"Beyond" free for Horizon owners - LEP musings

[Whitehair]

Back on topic, it would be really nice if someone from the FDev Community Team would pop in here and tell us what's what. Dale and Brett seem to be able to read every thread, so them at least must know about our discussion.

Why?

Nothing has changed. LEP means free updates for the life of the game. That hasn't changed just because one season is to be free.

What is difficult to understand about 'I won't have to pay for any updates for The Lifetime of the Game'?

There would not even be a thread unless someone started to ask if they could get a refund because some other people won't have to pay for the next years updates. Pure idiocy and FUD. (Imho)

 

[WR3ND]

Why?

Nothing has changed. LEP means free updates for the life of the game. That hasn't changed just because one season is to be free.

What is difficult to understand about 'I won't have to pay for any updates for The Lifetime of the Game'?

There would not even be a thread unless someone started to ask if they could get a refund because some other people won't have to pay for the next years updates. Pure idiocy and FUD. (Imho)

Great to know your opinion on the matter. I'm sure it's very helpful and reassuring here.

 

[Whitehair]

Great to know your opinion on the matter. I'm sure it's very helpful and reassuring here.

You are welcome. Stupidity and greed... not so much.

 

[Juniper]

Why?

Nothing has changed. LEP means free updates for the life of the game. That hasn't changed just because one season is to be free.

What is difficult to understand about 'I won't have to pay for any updates for The Lifetime of the Game'?

There would not even be a thread unless someone started to ask if they could get a refund because some other people won't have to pay for the next years updates. Pure idiocy and FUD. (Imho)

I agree. I can't believe it's even a discussion tbh.

During the Kickstarter, when the LEP option was offered, they said the plan was to have free updates and paid expansions. No mention of 'seasons' - that came much later.

If you've bought an LEP, you won't ever have to buy another expansion for E: D. Whether others have to pay or not is utterly irrelevant - you never will.

Presumably at the end of 2018, assuming FD get the game to a state that they're happy with to take to the next level, the next big expansion will cost money.

But not for LEP holders, because... that's what it is. Lifetime Expansion Pass. The clue is very much in the name.

Not even worth FD's response IMO. It's self evident.

 

[babelfisch]

The fundamental issue is with perceptions, we all were under the impression Horizons would just cover a single Season of updates (notionally those labelled 2.x) and fully expected that v3.x, v4.x, and other future hypothetical seasons would each be subject to some form of pay wall. FD of course are well with-in their rights to expand the scope of what is covered by a given "Season" license BUT it is not unreasonable (nor nonsense) to express concern over the potential implications of such scope creep.

I may not share the concerns of some of my fellow LEP owners but I believe I fully appreciate their viewpoint. Disregarding their concerns as nonsense is both foolhardy and disrespectful IMO - even if their concerns are perhaps unwarranted.

I think that expectation is still valid. The next updates will not be 3.0, they are updates between 2.4 and 3.0, which will be a paid expansion again. If there would be no more paid expansions I would absolutely share these concerns and would never disregard it as nonsense. The idea that I call nonsense is that there will never be a paid expansion released for Elite. This would be stupid and financial suicide for the game. Even very successful games like Guild Wars charge for their expansions, a completely free to play without pay to win model doesn't work IMO. This very specific concern is what I call nonsense.

If I would believe that we will never see a paid expansion again I would absolutely agree with the fears expressed in this thread.

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

Back on topic, it would be really nice if someone from the FDev Community Team would pop in here and tell us what's what. Dale and Brett seem to be able to read every thread, so them at least must know about our discussion.

FD usually avoids duplication of already stated things. So far official statement has been that they plan to produce more paid for extensions and current focus is getting existing gameplay fleshed more out and prepare technology behind the game for future.

As this most likely haven't changed, I really wonder what exactly you want to hear from them.

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

You are welcome. Stupidity and greed... not so much.

FGS enough with the troll crap already. Horizons was intimated to be 1 year. It is now going to be 3 minimum. It is NOT greed or stupidity to ask for some official feedback.... Esp when some of the features we are being given are totally from left field whilst other key core features which were outlined are still no where to be seen.

I have no issue at all with FD extending horizons for another year. Refunds for Lep is the last thing I want and I not sure where greed comes in ?.
I do not regret the money I have to given FD I just want to know where FD stand wrt the future of the game. You are not interested and that is perfectly ok but you have no right to insult those who are.
Hell some people are still expecting a paid expansion AS WELL as the above in 2018 ...... It is not my conclusion but the fact some think this means FD were a little unclear.

 

[Khazid]

I m pretty sure if any big updates like legs, atmospheric landings etc is to be released in season 4 for example it will only be free for LEP owners but not anyone else. Hard to justify this season being paid if its mostly core mechanics updates.

 

[Theodrid]

Isn't this a clear case of 'no news is good news' guys? Surely, if something as important and fundamental as this had changed Frontier would say something.

 

[babelfisch]

Things have definitely changed since I bought the lifetime pass two years ago. Elite 1.0 lasted about a year. The second season is apparently going to last at least three years. Critics of concerned lifetime pass holders gleefully tell us there was no official 10 year plan. Fine. But if there was a ten year plan, Horizons takes us 40% of the way through it. That's disconcerting. So, at the rate they're going, I hope the plan is for more than ten years. If it's less than that, I'm doubtful about getting my money's worth.

If I had known Horizons would last at least three years and there was no 10 year plan, I might not have purchased the pass.

All I'm asking is for FD to explain why my concern is unwarranted. Simple reassurance. Nothing unreasonable. Why some players are offended by that is beyond me.

Horizons and Beyond adds way more features than originally hinted at Kickstarter. If everything we got in 3 years would be planetary landings I maybe could agree with your concern. But even then it would still leave 3 years for atmos and legs each. But that's not the case, they added tons of new features and QOL improvements since release and they are going to fix/improve most of them plus the core mechanics in 2018. If they do the same for the next expansions the game would be absolutely brilliant.

 

[starman]

I paid for a Founder status. I was promised that I would be treated with respect and awe why other cmdrs. This is not the case.... Especially by some have inexplicably amassed billions probably in solo/groups.. Comabt logging. Pirate group switching who knows.

There is definitely an imbalance in the force. Anacondas and Corvettes are expensive to run.

 

[babelfisch]

I paid for a Founder status. I was promised that I would be treated with respect and awe why other cmdrs. This is not the case.... Especially by some have inexplicably amassed billions probably in solo/groups.. Comabt logging. Pirate group switching who knows.

There is definitely an imbalance in the force. Anacondas and Corvettes are expensive to run.

People have my respect for helping to fund the game. Not for acting like spoiled brats.

 

[Jex =TE=]

They didn't. It just happened in your imagination because you want to be disappointed or upset. There will be more paid expansions.

In 5 years time.

 

[WR3ND]

People have my respect for helping to fund the game. Not for acting like spoiled brats.

Let's try and stay on topic here and tone down the "opinions of others" and the like.

The LEP I bought into, while it did have the added benefit of funding Frontier and loading up their coffers more, was primarily a purchase of future content, future content that still remains to be seen or even announced in any official capacity.

I personally don't mind waiting, that's one of the reasons I bought into the LEP after all. If others are a bit more concerned with their purchase being fulfilled and honored, then I can't really blame them though either. Season two and beyond are taking quite a bit of time, and more than most of us would have expected, so some might not be sure of where the game is heading and how Frontier plans to take it there. People are only human after all, you know.

 

[Juniper]

In 5 years time.

Potentially just two years.

BUT... the eternal optimist in me says that IF Frontier deliver on what they're promising for 2018 and then some, we should have a pretty awesome base game to play that would slow the appetite for big expansions in the future. At least until they are done right, rather than rushed out the door to satisfy new shiny on top of a weak base game.

Of course, it's a big 'if'...

 

[spriggan72]

A a lifetimer I see the policy of FD good for base ED or Horizon users, but a bit disrespectful for us, still isn't clear what are we going to have for the extra money we paid
I'm pretty sure everybody saying we don't have to complain are no lifetimer....
BTW I guess no LEP howner is looking for a refund, but some communication from FD would be appreciated ... something like
"OK you payd 110 extra € for nothing until now because we changed our developing/licensing plan on the way, but at least we tell you what/when are you getting for the money you paid..."

 

[Jex =TE=]

Potentially just two years.

BUT... the eternal optimist in me says that IF Frontier deliver on what they're promising for 2018 and then some, we should have a pretty awesome base game to play that would slow the appetite for big expansions in the future. At least until they are done right, rather than rushed out the door to satisfy new shiny on top of a weak base game.

Of course, it's a big 'if'...

I don't think that's going to happen. 2.4 isn't even out yet and if anyone thinks a year of coding is going to add the "meat" to the game and they didn't get how long 2.0 took to make then I'm not sure what game we're playing or what information we're seeing.

FDev are either way too slow or have nobody working on ED and given that 2.0 took forever, this "2.4 beyond" is going to take 2 years and then they start work on 3.0 which will likely be 2-3 years but this will be a full release which means it will need bug testing so more likely 3 years (and let's not forget that ED is full of bugs that need fixing ON TOP of the new content they're adding).

If at the end of "2.4 beyond" we have a couple of new shallow features and we still have the bugs, who's going to hang around a few years for 3.0? If you were on the board of directors or a shareholder, would you be comfortable pushing out 3.0 if it was like that?

 

[babelfisch]

A a lifetimer I see the policy of FD good for base ED or Horizon users, but a bit disrespectful for us, still isn't clear what are we going to have for the extra money we paid
I'm pretty sure everybody saying we don't have to complain are no lifetimer....
BTW I guess no LEP howner is looking for a refund, but some communication from FD would be appreciated ... something like
"OK you payd 110 extra € for nothing until now because we changed our developing/licensing plan on the way, but at least we tell you what/when are you getting for the money you paid..."

This would be reasonable if they changed the developing /licensing plan. So far it looks like they didn't. Thee are basically two ways to make money with a game. Via expansions / pay for the product or pay to win. It looks like the game will not be pay to win. Therefore it's pretty clear that they will release more expansions.

 

[Stewart_]

What isnt true?

Elite will be developed as long as it remains a viable product no matter who’s in charge.

hundreds - by which you mean a small loud vocal group.

Actually, that's not true in the slightest.



That update was added after hundreds of people freaked out at "online only" and demanded a proper single player game. FD then promised it. People didn't pull their pledges as a result.

The thing is, E: D will continue to be developed as long as David is alive and at the company. It's his magnum opus.

 

[Juniper]

What isnt true?

That Frontier didn't promise an offline game. They did. It happened. There we are.

Elite will be developed as long as it remains a viable product no matter who’s in charge.

If that were the sole motivation for development, they'd charge for Beyond. The fact they're not doing suggests that this is more than just pure pragmatic capitalism.

hundreds - by which you mean a small loud vocal group.

Who were backing up their objections with a sizeable amount of cash at the time - cash that was needed by FD to make the game.