Requesting feedback regarding 'part time' players

[Drelthar]

Earn it, snowflake. Like every one else.

But please realize that the game does not fundamentally change when you have one. There is no content you do not already have access to.

Not actually true now.

Multicrew with two crew on board, literally requires the largest most expensive ships in the game to achieve.

Weather multicrew is actually worth it is up to the individual though.

I mean... I kinda like flying my newb buddies around in my gunship, when it works.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

Elite: Dangerous is an incredible game that has an unimaginable scale. The game has a nearly endless amount of possibilities for how you can play the game. There are so many ways for you to go about exploring the galaxy. This is both a good thing and a bad thing.

I am a full time manager on top of being a full time student. I put in about 100 hours per week between the two. This is a lot of work. In between the two, i enjoy sitting down to a nice session of elite.

Lately, though, I've started to desire some of the bigger ships, and the gameplay aspects they introduce. This brings me to my problem. The time required to accomplish sitting in the CMDR seat of these large vessels is enormous. As a 'part time' player, i was under the impression that this was simply something that was out of my reach (which is a poor mechanic, regardless, for a game that's not FTP.) Recently, though, there have been some possibilities that have come up that have promised expediting the process. Of course, as a 'part time' player, i jumped on this. As a person who can really only afford a couple hours per week in the game, who wouldn't?

Now, my problem lies in the fact that these possibilities are consistently being ripped away from us. Instead of promoting the development of their players, your company is intentionally putting up nearly insurmountable roadblocks to obtaining these goals. You take things away from us under the guise of it 'not being intended features'. You take, and say you're giving (in the case of the most recent patch, you've apparently fixed API problems, yet they still exist.)

So here's what i would like to know from a representative of the FDev team. What do you suggest i do to obtain the goal of sitting in a Cutter in an expedient manner, as many of us don't have nearly unlimited hours to pour into this game? This isn't a question I would like side-stepped, or answered in an indirect fashion. This is a question that i want answered directly.

Please realize, not all of your player base has the hours required to pour into the rank grind and credit grind required to sit in the CMDR seat of a Cutter.

The bigger ships do no introduce any new gameplay elements. All they do is give you more armour, more weapons and more shields to do the same stuff that you could do in your smaller ship.

 

[Pville_Piper]

Op, I don't know what your issue is based on the sum of your post. It seems your expectations are not what the game is. I work from home, when I'm home that is. I spend as much as 3 weeks on the road a month. Yet I still progress in the game. You seem to be upset with the latest changes as I was when 2.1 dropped. You see, I had developed my own style of play that got radically changed as more updates came and went. I still found things to do and eventually adapted my gameplay to suit the new reality.

You made a comment "The time required to accomplish sitting in the CMDR seat of these large vessels is enormous"... What was your point? When I played the COD or Battlefield I couldn't have any gun I wanted, some were not only rank locked but, achievement locked as well. You either put the work into getting what you want or you move on.

When I Recently, I decided that I wanted a Corvette. I have found a way to work, not grind, my way up the ranks. I believe I will make rank before my bank account can support my desires... I will work on that issue when it becomes necessary. I would recommend that you do the same. You want a certain ship... Then find a way to work towards your goal. I would recommend you find a variety of things you like to do as it will become a grind if you don't.

Others get all up in arms when someone mentions that maybe you should consider leaving the game. I don't. I bought Battlefield 1, a triple A game that is not cheap. I put about 100 hours into it before I got fed up with the whole shotgun/gas grenade tactic thing. I could compete but why bother? it was the same thing round after round. Not fun in my estimation. Considering I usually put 700 hours into each of the older Battlefield games I don't think I got my monies worth. Too bad. Lesson learned and I moved on.

Another thing to consider... When I started this game over 2 years ago, making a Fer de Lance or and Anaconda in a months time from a new start was absolutely unheard of. Yet now it happens routinely. I know of one commander who did it in a 3 weeks... He lasted another 3 weeks because all he did was combat and couldn't interested in anything else and there was no challenge to the game anymore.

The game wasn't designed for you... Or me. It was designed for many people to do many things. Either find a way to play the game and enjoy it for what it is or don't and move on. Like you I don't like spending my money for a game that I don't like and this isn't a game that the Steam/Origin refund policies will do any good as it takes too long just to figure out to play the game and by that time you've gone way past the refund time. It sucks, yes, but I have gotten really picky about buying games and have figured out what I like and don't like.

As far as suggestions, make em, even if it is off base maybe it will inspire the devs to something else. But remember, they have a vision too. And they are working towards it. And don't be surprised when people point out the error of your ideas, because like you, they have their own ideas about gameplay.

Believe me, rapid ship acquisition would be/is a disaster.

 

[Vorxian]

The bigger ships do no introduce any new gameplay elements. All they do is give you more armour, more weapons and more shields to do the same stuff that you could do in your smaller ship.

QFT

Well you are both out of luck - that isn't how Elite works.

You don't need a big ship to enjoy Elite and I'm not sure sure what content you think you are missing out on by not owning one of the big three. Honestly if time is so short I'd spend more time researching the games you wish to play in the limited free time you have.

There is also mutlicrew if you really, really feel you need to sit on a Corvettes bridge. Accessible to you today providing there is a MC commander out there playing with one. No work required - in fact I'm pretty sure you are the kind of person MC was aimed at to be honest.

I own an Anaconda - took me years to get but I rarely use it to be honest... most of my time is spent in small to mid range ships.

I wasn't hinting at a big ship to enjoy ED. Of all my experience, of all the ships I have available to me, my largest time spent is in an Imperial Clipper, then an ASP a very close second

What I hoped for is content. But right now as Max says, there really isn't any content change between flying a Cobra, or Cutter. The only difference is the size of your cargo, or size of your guns. There is an infinite number of possibilities one could do with such an amazing and diverse of ships, and what one can do with an infinite scope of galaxy space. We have a framework right now, some rooms and furniture, and a cosy fire would be awesome.

 

[Cmdr Lucca1985]

I really wish the moneybags lot would stop acting like their perspective of their game wouldnt change if they didnt have the multitude of rebuys on the cutters or condas or corvettes that they do. Its not as fun when the fruits of all your limited game time can be wiped out by some 10 year old with more time than you.

It discourages repeat play and leaves us scrambling in pve because we didnt "Git gud" like the rest of the uber time lot. Free up some cash for the casuals.

 

[CMDR Harada]

One of the things that makes Ed a great game is that there are no real shortcuts. Sure, you can make a ton with Quince/Ceos/etc.. but credits are half of it. Elite status, or Empire/fed rank are the other.

If you want the big ships.. well... you have to put in the time. I work a lot, I have a family. My time is limited. But 2+ years later I have my big ships ( All 3 ). It took time, patience, and more time.

There is no "Pay to Win" in ED. I heartily approve of that.

 

[CMDR RAY-ZOR'SHARP]

The problem with that, is that this is a form of entertainment that i have paid for, not a separate reality that I live in.

"It's not a game It's a way of life" (from Halt and Catch Fire), as such you do what you can with the your time in hand, as with everything else patience is required, The Cutter is maybe a pain to get because of the rank block, but there are plenty of ships worth getting on that road that will do everything you need, bring your targets much closer and just slowly work your way up.

Good Luck in your pursuits CMDR.

 

[Pville_Piper]

Given that the OP appears not to be trolling, then I wonder, how much in game time do you believe should be required to get a well kitted Cutter?

6 ⁷/[SUB]8[/SUB]... [yesnod]

 

[Jenner]

Trolling accusations are off-topic and will be removed.

Got a problem with a post? think it's trolling? Report it. That's it.

Thank you!

 

[Bomba Luigi]

Well, I mean not every game is designed for everybody. And not every aspect of a game is designed for every player of certain game. Its really not complicated, Developers make certain kind of games but which one from wich developers is for you you have to figure out yourself. Can't everything be tailerod to you.

 

[Ian Skippy]

The problem with that, is that this is a form of entertainment that i have paid for, not a separate reality that I live in.

I sympathize, but you must understand you cant balance a game on an individual basis. Some people will work even more hours than you, some far less. If you get what you want, it will still be too distant for some, and credits become even more meaningless to others.

I really wish the moneybags lot would stop acting like their perspective of their game wouldnt change if they didnt have the multitude of rebuys on the cutters or condas or corvettes that they do. Its not as fun when the fruits of all your limited game time can be wiped out by some 10 year old with more time than you.

That can only happen if you fly without rebuy, which is just an act of stupidity and greed rather than an indication of the balance of the reward system, really.

 

[Brosa]

I'm much in the same situation as op.
Working as an airline pilot I'm away a lot, so playing is limited to when I'm home after kids are in bed.

I bought Elite beta and started to play in summer 2014.

The progress was reasonable in the early stages but for the last year I've been stuck at the Python level.
I have tried to enjoy it and haven't been doing too much grinding. Made it a-rated and upgraded with most engineers.

But from here it seems to take unreasonably too much time to advance to bigger ships, without putting in weeks of grinding only!
And with limited time to play, I don't know if it's worth it.

I have, of course missed all Quince, Rhea and other shortcuts that's been available.

I managed to pull the cash for an Anaconda in about a week's grind, 2-3 hours per day, flying an Asp Explorer for optimal money-making. If you think ~10 to 15 hours of work for an end-game ship is too much, then you have bigger issues. The rank lock for the Vette and Cutter is pretty time-consuming and some would say unfortunate, but it all adds to the sense of accomplishment of having purchased such a ship.

How is that even possible?

If I fit my Python with 280 cargo slots and find a good loop route from eddb.io, I can maybe make 1.4 mcr per roundtrip. Four round trips in an hour gives me 5 millions.

So in order to get 150 million, I would need to grind for 30 hours. Playing a couple of hours a couple of evenings per week, would take me months to get there.
Months of doing boring grinding, instead of enjoying the game, doing different missions, joining with factions, bounty hunting etc.
I have chosen the latter, which is probably one reason that I haven't advanced further. It's a shame Elite isn't rewarding that kind of play enough.

I am a busy man also, fulltime job and 3 kids...

I bought the game on 11.2.2015, Lifetime expansion pass on 2.9.2015...

I played usually about 3 days a week, 2-4 hours in the evening (after kids bedtime).
It took me over a year to get into Anaconda (almost never selling previous ships). It took me another 6 months to sit in a Corvette. I do not yet have rank for Cutter.

How is that even possible?
Any hints would be appreciated.

Create a passenger ship. And haul bottoms all over. Over 3 hours I guess I could earn the guts of 100m with current not bugged missions.
+ Create a trading ship. I have routes that do 2m per 5 minutes = 40m per hour. 120m per 3 hours.

Then you have found something I haven't even been close to.
I have never managed more than 5-6 m per hour from trading. On rare occasions I have been close to that with bounty hunting.

Given that the OP appears not to be trolling, then I wonder, how much in game time do you believe should be required to get a well kitted Cutter?

According to the right side menu I have a total play time of 6 weeks. That's about 1000 hours. Some of that is beta testing of course. Trade rank is Entrepreneur and combat rank is Dangerous.

Don't you think almost 3 years and 1000 hours of varied playing (not grinding) should be sufficient for more than a Python?

 

[ITZC0ATL]

I'm much in the same situation as op.
Working as an airline pilot I'm away a lot, so playing is limited to when I'm home after kids are in bed.

I bought Elite beta and started to play in summer 2014.

The progress was reasonable in the early stages but for the last year I've been stuck at the Python level.
I have tried to enjoy it and haven't been doing too much grinding. Made it a-rated and upgraded with most engineers.

But from here it seems to take unreasonably too much time to advance to bigger ships, without putting in weeks of grinding only!
And with limited time to play, I don't know if it's worth it.

I have, of course missed all Quince, Rhea and other shortcuts that's been available.


How is that even possible?

If I fit my Python with 280 cargo slots and find a good loop route from eddb.io, I can maybe make 1.4 mcr per roundtrip. Four round trips in an hour gives me 5 millions.

So in order to get 150 million, I would need to grind for 30 hours. Playing a couple of hours a couple of evenings per week, would take me months to get there.
Months of doing boring grinding, instead of enjoying the game, doing different missions, joining with factions, bounty hunting etc.
I have chosen the latter, which is probably one reason that I haven't advanced further. It's a shame Elite isn't rewarding that kind of play enough.


How is that even possible?
Any hints would be appreciated.


Then you have found something I haven't even been close to.
I have never managed more than 5-6 m per hour from trading. On rare occasions I have been close to that with bounty hunting.

According to the right side menu I have a total play time of 6 weeks. That's about 1000 hours. Some of that is beta testing of course. Trade rank is Entrepreneur and combat rank is Dangerous.

Don't you think almost 3 years and 1000 hours of varied playing (not grinding) should be sufficient for more than a Python?

Regarding money, the best earner I have at the moment is passenger missions. VIP sightseeing, especially if you can stack a few.

From my home system, where I have good rep with the local faction, I can reliably get missions for 6-9 million CR, that have several stops around the bubble. I initially did them in an Asp Explorer with 35Ly jump range, with multiple passenger cabins so I could stack them. Completing two at once takes me maybe 30-40 minutes round trip, and nets anywhere between 15-18 million CR.

Once I got an Anaconda, I was able to stack 4/5 passenger cabins and make even more. You'd actually be surprised how quickly credits became a (relative) non-issue after that. Plus, I got to see various interesting POIs around the bubble like earth-like worlds and important events in the lore, and gained exploration rank and a few extra credits as well.

(EDIT: I'll also add, the Anaconda I bought was initially exploration spec so quite cheap. It then had no difficulty earning the cash for proper outfitting)

To be fair, making credits didn't "click" with me straight away either. Contrary to what some people say, you can't just aimlessly play the game and end up filthy rich. There's a balance to be struck but when you find it, it's good.

 

[unity100]

It does. The game is as presented. If you don't like the game mechanics as is then you need to look elsewhere. It appears that you want your own personal game as with the rest of the forum.

Irrelevant. Null and void.

This game emulates a future sci-fi galaxy in which there is supposedly a lively environment rife with excitement, danger, opportunity, adventure, politics and treachery.

That's why people come to the game, and that was how it was advertised.

It is NOT a replacement for real life deficiencies of goal-achievement, it is not a template for having a competition to rank players whether they want it or not, it is not an investment-perseverance-reward scheme, it definitely is not a mortgage which you need to diligently work to pay over years and years.

If you are looking for hard work/reward combo, seek it outside the game, in real life, where these things really belong to.

And definitely stop projecting your paradigm into everyone else.

 

[ocflyer]

... As a 'part time' player, i was under the impression that this was simply something that was out of my reach (which is a poor mechanic, regardless, for a game that's not FTP.) ...

School is in session, so there currently are no 'full time' players. Everyone is a 'part time' player. Some people have more part time than others. I guess a Cutter or Corvette is not in the cards for you. But the Ananconda is cheap and is easy to acquire, even for 'part time' players.

 

[Alex Brentnall]

All I can say is welcome to every MMO ever. The currency is time. No getting around it.

 

[Vasco Sapien]

The problem with that, is that this is a form of entertainment that i have paid for, not a separate reality that I live in.

So because of your personal life style choices and your sense of entitlement, The game needs its bar lowered to accommodate you?

People who know Elite have an experiance here that they expect, A deep immersive experiance that requires time to achieve in. This isnt a mobile game.

Other people who have also paid for this game demand more difficulty and depth, not less.

Do you like games like Civilisation? have you sent emails to cid meyers to request the game play from caveman to space flight only take 30 minutes, because you have to study?

Some games take time by design and some do not. If you are not willing to invest the time in a title then it isnt the title for you.

 

[askavir]

If you don't have time to play, then tough luck. Sorry for being blunt, but it is the most obvious truth. Find a game that fits your schedule, instead of trying to ruin it to fit your own. I don't have time to travel all around the world, so I don't, I go on occasional small weekend trips instead. Everyone has to make due with what they have. And so do you.

Let's not make the game's economy even more absurd than it already is because of the ones who have only 15 minutes to play. Find a 15 minute game.

I wonder what is the amount of credits per hour that these people think it would be "reasonable"...

 

[ChiefRedCloud]

I've been retired for several years now (from my military career & my civilian job) and yet I find myself busier than when I worked. Between family and upkeep of our property I am quite busy. So I do not find I can spend hours playing I use to either. But I see nothing wrong with the progression required for ED.

I do believe they could raise the beginners credits a wee bit but I am not apposed to hard work. As for the exploits well I have mixed feelings there. I do recognize that these must be dealt with rationally but as one who has used them a bit I can tell you if, you don't put in the time you don't get the dime. I am no billionaire and it will be quite awhile before I am.

But I will be over a period of time and effort. I own a Python (my laregest ship for trade) but spend most of my time in my Cobra Mk 3. I plan on buying an Andiconda but for trade & exploration. I'm a lousy fighter but enjoy a bit of tip off now and again.

ED is meant chiefly for a slower paced crowd with a bit of "Danerous" thrown in to appeal to the shoot-em-up crowd. So don't dispare over what you don't have now and just set your goals for what you want later. And enjoy your universal trip.

If more would set aside the time they do to be angry, and instead play the game instead, they might enjoy it more. I too find things that aren't quite right with the game. But other than reporting it to Frontier, I see not since in plaguing the forums with it.

But this is me ...

Chief

 

[unity100]

So because of your personal life style choices and your sense of entitlement, The game needs its bar lowered to accommodate you?

People who know Elite have an experiance here that they expect, A deep immersive experiance that requires time to achieve in. This isnt a mobile game.

Other people who have also paid for this game demand more difficulty and depth, not less.

Do you like games like Civilisation? have you sent emails to cid meyers to request the game play from caveman to space flight only take 30 minutes, because you have to study?

Some games take time by design and some do not. If you are not willing to invest the time in a title then it isnt the title for you.

Talk for yourself.

i didnt pay for this game for 'achievement', neither i am in search of 'difficulties to overcome', nor to 'invest time'.

The keywords in your post relevant to why i paid for this game and backed it are immersion, experience, and depth.

It has nothing to do with 'achievement'. Im not achievement-starved to the extent that i would need to seek achievement in computer games and try to have everyone forced into the same gameplay so that i can get my achievement fix.

I paid for this game in order to get an experience of projecting myself into a lively, future sci-fi galaxy in which i can get many adventures and be free to do as i pleased.

I paid for being a han solo. Not for making a second career by investing time and effort to get incremental rewards so i can get a sense of 'achievement' as if it was not a game but a second job.

Every han-soloey stuff i want to do is either gated behind long grind, OR pay ZIT.

In the Elite universe in which entire universe is 'balanced out' through using of game-design spreadsheets which 'uniformize progress', Han Solo would need to do 1000+ trading runs doing crappy profits with a hauler before he could get his millenium falcon and engage in adventures.

He definitely would never get into a deal with jabba the hutt with high risk, huge reward either, because such high risk, high reward juicy deals DONT EXIST in Elite universe. It is far more smoothened-out and incremental than a career in an engineering department in a random company in Soviet Union, with none of the social securities, assurances and lifelong benefits and retirement that goes with it.