In your opinion.
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In your opinion.
Good thing there is a mode where you don't have to encounter people. Alternatively one can join Mobius if you do want to meet people but don't like the competive nature of Open, it's PVE only outside of Combat Zones as I understand it. Elite already offers options that most games don't.
Piracy may be what you are interested in then. You can make a tidy profit from pulling and demanding cargo, learn some disabling tactics when they try to run, and get PVP fighting back against bounty hunters. Pirate a CG and your cargo even counts for CG reward totals!
I would be more in favour of player vs player if Frontier took the route of Star Trek Online - players blow each other ships' up but all it costs you is a match up, not credits.
Instead, they are trying to be like EVE online where there is a consequence of you getting deaded - even though the game itself is entirely flawed because;
a) no suitable crime and punishment system.
b) no suitable dedicated server farm.
c) has peer-to-peer - oh ye olde gods, abuse is endless (trying to connect to players in the first place and d/c) - not solved because of point (a).
d) no real way to influence the economies or super powers in a meaningful way that isn't a bore or grind related (not being able to at least align with a minor power or make a guild is... so lack luster and demoralising in this generation of gaming).
e) because the game is missing point (a), (b), (c) and (d), Elite is not a real sandbox.
EVE ticks every single one of the boxes above - Elite does not. If PvP had no cost of credits for ships lost, other than time, then PvP would be largely accepted, because then Elite isn't trying to be something it isn't.
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Boils down to this -at least for me- there is no sense of ownership in Elite so if you don't care how to master advance flight-wpn mechanics and measure your abilities why would you bother ?
Defending something -more than your rep or self-preservation- only in open would be a major motive for pvp .
Defending something -more than your rep or self-preservation- only in open would be a major motive for pvp .
I wish more people would come to this conclusion.
Any crime and punishment system will be flawed and just create more problems than it solves.
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
What about lost cargo, exploration data, bounty vouchers, etc.?
.... and if all that was replaced then PvP would be reduced to an annoyance.
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![[VR] Mad Mike](https://forums-cdn.zaonce.net/data/avatars/m/27/27910.jpg?1553527108){kind=avatar}
I think you need to fact check your dates on that one! 41yo here and gamed through the whole birth of online competitive gaming.#
also have 200 hrs or so in warthunder and double that in the BF games
Indeed. I'm 50 and have fond memories of chainsawing my boss's head off in multiplayer Doom 2.
which on its own is the biggest reason the majority dislike pvp - its an annoyance and wastes their time. The two things you can do nothing about.
Face it the majority of people want either a solo game (which they have) or a pve game that they DONT as they are split between numerous private groups due to the player cap limit. We need open pve so all the pve players can have fun playing together, or at the very least the player cap on groups needs raising again, probably to 100k, since there are over 40,000 in just the mobius groups alone.
Over 35 here too... don't forget the earliest computer game ever (which happened to be PvP by design)... PONG... the Pong tables that some Pubs had were quite fun at the time.
Have also played PvP with the Dungeon Master (IIRC), Doom (the original version), Unreal and UT in various forms, Quake and Quake Arena in various forms, Microsoft Freelancer, Battlefield 1942, RTCW, Ghost Recon (the original CD based version), and various others.
I have seen the growth of the PC from purely an office appliance to the bleeding edge computer technology platform it tends to be today. The true golden age of PvP gaming probably pre-dates the gaming (if not living) memory of those born in the past 20-25 years. PvP gaming has gone steadily down hill since then.
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Over 35 here too... don't forget the earliest computer game ever (which happened to be PvP by design)... PONG... the Pong tables that some Pubs had were quite fun at the time.
Have also played PvP with the Dungeon Master (IIRC), Doom (the original version), Unreal and UT in various forms, Quake and Quake Arena in various forms, Microsoft Freelancer, Battlefield 1942, RTCW, Ghost Recon (the original CD based version), and various others.
I have seen the growth of the PC from purely an office appliance to the bleeding edge computer technology platform it tends to be today. The true golden age of PvP gaming probably pre-dates the gaming (if not living) memory of those born in the past 20-25 years. PvP gaming has gone steadily down hill since then.
Its actually starting to regress which is a good thing. Every time I play rocket league I am reminded of Atari Tank and other games along that line. Its fun, Its based upon skill, and it doesnt give too much of an advantage to any one side of the pitch. IMHO its one of the most honest PVP experience as of late. However PUBG is starting to shape up to be amazing.
Also, apparently people are sad when they lose a couple of assassination mission's worth of space pixels. Which is weird since space pixels are ... well ... space pixels. But whatever. Don't judge, I guess.
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The game design is not PVP it's great as PVE but as PVP it really need a lot more than just a few add ons.
Y'know what would happen to ED if they banned PvP tomorrow? Nothing (other than salt in the forums). It would still continue, it would still have just about as many players as before (coz it's been shown repeatedly that the vast majority don't PvP)... oh they might start developing some real content coz they didn't have to pander to the pewpewers... that's about it though.
Y'know what'd happen if they banned PvE tomorrow? The first thing is the vast majority of the players would leave. Next they'd have to cut the galaxy down to maybe five systems so you could find each other. Then they'd have to scrap the whole BGS, markets, trading, and mission systems as money makers. Then they'd have to create a way of making money from PvP. Then they'd have to scrap at least half the ships (well they wouldn't have to, but there'd certainly be no point in continuing development of ships with very little purpose). Then they'd have to redesign the instancing systems and the networking systems. Then they'd have to actually address the combat logging issue. In short, it'd take a fairly comprehensive redesign of the game.
It's not a PvP game... as PvP games go ED is a TERRIBLE one, and THAT is why it's unpopular here. Asking "why is PvP unpopular in ED" is like asking "why are royal flushes unpopular hands in chess".
Y'know what'd happen if they banned PvE tomorrow? The first thing is the vast majority of the players would leave. Next they'd have to cut the galaxy down to maybe five systems so you could find each other. Then they'd have to scrap the whole BGS, markets, trading, and mission systems as money makers. Then they'd have to create a way of making money from PvP. Then they'd have to scrap at least half the ships (well they wouldn't have to, but there'd certainly be no point in continuing development of ships with very little purpose). Then they'd have to redesign the instancing systems and the networking systems. Then they'd have to actually address the combat logging issue. In short, it'd take a fairly comprehensive redesign of the game.
It's not a PvP game... as PvP games go ED is a TERRIBLE one, and THAT is why it's unpopular here. Asking "why is PvP unpopular in ED" is like asking "why are royal flushes unpopular hands in chess".
Just to elaborate on my earlier post, and unlike other posters i do not claim to know what the "majority" of the player base thinks.
The reason i am not playing now and the reason i dont do PVP is the engineers. I bought the game expecting to do PVP, i want to do PVP, but FD has killed PVP in its cradle with the RNGineers.
FD hid pvp behind a grindwall that i think few emotionally and mentally healthy people care to scale. I have enjoyed playing PVP in other space games and was looking foward to in in ED, but i refuse to spend tens or hundreds of hours grinding away for engineers mods to be able to pvp.
In addition pvp should be about skill rather than how lucky you were with engineers mods.
I know im not alone in feeling the way i do about the above, because i have seen posts that echo my feelings, but i am not a spokesperson for the "majority" as some seem to want to appear.
The reason i am not playing now and the reason i dont do PVP is the engineers. I bought the game expecting to do PVP, i want to do PVP, but FD has killed PVP in its cradle with the RNGineers.
FD hid pvp behind a grindwall that i think few emotionally and mentally healthy people care to scale. I have enjoyed playing PVP in other space games and was looking foward to in in ED, but i refuse to spend tens or hundreds of hours grinding away for engineers mods to be able to pvp.
In addition pvp should be about skill rather than how lucky you were with engineers mods.
I know im not alone in feeling the way i do about the above, because i have seen posts that echo my feelings, but i am not a spokesperson for the "majority" as some seem to want to appear.
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I have plenty of space games I can play combat or pvp in. I bought Elite : Dangerous because of the chance to do something different than pewpew. The most joining I have done in E|D is for CGs. I don't need adrenaline kicks. I like mining & trucking. I like exploring. After some 100s of hours in a game, I should be able to build a ship that can deal with enemies or I'm a bad player. I play solo or Mobius.
I don't understand the viewpoint "with out pvp you are lame" - it seems like a stupid point. I play E|D to do something different. If Open is a toxic mess, it's the fault of the people who play in it. Since FD won't do anything, and since players won't group-up and deal with it, then it would be a very unrelaxing game for me to play. As others have said, when I have game time I want to relax. I have no inclination to play pvp.
I don't understand the viewpoint "with out pvp you are lame" - it seems like a stupid point. I play E|D to do something different. If Open is a toxic mess, it's the fault of the people who play in it. Since FD won't do anything, and since players won't group-up and deal with it, then it would be a very unrelaxing game for me to play. As others have said, when I have game time I want to relax. I have no inclination to play pvp.
Understandable, but I would emphasise that playing with people does not mean PvP is a foregone conclusion or requirement. If the fundamental reason you play solo is because you do not wish to be bothered with PvP then there are various PvE groups that will allow for co-operative play without (the vast majority of) the concerns of undesirable PvP incidents.
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