NPC Shield regen' speed?

[Stealthie]

My Cutter is set-up as a Trade-ship so the weapons aren't really that special.
They're just there to get rid of NPC's who get in the way.

They are as follows:-
1 x Huge Beam laser (G5 efficient c/w thermal transfer)
2 x Medium Beam laser (G5 Efficient)
2 x Large Multicannon (G5 overcharged c/w corrosive)
2 x Medium Multicannon (G5 overcharged)

So, I'm carting a bit of gold around and a deadly NPC in an Anaconda takes an interest.
After a couple of interdictions I decide to get rid of him, and that's when the oddness starts.

My weapons are configured into 2 separate fire-groups; one for lasers and one for M/Cs
I select lasers (4 pips to weps), open fire and he loses a couple of rings of his shields as my charge runs down.
I stop firing and, as I watch, his shields restore to full in a period of about five seconds.

Eh? NPCs use SCBs?
Okay, that's interesting. Didn't know that.

I make another couple of passes at him and the same thing happens.
I can put a big dent in his shields with my lasers but can't deplete them before my lasers lose charge and his shields restore to full in a few seconds.

So, I reconfigure my fire-groups so ALL my weapons are firing at the same time - lasers and M/Cs - and take another run at him.
This time I take out his shields completely and do about 5% hull damage before I lose charge to my lasers and break off.

And then, after five seconds, his shields are back on line and, after another 5 seconds, they're back up to full strength again.
Awhatnow? [blah]

I try various things (over a period of about 10 minutes), culminating in going toe-to-toe with him, and I can get his shields down and inflict about 20% hull damage on him before my own shields are almost gone.
And then, as usual, his shields come straight back on-line and recharge to full in about 10 seconds.

At this point, I've used more than half of my M/C ammo' so I know I'm not going to be able to carry on inflicting the same level of damage on him for long enough to destroy him and decide to high-wake.

So, anybody know what sort of shields can work like that?

I've tried using a C7 bi-weave shield on my Cutter and I know it regenerates faster than a regular shield but it doesn't regenerate in five seconds and it sure as hell doesn't come back on line 5 seconds after being broken.

 

[Crank Larson]

Eh? NPCs use SCBs?
Okay, that's interesting. Didn't know that.

Yes, NPCs use SCBs, and as far as I can see most of what you are describing is exactly this. I've also seen it. Admittedly the restoration of the shields once they are broken seems a little odd - SCBs don't work on broken shields, do they? Don't suppose you have a video?

 

[BDelacroix]

I've run into SCB using NPCs. They are annoying in that they take longer to kill, but I haven't seen near instant shield replenishment.
I treat the SCB NPCs much as you did. All weapons to get those shields down.

 

[Hellfire85]

sometimes I wonder if people are playing a different game than myself... Dunno how you shoot, but even in my Vulture with only 2 large G5 OC MCs (one thermal, the other signature enhancing) I never get deadly condas with "cheated" shields and I only need a few reloads to break it...

But they might have bi-wave and extremely good pip management.

 

[Conch]

Im not saying its the case with your story, but npcs even use reboot/repair when their powerplant is taken offline.

 

[Stealthie]

sometimes I wonder if people are playing a different game than myself... Dunno how you shoot, but even in my Vulture with only 2 large G5 OC MCs (one thermal, the other signature enhancing) I never get deadly condas with "cheated" shields and I only need a few reloads to break it...

But they might have bi-wave and extremely good pip management.

It was new to me too.

As I say, my Cutter is a trade-ship but I'm not averse to arriving in a new system, scanning the nav-beacon and then hanging around to blast a few NPCs and I've never had problems with Anacondas before.

It did occur to me that I could have synthesised ammo' reloads to keep the fight going but, meh.
Thing is, my only real choice was to carry on doing quick passes, taking out his shields and ~5% hull with each pass.
Even if I synthesised ammo reloads, it would have taken the best part of an hour to finish him off like that.

 

[Whiterose]

Eventually they do run out of SCB's. If it happens more than four times they may have two banks.

 

[Stealthie]

Eventually they do run out of SCB's. If it happens more than four times they may have two banks.

That's something else I was wondering about too.

On the topic of whether or not NPCs "cheat", I've been attacked by NPCs in Eagles that will spam chaff and mines seemingly indefinitely, and certainly much longer than their ammo' supply should allow.
That, I suppose, could be explained by the NPC synthesising reloads so it's not a definite "cheat".

In this case, if the NPC was using SCBs to restore his shields then he must've done it at least 15-20 times during our encounter.
Thing is, given the speed his broken shields came back on line, I'm not even sure he would have needed to use an SCB to restore them. Maybe that was just the "normal" recharge rate for whatever shields he had?

 

[thirstyfish]

I have seen NPC shields go from broken to recharge in abnormally short time frames. Makes me wonder what they are doing.

Do SCBs do more for them than for us? Are they able to increase their broken recharge rate using them? Pretty certain we can't. Otherwise, I am having a tough time explaining that.

 

[NecasekO]

NPCs definitely use some very unusual loadouts. It's perfectly possible that this Anaconda had an unusually small shield generator, making it recharge very fast compared to what you usually see on big ships. And NPCs do run out of SCB charges, chaff, missiles and other stuff.

You should have checked the NPC's loadout in left panel, it doesn't show everything but you would at least see how many shield boosters and SCBs it had.

 

[Stealthie]

You should have checked the NPC's loadout in left panel, it doesn't show everything but you would at least see how many shield boosters and SCBs it had.

Whoops...

I meant to ask whether SCBs show up on the sub-target list because I didn't see any on the list for this ship.

I was operating on the assumption that it did have one (or more) because of the way it's shields were regenerating but they don't appear on the list.
If they are supposed to show up, I guess that'd mean there was definitely something iffy going on, wouldn't it?

Dunno if I made it clear enough in the OP but I made more than 10 passes at him (3 with just my beams and then a whole heap with beams & M/Cs) before I just went "all in".
At a guess, I'd assume he had, perhaps, a C7 shield and then a whole heap of C6 SCBs but they weren't showing up on the sub-target list.

I suppose if I'd been desperate to win the fight, I could have just kept making passes, taking out the shield and ~5% hull.
Trouble was, my own shields don't recharge anything like that fast so I had to keep the passes short to avoid taking too much damage myself.
I figured I'd try a sustained attack and that nearly knocked out my shield so I knew I wouldn't be able to do that again any time soon.
Which means I'm back to doing the short passes.
And, meanwhile, he keeps on getting his broken shield back on-line within about 5 seconds, and then back up to full strength in another 5 seconds.

I suppose, if you wanted to dig into it, it might be interesting to look at how much a C6 SCB can actually do for a C7 shield too.
I've got a C7 shield on my 'vette and I've got a C7 SCB and (from memory) that barely restores a single ring of the C7 shield.
Presumably, you'd need to use multiple C6 SCBs, one after the other, to completely rechage a C7 shield?
And then there's the issue of the time involved too.
If I'm not mistaken, it should take several seconds for one SCB to discharge - and then you'd have to use another, and another, and another.
What I was seeing was his shields go from one red ring (after my beam attacks) back up to full in about 5 seconds. [where is it]

As you said, it was almost like he had an unusually small shield, which could recharge quickly from an SCB, but it was also somehow strong enough to deflect my weapons.
As if, maybe, it was a C5 shield (dunno what the smallest shield you can fit to an Annie actually is) with 8 boosters bolted on?

 

[Pyrobee]

Have you gone up in combat rank recently? NPC difficulty that interdictes you goes up as you do. Higher ranked NPCs can have engineered shields, will use engineered SCBs and have more effective pip management.

 

[timbero]

Sounds like a Deadly Anaconda to me, them Deadly rank NPCs can be hard as diamonds sometimes.

I don't want to be rude, but I thought NPCs using SCBs was old news?

Sounds like you weren't doing enough damage fast enough, was he outmaneuvering you?

3 potential solutions:

1: Feedback cascade railguns.
2. Higher spike damage loadout.
3. Turrets turrets turrets!

 

[Stealthie]

Sounds like you weren't doing enough damage fast enough, was he outmaneuvering you?

3 potential solutions:

1: Feedback cascade railguns.
2. Higher spike damage loadout.
3. Turrets turrets turrets!

Well, like I said, my Cutter is a trade-ship rather than being a combat ship.

TBH, I go through a cycle of leaving my Cutter unarmed, then I get attacked by small ships and can't deal with them, then I decide to fit guns, then I get into fights with big ships and take damage so I decide I'm going to take all the guns off again so I don't get the urge to fight when I should be running.

He certainly wasn't out-flying me.
Basically, the combat consisted of me manoeuvring into his "blind spots" and then unloading into him until he'd turn and start shooting back so I'd break off and start over again.

Fundamentally, the thing I find puzzling is that if he had a big shield, I just can't see how it could recharge all the way in such a short time.
Even if he had the SCBs to recharge it, it should have been taking at least 30-odd seconds (?) to use enough SCBs to recharge it.
Conversely, if it was small enough that a single SCB could recharge it all the way, it shouldn't have been strong enough to deflect fire from my weapons the way it was.

And then there's the issue of how it came back on-line almost immediately after I did break it.
When I first hit him with my lasers and M/Cs, and I broke his shield, I thought "Right, now I'm gonna gut you like a fish!".
And it just came straight back online.
Back to square one. [where is it]

 

[NecasekO]

SCB use is very visible - there's a pulsating blue glow moving around the ship while a SCB is active. From what you describe it sounds more like a small shield with high resistance.

Also, without a recorded video it's very difficult to estimate times. I find it hard to believe that the shield of an Anaconda would recharge in 5 seconds but it's quite possible it felt like that because of how long it takes for a Cutter to turn around - that's something like 15 seconds for a 180 degree turn.

 

[timbero]

Well, like I said, my Cutter is a trade-ship rather than being a combat ship.

TBH, I go through a cycle of leaving my Cutter unarmed, then I get attacked by small ships and can't deal with them, then I decide to fit guns, then I get into fights with big ships and take damage so I decide I'm going to take all the guns off again so I don't get the urge to fight when I should be running.

He certainly wasn't out-flying me.
Basically, the combat consisted of me manoeuvring into his "blind spots" and then unloading into him until he'd turn and start shooting back so I'd break off and start over again.

Fundamentally, the thing I find puzzling is that if he had a big shield, I just can't see how it could recharge all the way in such a short time.
Even if he had the SCBs to recharge it, it should have been taking at least 30-odd seconds (?) to use enough SCBs to recharge it.
Conversely, if it was small enough that a single SCB could recharge it all the way, it shouldn't have been strong enough to deflect fire from my weapons the way it was.

And then there's the issue of how it came back on-line almost immediately after I did break it.
When I first hit him with my lasers and M/Cs, and I broke his shield, I thought "Right, now I'm gonna gut you like a fish!".
And it just came straight back online.
Back to square one. [where is it]

Maybe he used bi-weave and smart pip management (4 pips to sys = another 60% damage reduction), that combined with you sacrificing damage output for better positioning to avoid taking damage would let him regen quite a bit of his shield. Add SCBs on top of that and you have an annoying opponent.

You have a point in not wanting to take sustained fire with a traders shield, I didn't consider that.

Next time: let the Anaconda show its soft belly to you, put the throttle on full and boost like there's no tomorrow! As you collide you unload all 7 gimballed overcharged double shot frag cannons, 2 glorious explosions will ensue! [noob]

 

[yolomcbobbinz]

The only way to recharge your shields very rapidly is reboot/repair then spam scbs and sinks I don't think npcs reboot, there's so many things broken with them, I want to know what exploits they're using

 

[Valethar]

Bear in mind that NPCs do 'cheat'. A lot. It's built in to compensate for them not having organic brains.

It's also possibly you ended up with a glitchy opponent. Wouldn't be the first time for that either.

 

[Ra'Kaan]

You've got another choice against SCB spamming NPC's ...

RAMMING SPEED!!

I had to resort to this just the other day in my Python vs a deadly conda.

 

[Morbad]

NPCs have used SCBs since Beta 2 or 3 back in October-November 2014.

Many NPC ships run few boosters and have no modifications to their defensive modules, so the collapsed regeneration rate can be quite high relative to shield strength, which means their shields can often combat back up fairly quickly.

I don't think npcs reboot, there's so many things broken with them, I want to know what exploits they're using

NPCs play by exactly the same rules you do, 99% of the time, including shield regeneration.

And yes, NPCs can reboot/repair...though they normally only do this if you shoot out their power plant.

Bear in mind that NPCs do 'cheat'. A lot.

They really don't cheat that much.