paths have a disproportionate affect on others, the paths with the greatest impact being the PvP focused ones. PvP is definitely a part of the game, no doubt, and every commander should be prepared for it to occur at some point. However, this is a game, so when PvP occurs all commanders involved ought to be equally said to be "playing" the game. If one player has no chance, at all, you can't really say they're "playing" the game, rather they are just there for the other to "play with". Likewise, if a player resorts to combat logging, they're not playing the game. Players using exploits are also, not playing the game. The goal is, therefore, to ensure that all players are always playing the game, all players are able to "play the way they want to play", with the only restriction being, necessarily, the effect this has on others.

 

[CMDR Cosmic Spacehead]

Hmm. Idea time!

What if Karma was replaced with some sort of simple "rap sheet", or criminal record...?

Firstly, A basic log of all crimes committed, for all to see, for all time.
Players can scan, and see another CMDRs list of crimes from all time, and react accordingly.
Only crimes are listed. Murdering a wanted CMDR is not a crime, so would not show up.

Secondly, A list of most recent crimes is maintained for say, 30 days rolling period.
Murder would basically be the main point to guage the system on, but other crimes would go against it too, but with a much lower effect.
This system could either be for PvP only, or both PvE and PvP equally, or both but with emphasis on PvP. Which ever works best.

After a certain threshold of murders(and other things), you become permanently Wanted in high security systems (even with no bounty).
The next tier, you become Wanted in all medium security systems.
And the final tier is Wanted in all systems with a low security rating.

Add to that, a buff in security's stopping power, and persistence, and you have a fairly simple system for keeping tabs on crime.

Being a victim of station ramming wouldn't really effect the system too much, unless you're particularly unlucky, or a slow learner, and become a victim too many times in 30 days. Lol

I've had other ideas to tackle illegally combat logging, so it doesn't need to fall in to the "rap sheet" idea.

It wouldn't actually stop murder, because that would be silly.
But becoming a legal target cno matter what ship, or system, would be a handy deterrent.

Probably some holes in there though. I just thought of it.

Feel free to shoot it to bits. Lol

CMDR Cosmic Spacehead

 

[SciTrekker]

Hmm. Idea time!

What if Karma was replaced with some sort of simple "rap sheet", or criminal record...?

Firstly, A basic log of all crimes committed, for all to see, for all time.
Players can scan, and see another CMDRs list of crimes from all time, and react accordingly.
Only crimes are listed. Murdering a wanted CMDR is not a crime, so would not show up.

Secondly, A list of most recent crimes is maintained for say, 30 days rolling period.
Murder would basically be the main point to guage the system on, but other crimes would go against it too, but with a much lower effect.
This system could either be for PvP only, or both PvE and PvP equally, or both but with emphasis on PvP. Which ever works best.

After a certain threshold of murders(and other things), you become permanently Wanted in high security systems (even with no bounty).
The next tier, you become Wanted in all medium security systems.
And the final tier is Wanted in all systems with a low security rating.

Add to that, a buff in security's stopping power, and persistence, and you have a fairly simple system for keeping tabs on crime.

Being a victim of station ramming wouldn't really effect the system too much, unless you're particularly unlucky, or a slow learner, and become a victim too many times in 30 days. Lol

I've had other ideas to tackle illegally combat logging, so it doesn't need to fall in to the "rap sheet" idea.

It wouldn't actually stop murder, because that would be silly.
But becoming a legal target cno matter what ship, or system, would be a handy deterrent.

Probably some holes in there though. I just thought of it.

Feel free to shoot it to bits. Lol

CMDR Cosmic Spacehead

Ignoring the many ways to implement a karma system (or just tracking of crimes committed), one way to handle the P of C&P is to add another marker to the GalMap for the Top 10 on the Galaxy's Most Wanted List, like the green markers for friends. Maybe each of the major PP powers could have a separate Most Wanted List. That would add a lot more markers, but add another Filter or an option to turn off markers you don't want to see (wish that was already available for current CG, RNGineer, or personal markers). Anyone in Open can see where the most wanted player criminals are currently located in Open. Their Wanted status couldn't be removed via Suicide-winder (it's been suggested multiple times) but that opens another discussion unrelated to this "Wanted Marker" idea. In other words, I think a discussion of the P of C&P is needed as much as the discussion of the C of C&P.

 

[VR StarLightPL]

a good C&P system would include all the features of the Karma system, but you know, not as a magical meta fairy floating above everybody's head?

This is what I am advocating, because a proper criminal career path would automatically force those "not behaving" to the outskirts of society, to anarchies and to low-secs. Flying in anything above low-sec would be dangerous for a criminal, flying below mid-sec would be dangerous to a lawful person. I just hate the idea that this could be based on some Social Justice Warrior's terms, instead of a believable criminal/lawful mechanics. I think regardless of whether someone might like it or not, both playstyles are valid. There is no "proper" way, full stop.

Small disclaimer before I continue - I don't do PvP much, besides occasional fun sparring with a friend. I fly in open when the risk is not too big (as put in one of my previous posts, a loss of a cutter with nerfed payouts across the board is currently not appealing wrt my game time, sorry) and I do not kill other commanders, besides one situational powerplay kill (which I would do more given the opportunity, for the glory Of Winters, mind you ).

I think we're all talking about different things. I'm advocating a career path (both ways, lawful and criminal), which could funnel (currently) senseless,very limited in meaning player interactions (AND PvE - I want it to work in Solo with NPC also) into something meaningful affecting your character in the long run. The reason I am bringing this up is that the system proposed by Sandro isn't that. It is a magic fairy as beautifully put by GalacticFork, and has nothing to do with "living breathing cutthroat galaxy". It's just a kindergarten measure of "behave or you will be brought in line by force". Seeing that and given other features track record, I am sure after implementing this it would be considered "The Holy Grail of C&P" and case closed. The best example is judging where I should or shouldn't kill someone based on the outfitting of his/her ship. Now this is such ridiculous idea that I was surprised that it was even discussed here, as all it would take to "resolve" was matchmaking... Yes, the very matchmaking could dump long-time players together with other long timers, and newbies with newbs. I specifically don't mention combat rating because explorers don't get that, and they should also experience the universe as it is (and be a content for criminals, whether they like it or not, just like in real life). There is that saying "don't bring a knife to a gunfight". I would expect that in a long running multiplayer game the players in "open" would be dangerous. Its normal. And people like to kill other people in video games - see the success of the FPS genre. I even mentioned in one of my previous post that I started in solo until I was comfortable enough both financially and skill-wise to fly in open. So please don't use a tactical nuke where just a simple matchmaking rules will suffice.

Also, the lawful / criminal path would be easy to implement as simple scoring (and yes it would allow walking the gray area... just like Han Solo from Star Wars, he was a Corellian Smuggler after all), why shouldn't it? And per Truesilver's idea which I reiterated it could also be tied to superpower rep somehow, plus an "overall" rep which would be used in non-aligned systems.

Now there was another point as dully noted by Fracktal and Bitstorm, that there are behaviours which escape the traditional "in-game" approach. Those are using exploits mechanics (or generally "not as intended"), malicious trolling (firing heatsinks on a multicrew explorer vessel, wasting SCBs on combat one etc.), griefwindering, using healing beams in station to avoid death by station's guns, combat logging... As a sidenote, I have written here before that I do not consider logging an issue at all, someone CLs, I have won and they have lost. But in the proposed career path a PKill would matter (both ways, think of a criminal CL-ing on a bounty hunter) and would therefore need to be tracked. Which brings me to a SUBSYSTEM of behavioral pattern tracking - and that's what the system Sammarco's proposing should be used for. Which I also mentioned in my posts earlier. I'm all for using it to track people using exploits and breaking TOS. What I am arguing against is using it like a twisted Crime and Punishment system, and analysing the proposal outlined before it led me to believe it would be used exactly like that. Corpus delicti was "attacking player in a worse ship" which I described above. Not to mention it would be a griefer paradise, in which a skilled "ganker" takes on a novice anaconda made on passenger's mission money

So, TL;DR and @nrage: I'm all up for "karma" as a non-modifiable stat tracking exploits and TOS violations, I'm against the same karma tracking and punishing valid gameplay just because someone thinks its "inappropriate". Imagine your grandparents scolding your wife for her cleavage choice and threatening to disinherit you if she doesn't start dressing "properly" as an example of such behaviour. I'm not against consequences, but I think those should be firmly in-universe by providing a career path which will naturally force playstyle changes. And because "all work and no play makes Jack a dull boy" I want perks (or a carrot and not only the stick) for each valid playstyle. I see a place for both carebear and a ganker in the same galaxy. Just with more meaning. And I think that those proposed changes, along with their advantages and disadvantages for each valid playstyle would a) solve 90% of the "ganker issues" b) lead to more meaningful and thus more depth gameplay.

PS: I also really HATE the name "Crime and Punishment". It is ultra-subjective and is glaringly one sided and wherever it turns in the discussion, I see a band of people thinking up a myriad of "make life harder fur griefurz pls fdev" while not offering anything positive in return. And as to "it will kill pvp", I respectfully note that it is not only my concern, Obsidian Ant voiced a similar opinion, among others, for the same reason - if you intend to stiff all the "fun" in a playstyle, why play it if you are not masochistic? We may turn off weapon fire on clean ships for that matter as in your ship's computer taking the role of the aforementioned grandparents.

The proposed "carrer path" is unbiased and objective. And its all about balance. Because the light side cannot exist if there were no dark side.

 

[Bunkerkind Anni]

Hmm. Idea time!

What if Karma was replaced with some sort of simple "rap sheet", or criminal record...?

Firstly, A basic log of all crimes committed, for all to see, for all time.
Players can scan, and see another CMDRs list of crimes from all time, and react accordingly.
Only crimes are listed. Murdering a wanted CMDR is not a crime, so would not show up.

Secondly, A list of most recent crimes is maintained for say, 30 days rolling period.
Murder would basically be the main point to guage the system on, but other crimes would go against it too, but with a much lower effect.
This system could either be for PvP only, or both PvE and PvP equally, or both but with emphasis on PvP. Which ever works best.

After a certain threshold of murders(and other things), you become permanently Wanted in high security systems (even with no bounty).
The next tier, you become Wanted in all medium security systems.
And the final tier is Wanted in all systems with a low security rating.

Add to that, a buff in security's stopping power, and persistence, and you have a fairly simple system for keeping tabs on crime.

Being a victim of station ramming wouldn't really effect the system too much, unless you're particularly unlucky, or a slow learner, and become a victim too many times in 30 days. Lol

I've had other ideas to tackle illegally combat logging, so it doesn't need to fall in to the "rap sheet" idea.

It wouldn't actually stop murder, because that would be silly.
But becoming a legal target cno matter what ship, or system, would be a handy deterrent.

Probably some holes in there though. I just thought of it.

Feel free to shoot it to bits. Lol

CMDR Cosmic Spacehead

so,
what happens if i have this friend of mine, with an alt account
he is permanently wanted in high-sec systems, but has not really accumulated lots of credits.

now he takes a sidewinder, and i kill him 200 times, and turn in the bounty on his head that i will always get?

making it a pure C&P system will only make it exploitable

 

[VR StarLightPL]

when PvP occurs all commanders involved ought to be equally said to be "playing" the game. If one player has no chance, at all, you can't really say they're "playing" the game, rather they are just there for the other to "play with".

Umm... Running away by highwaking (or by the disgraced-but-allowed menu timer) or, to better put it, knowing when its best to run away or face a swift rebuy IS playing the game. Pretending it is different would be a robbery victim telling the robber "you can't attack me because I am unarmed, te-he". Btw. I can see this kind of trolling ensuing if any system measuring "fighting disparity" was introduced. Hell, if I was SDC I would even reset my save periodically just to troll that mechanics - "I'm a newbie you can't hurt me because BAD THINGS will happen to you, te-he!" (and yes, brought support wrath upon me for playing their own game by their own rules and ultimately quit because getting bored).

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

One of the issues Elite has always had is that it's not "just a PvP" game, not like PUBG for example. So, there are many and varied player types in the game and .. here's the key point, all of them have an equal right to "play their own way".

The question is, how far does that right extend?

Can one commander pursue their path at the expense of another, and by how much?

Given we're all equal in this, the answer is going to have to involve a compromise of some sort. The issue we have is that some paths have a disproportionate affect on others, the paths with the greatest impact being the PvP focused ones. PvP is definitely a part of the game, no doubt, and every commander should be prepared for it to occur at some point. However, this is a game, so when PvP occurs all commanders involved ought to be equally said to be "playing" the game. If one player has no chance, at all, you can't really say they're "playing" the game, rather they are just there for the other to "play with". Likewise, if a player resorts to combat logging, they're not playing the game. Players using exploits are also, not playing the game. The goal is, therefore, to ensure that all players are always playing the game, all players are able to "play the way they want to play", with the only restriction being, necessarily, the effect this has on others.

Play your own way quote is always taken out of context. Like all games you can play your own way but only within the game world.

There is a C&P system in game but it is so underdeveloped that it is effectively useless.

The game is meant to some degree simulate a real futuristic galaxy. That is the environment the game is based on. If people don't want that environment then, I really have to say that it may not be the right game for them. If all people want to do is destroy other ships with impunity then I suggest CQC. You can do that all day without rebuy or tears from others.

I also admit that the simulation is far from perfect and a good C&P and karma system will help that along with other updates.

What is the purpose of the BGS without other good mechanics to back it up like a good C&P and karma system. Again I am not blind to the limitations of the BGS and really want that improved as well.

 

[Robert Maynard]

Hell, if I was SDC I would even reset my save periodically just to troll that mechanics - "I'm a newbie you can't hurt me because BAD THINGS will happen to you, te-he!"

.... except for the fact that it would be trivial to identify accounts with lots of play-time (and take into account their previous karma) when looking the freshly reset / renamed CMDR's actions.

 

[Thetele]

.... except for the fact that it would be trivial to identify accounts with lots of play-time (and take into account their previous karma) when looking the freshly reset / renamed CMDR's actions.

Won't work on consoles as you can get infinite amount of accounts for free. Just create new Microsoft/xbox/gamertag (what ever its called) and set it to same console, all accounts on same console can play all games that xbox has access to the games, this mean new account for elite for free for work of couple minutes. And it will work in similar way on PS4. So if someone want to game the system they could reset their karma easily. It would be more vice to rather reset karma with account reset, than encourage people wanting to reset their karma to create infinite amount of new accounts for same effect.

 

[Robert Maynard]

Won't work on consoles as you can get infinite amount of accounts for free. Just create new Microsoft/xbox/gamertag (what ever its called) and set it to same console, all accounts on same console can play all games that xbox has access to the games, this mean new account for elite for free for work of couple minutes. And it will work in similar way on PS4. So if someone want to game the system they could reset their karma easily. It would be more vice to rather reset karma with account reset, than encourage people wanting to reset their karma to create infinite amount of new accounts for same effect.

Presumably the alt-accounts would be linked to the console of the primary account that owns the game?

 

[CMDR Cosmic Spacehead]

so,
what happens if i have this friend of mine, with an alt account
he is permanently wanted in high-sec systems, but has not really accumulated lots of credits.

now he takes a sidewinder, and i kill him 200 times, and turn in the bounty on his head that i will always get?

making it a pure C&P system will only make it exploitable

Any bounties he gained would be cleared on death, but his crimes would remain for 30 days (or whatever), and he would remain wanted in high security systems, but his bounty would read 0cr.

Assuming you killed him, you'd get his bounty to cash in, but if you killed him again, before he'd commited any offences, you'd get nothing. But it would still be perfectly legal to kill him in that level of security.

The Wanted but with zero bounty tag could be named something else. Not sure what.

The only way to clear the wanted status is to lay low and commit no further crimes (in secure space), until your "crime level" drops to a point where you can safely enter high security.

Punishment comes in the form of if you're scanned or detected, you're chased down by overpowered security patrols, or obliterated by the station. Lol

 

[Arguendo]

how can you pirate without cargo racks? whats the benefit?

He's NaCl. They're not anywhere close to being pirates. He doesn't need cargo racks, because the only commodity they're interested in is Sodium Chloride and you don't find that in a trader's cargo hold.

 

[Bunkerkind Anni]

Any bounties he gained would be cleared on death, but his crimes would remain for 30 days (or whatever), and he would remain wanted in high security systems, but his bounty would read 0cr.

Assuming you killed him, you'd get his bounty to cash in, but if you killed him again, before he'd commited any offences, you'd get nothing. But it would still be perfectly legal to kill him in that level of security.

so, because he has a "bad karma", and i am not, i can kill him without hesitation and without getting wanted myself. ok..

The Wanted but with zero bounty tag could be named something else. Not sure what.

so, since you are not sure what you could use here, lets use a placeholder for it: "bad karma"

The only way to clear the wanted status is to lay low and commit no further crimes (in secure space), until your "crime level" drops to a point where you can safely enter high security.

Punishment comes in the form of if you're scanned or detected, you're chased down by overpowered security patrols, or obliterated by the station. Lol

so NPCs react to player with "bad karma" differently, scaling up to him not beeing able to dock a station or flying into a higher security system.

hmm,
now, i see a trend here

why are you against a karma system when you suggest basicly the same?

- - - Updated - - -

He's NaCl. They're not anywhere close to being pirates. He doesn't need cargo racks, because the only commodity they're interested in is Sodium Chloride and you don't find that in a trader's cargo hold.

i think my question was a rhetorical one

- - - Updated - - -

Presumably the alt-accounts would be linked to the console of the primary account that owns the game?

that would be obvious, dont you think? :S

 

[nrage]

Umm... Running away by highwaking (or by the disgraced-but-allowed menu timer) or, to better put it, knowing when its best to run away or face a swift rebuy IS playing the game.

No, because that is not always possible. In particular in the situations we want to discourage.

Btw. I can see this kind of trolling ensuing if any system measuring "fighting disparity" was introduced.

That's not really trolling. You would simply ignore commanders that are beneath you, so to speak. The game will certainly have to give you some indication of targets which are "fair game" and you would interdict/engage them instead.

Hell, if I was SDC I would even reset my save periodically just to troll that mechanics - "I'm a newbie you can't hurt me because BAD THINGS will happen to you, te-he!" (and yes, brought support wrath upon me for playing their own game by their own rules and ultimately quit because getting bored).

This has been addressed, multiple time. It is trivial to track the karma of previous resets (at least on PC) and factor that in.

 

[Galactic Fork]

so, because he has a "bad karma", and i am not, i can kill him without hesitation and without getting wanted myself. ok..

Well, in the context presented sure. The system has deemed the person undesirable, but not enough to offer money to kill them. More that they deemed them unworthy of the legal protections of the system. So any actions against them will be deemed legal by the system.

so, since you are not sure what you could use here, lets use a placeholder for it: "bad karma"

Because this is in universe, and not the metagod.

so NPCs react to player with "bad karma" differently, scaling up to him not beeing able to dock a station or flying into a higher security system.

hmm,
now, i see a trend here

why are you against a karma system when you suggest basicly the same?

Basically it's a matter of presentation. "Bad Karma" by definition is meta. I stated earlier, a good C&P system would have all the stuff a karma system would have but be part of the actual setting.

 

[CMDR Cosmic Spacehead]

so, because he has a "bad karma", and i am not, i can kill him without hesitation and without getting wanted myself. ok..

You don't sound so sure... Lol
Basically yes.
Naughty player equals no legal protection.

It doesn't prevent anyone going where ever they want to go, or anything, it just makes life harder or more risky.

so, since you are not sure what you could use here, lets use a placeholder for it: "bad karma"

Karma sounds odd. Like we're all being watched by some all seeing god.
I'd prefer a more technical name, like Criminal Record, especially as it's very hard to distinguish good actions to gain "good karma", and even harder to make it automated, without gaming the system.
Criminal players, who are legal targets, but with zero bounties, can be labeled as "Criminal", or "Felon", or something like that.

so NPCs react to player with "bad karma" differently, scaling up to him not beeing able to dock a station or flying into a higher security system.

hmm,
now, i see a trend here

why are you against a karma system when you suggest basicly the same?

The player would still be able to use all facilities in the game, providing they didn't get scanned. Same as now.

The main difference is NPC Security would scale with the threat, and chase you in to supercruise, or in extreme cases, to another system (if they have presence there).
Right now, you can just go to a Nav beacon, murder endless NPC's, wait for security to start shooting and jump to supercruise.
And they're gone. You're safe.
IMHO, they should follow you, both in and out of SC, and pursue you for longer, based on your "active criminal record".

But yeah, it's pretty much a basic karma system, with no "good" karma.
Hence, Criminal Record system.