My visit to Frontier Developments and the Future of the Game
- Thread starter Obsidian Ant
- Start date
I totally understand where you are coming from.
You know, it's actually funny - in recent weeks, I've been called "fanboy", and "Frontier hater". I've been accused of ruining the game, and I've been accused of being biased and ignoring players concerns. Some people have told me that I make things unnecessarily difficult for Frontier, because I am too critical. Others have said that I only see the good side of Frontier and forget about the players. This is interesting, because as you point out - people see what they want to see. Some see the things they like, and are happy because they like them. Others see the things they don't like and pick up on that straight away. I'm not talking about Frontier or Elite here, I'm talking about my videos. Sometimes people see what isn't there. I can't be both a Fanboy and a Frontier Hater at the same time can I? Maybe these accusations come because I try to be as balanced as possible with my content, and a small section of viewers don't see this and instead only see what they expect to see.
But everyone is entitled to their opinion and I certainly don't think my opinions are the "right ones". What I do try however, is to make it clear when I am expressing my own opinions and when I am referring to other people's opinions.
There are a lot of things I do not like about Elite, and I have made a lot of forum posts and videos on those subjects. Powerplay and Engineers are just two of the things I dislike. RNG is probably the thing I dislike the most about Elite. I'm also not a fan of the way the game makes me waste so much damn time. I think the landable planets could do with a lot of improvement, and feel that in some respects they have been "ruined" compared to previous iterations. I'm not a fan of the shallow trading mechanics, or the way many of the games systems all work in isolation from each other rather than in cohesion. I could go on and on. But none of this is a secret, anyone who reads my forums posts or who watches my videos will know exactly how I feel. Frontier are no exception to that, they are very much aware of my thoughts and feelings on these things. But my feelings and opinions are just that. They are my own, and no more valid or meaningful than anyone else's.
I cannot say what Frontier are going to fix, and what they are not going to fix because I do not know. They didn't tell me. What they did tell me however is they do intend on fixing things. That they intend on fleshing out core mechanics and take the opportunity to bring them inline with their original vision as well as make further enhancements. What does that mean? Well I don't know. As I made clear at the end of my video, and at the end of my forum post my thoughts on that are "we will have to wait and see what this means for the gameplay". But also I will state again, that the general attitude and approach from Frontier left me with a very positive impression.
E3 is going to be highly anticipated by a lot of people, and rightly so - because people want to know what is coming next. But E3 will not have all the answers, it will not show us what is coming beyond 2.4, and it will probably only show us a part of what 2.4 is going to be.
For the rest, we are going to have to wait. And again, I have made my position on that very clear over the previous years - I have said again and again on these forums and on my videos that I feel Frontier need to get better at communicating. Yet for this I get the accusations that "Obsidian Ant puts too much pressure on Frontier" and "Obsidian Ant you are a fanboy, stop telling people they should wait and see". Again, as you pretty much said above, people see and hear what the want to see and hear.
Maybe that is why Frontier struggle with figuring out just what the "right amount" of communication is.
As for what I had to say - well it is entirely up to you how you feel about that. There's a lot I don't like about Elite (and I don't make a secret about that) - but as with most people here I am very passionate about the game, and there is a great deal I do love about it. That is what keeps me coming back, and I want Elite to be the best it can be.
Personally I feel Frontier have the right attitude towards the future of the game, I also know that Frontier are committed to future development. What that ultimately means for the game play though - I will yet again reiterate (as I did in the video and the original post), I really don't know. We will have to wait and see.
Hi
Not a fanboy or a hater either and as a viewer of your videos I do feel you give a balanced critique which often mirrors my own positive feelings and frustrations.
Whenever you get people who are passionate about a subject. Point of view comes into play and people interpret things very differently.
Thank you for the info and although we dont know exactly where the game is headed, its good to know it has direction. Also that there are bound to be some, if not all of the upcoming features that will keep us all coming back for more.
All in all my feeling is that this is positive news.
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This should be the sound effect at the rebuy screen
They still have that in the game? [where is it]
I'm actually kind of curious what it looks like. Has it changed in the last two years? [noob]
...
Now that I think of it, I may have seen it in a couple of the betas since then, taking the pod back for a tuneup.
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Thanks for the update Obsidian Ant. I find your optimism after your visit to be quite reassuring.
This!
Thank you, Obsidian!
Thanks to OA and all the others who got to visit Frontier (jealous much.....). Great to have some corroboration of what Frontier has been saying about their intentions for the future of the game, even if NDAs mean everything's still light on re detail and there's things they're not ready to talk about yet. Good luck to Frontier for E3. Really hoping for some sneak peeks at how the development of some of the big content is coming along, like gas giants, atmospheres and water worlds/earth-likes. On the earth-likes I'm really interested to know a little more about how Frontier is planning to deal with not just the diversity of life on a single earth-like but *between* earth-likes (both in terms of life being different between planets and being at differing stages of an evolutionary path), given how many earth-likes appear to be out there. Going to be a real challenge I think, even if procedurally generated, and it may be a simple option to have most earth-likes being quite primitive, with simple life forms, and only allow a few earth-likes to have more complex life forms. Would love to see some talk about that at E3.
I think most of the stuff at E3 will be coverage on some of what 2.4 will be about. Frontier have talked about a special event later in the year for announcing stuff coming after 2.4, whatever that stuff might be.
Sounds to me that the special event will have a lot more to show than E3...but E3 should be pretty good too.
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It wasn't in response to anything you said, whoever you are.
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Haven't read all of this thread, but did FD say anything about LXP owners and if this new sales model will affect them?
It's all very well saying that FD will honour the LXP, but FD certainly don't help themselves when they make a comment about a new sales model. This kind of comment, with no clarfication (as usual), leaves some LXP owners scratching their heads wondering if FD are toying with the idea of reneging on it. Some clarification would be useful now, not later.
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I just posted a video about this, but not everyone watches those - so I thought I would post here as well. Earlier this week I got invited to the Frontier offices along with a few others - it was a bit of a surprise, but Frontier wanted us to come along and record a couple of lines of dialogue for them to use in-game. Kinda like little cameo things.
So - the offices are really big, that was the first thing that hit me. The second thing was all the Elite Dangerous memorabilia everywhere, from ship models to cushions to wall hangings of posters (to big to fit in even the largest room of my house). There was also stuff from other Frontier games. Those guys certainly love the projects they work on, and are very proud of them!
It's often questioned how many people work on Elite, well there were two full open plan offices - and it appeared a huge amount of the staff were dedicated to working on Elite. Numbers for Elite were easily in the region of 100+. The content we got to see was very impressive, and I think people are going to like it a lot. Most of what we saw, people will probably get to see from Frontier at E3.
There's been some worry that 2.4 is going to be a small patch, I think that concern came from the announcement that 2.4 is going to be released in sections. From what I saw, it appeared that 2.4 is going to be at least as big as all the other patches, and it certainly isn't the end of the main development of the game.
Another thing that I know has been concerning people is Frontier's talk about working on the "core mechanics" of the game after 2.4. Some people feel this means the game is going into maintenance mode with Frontier simply working on bug fixes and minor changes. We got the chance to ask for clarification on this - and the "core mechanic" changes actually means that Frontier are going to flesh out existing game mechanics and give the developers the opportunity to bring these aspects of the game inline with the original concepts as well as to perhaps add further enhancements where they can. So it seems that this is going to be big deal stuff, rather than just small tweaks.
Another thing I've seen people wonder about, is whether or not there will be new features in the future updates. Good news is that there will still be new content added to the game along with new headline features. However Frontier are not willing to talk about what that stuff is just yet.
We still don't know what the new sales model for the game will be. Frontier aren't talking on that one - but it won't be a season pass.
Bottom line; there is a huge team working on the game. Frontier are committed to the game's future, and are not winding the project down in any way, shape or form. They are aware that the game isn't perfect, and there is a strong desire within the team to add new depth to the game, and improve upon existing mechanics. What this ultimately means for the gameplay I don't know, but whatever the case - things are not going to remain static, and improvements are coming.
So, yeah - it's not as bleak as people have been imagining that's for sure. A lot of good stuff on the way.
Here's the video for anyone that wants to watch it:
https://youtu.be/OU9-PmZkoDo
Just wanted to add, what a great bunch people people work at Frontier! Very passionate about the game, and extremely friendly! It was nice to meet everyone, Ed, Zac, Sandro, Jonny, David, Dav, Sally and so many others.
With all due respect, I couldn't care less about any "I've seen it, it is looking good" posts. I understand you are not allowed to say (or were not even shown*) concrete things that are coming, so this critique is not so much directed at you, but at Frontier. I am absolutely tired about the still ongoing secrecy about 2.4, and am wary that the "released piecemeal" approach will probably also mean we will learn what 2.4 actually contains also piece by piece.
The thing is, you being potentially shown any evidence of things going to be good is not encouraging at all to me. As an early backer and member since Alpha, I have been feeling shut out for a long time. The game is going in a direction for which I would never have backed it or joined the Alpha (engineer grind, RNG upgrades, MMO style stat progression) while the flow of information went from condense direct communication on the forums to being sprinkled parsely across an over-inflation of livestreams, third-party exlusives and in-person venues.
It is for the latter part why your visit and comments on it inspire no confidence whatsoever in the future of the game. It's not that I doubt it having a future, I doubt that its future is anything I want the game to be, anything I would have backed it for in the first place (I certainly didn't put down 200GBP for Alpha backing only to end up with a railroaded RNG stat upgrade grind).
What I need at this point is not assurance that there is a future, but a clear-cut definition what this future is going to be like. I still uphold my prediction that 2.4 and beyond will be dominated by a) war with the Thargoids, b) even more - and Thargoid-related - item grind. Especially the latter prospect worries me because the existing item grind already continues to deter me from doing anything at all in the game now (just today I had several ideas how to try a different loadout on 2 of my ships, only to dismiss the idea because it would involve more grind and RNG just to be able to start trying out the loadouts!). I know I might be flogging a dead horse here, but it's really crucial for me to know whether FD are going to bet on that specific horse in future races, or whether there is any chance of abandoning it in favour of something better.
Trading desperately needs a polish. It was core gameplay in 1984 and should be sexy in 2017 as well. I hope FD did some work on this.
Good stuff OA.
Now where did I put those shades.
Now where did I put those shades.
As much as I was pleased and reassured by OA's and others comments in this thread, I can't help but totally agree with you 100%.
Those rumors on Reddit that the cheaters were only given a 30 day game ban and ALLOWED TO KEEP THEIR CHEAT SHIPS with all their exploited modules, fills me with far more dread and disappointment if true than ANYTHING positive Frontier could possibly be planning for us in future updates.
The game can not continue with that dark cloud of injustice hanging over the community.
Those Cheat Ships and every single exploited module NEED TO BE GONE PERMANENTLY from the game. There is no gray area here whatsoever.
If that means wiping or deleting the offender's saves or accounts completely in order to remove their ill gotten gains then so be it! You won't see anyone around here shedding any tears over such a move from Frontier.
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