PvP Aliens are ruining PvP

[Morbad]

What drives you to continue to engage in PvP?

The alternative is either to retreat into a different mode, or having a CMDR that cannot stand up to aggression in Open.

I choose to play this game as an MMO and choose to play a CMDR that can generally go where, and do as, he pleases, despite resistance. Therefore I have to be competent at inter-CMDR combat and my CMDR must be equipped for it. Since I enjoy varied and challenging combat, I don't go out of my way to avoid it, but even if I didn't enjoy it, I'd still need to be decent at it to play the character I envision playing.

IAlthough it is indeed primarily on FD for making PvE and PvP builds so far apart in terms of power and then further exacerbating the divide with tiered engineer mods... a part of the blame still remains on the player that C-logs.

Completely different issues and the responsibility for one does not diminish responsibility for the other.

 

[Kerrash]

You know I would be all for swapping out the modes entirely:

Open > PvP (As is, just rename in place)
Private > PvE (Pilot's federation enforced weapon lock down on members)

IMO. Private groups just fragment the player base.

 

[Martian Successor]

I agree with you that CL is exploit and that it should not be available to use. I guess you can and should report such behaviour...

on other note if someone has a plesure of murdering weaker ships and does not want to have some PVP challenge and only want to send someone to rebuy screen that is a case for some specialist to be perfectly honest.

Fully supporting PvP fighting and proper combat killing (this is why I run if I can or take rebuy screen).

On other hand suicide ramming in station and such cheep tricks just to send someone to a rebuy screen should be addressed too.

The suicide ramming in stations should be a reportable offense in my opinion as it is pretty much a clear cut case of being a weiner. Repeat offences that create enough of a pattern should be as bannable as repeated c-logging.

The player serial killers can be addressed with a proper crime and consequences system imo whereby they can no longer dock in the system they're doing their killing in and ultimately must strike out from Anarchy systems if they wish to live the player killer playstyle.

Completely different issues and the responsibility for one does not diminish responsibility for the other.

In what sense do you mean? That FD's responsibilities diminish the act of C-logging? Or that the disparity between PvE and PvP builds are a different issue from engineer mods?

 

[Martian Successor]

You know I would be all for swapping out the modes entirely:

Open > PvP (As is, just rename in place)
Private > PvE (Pilot's federation enforced weapon lock down on members)

IMO. Private groups just fragment the player base.

I'm not too fussed either way but I will say that Private groups are, or were, meant to be for playing with some friends. To see that go would mean that in the PvE mode we would no longer be able to hold fight clubs, training events and PvP tournaments. Whereas in the PvP mode it would be open to disruption by third parties.

Would it be worth it to see that go?

 

[Morbad]

In what sense do you mean? That FD's responsibilities diminish the act of C-logging? Or that the disparity between PvE and PvP builds are a different issue from engineer mods?

I'm saying that FDev is solely responsible for the mechanisms in their games while players are solely responsible for their own behaviors.

 

[Sysmon]

You know I would be all for swapping out the modes entirely:

Open > PvP (As is, just rename in place)
Private > PvE (Pilot's federation enforced weapon lock down on members)

IMO. Private groups just fragment the player base.

I like the idea of doing away with private groups. I don't like the idea of a PvE mode as it would still fragment the player base. Rather I'd like to see the Pilot's Federation be a bit more onto its members behaviour. That is, have a proper crime and punishment system in place. Two parts to this: Local/regional regulations and responses letting local law enforcement deny docking at stations within their jurisdiction, or even shoot-on-sight. Anarchy systems (and some others) may be free ports in that regard, and the crime status should be flashed as a warning when beginning a jump to a system where one is wanted. The other part is crimes committed against fellow PF members. This would impact insurance payouts (I think that one is actually on its way already), but could also impact other aspects such as what the commander could respawn into.

Finally, it is surprising to me that the Federation and Empire don't demote Commanders that hold rank and commits crimes.

S

 

[Gun Star]

I got to ask. Do you actually pirate these people you are ganking and destroying? Like take their cargo and sell it?

 

[Shinji Ikari]

Don't use Open if you want a fair fight and will C-log.

This can go on forever

Read the terms of the game and realize that menu log is allowed.

 

[Kerrash]

...
They screwed up the already-one-sided game balance royally when they decided AX weapons shouldn't damage player ships.

I can't believe more people aren't up in arms about it, particularly since it seems to be a misguided effort to enforce cooperation among players.

Encourage != Enforce

 

[ALGOMATIC]

I agree that suicide ramming is an exploit that ought to be reportable, but it's worth noting that not all station ramming = suicide. You can ram someone to death in Obsidian Orbital and face no consequences so long as you don't open fire.

I'm not a fan of the restricted docking idea though. There isn't an even enough distribution of anarchy systems to make such a measure anything other than punitive. If there was a well though out network of anarchy systems within the bubble, it would make a lot more sense. To put it in perspective, Zaphod Hawke is a criminal in Eve Online. He can still dock in any station, but the penalties for straying into a high security system can be difficult to deal with. He is instantly being hunted by local security forces, can't cloak, is fair game to anyone who shoots at him, and can't shoot back if anyone attacks. On the other hand, there is an extensive network of systems he can operate from with relative impunity.

We just don't have such a network in ED, although it should be relatively easy to change that.

Agree.

On top of that, trading in general and regular missions in anarchy systems should yield much better pay. Any mission in anarchy should pay at least 5mil if you have good stance with the faction. Same with trading, selling illegal goods should pay ALOT of credits.

 

[Gunnet]

You know I would be all for swapping out the modes entirely:

Open > PvP (As is, just rename in place)
Private > PvE (Pilot's federation enforced weapon lock down on members)

IMO. Private groups just fragment the player base.

I agree that the player base is currently fragmented through private groups, but I don't think groups inherently cause fragmentation. If we had an open PvE mode alongside open PvP, the number of players in private groups (and probably solo) would plummet as players who are there to avoid griefing moved into open PvE. Private groups should be able to be left in place for people who just want to play with a group of friends (and for things like tournaments) without having a significant effect on the population of the open modes.

Although for the sake of maximising the chance of encountering other players, my preference would be leaving open as the one public mode and adding a PvP flag. It's a huge game world populated by a relatively small number of players (as MMOs go), so the fewer unnecessary divides between people the better.

 

[Fendalton]

I think you must be in the wrong sub-forum, pal.

Anyway, I finally got a good fight!

After several combat logs, one bad dude in a Corvette stayed to fight, even though he was primarily fit for Thargoid combat.

Got my FDL down to 56%, but low waked when I broke his shields.

That's how the game is supposed to be played.

Well done CMDR. Wherever you are. [up]

So you're saying your only good PvP fights are with people who aren't even geared for PvP? i.e. Thargoid loadouts? i.e. when they have x4 weapons that can't even hurt players? (based on the knowledge that AX weapons do no damage to other players)

Lmao.

 

[ALGOMATIC]

I agree that the player base is currently fragmented through private groups, but I don't think groups inherently cause fragmentation. If we had an open PvE mode alongside open PvP, the number of players in private groups (and probably solo) would plummet as players who are there to avoid griefing moved into open PvE. Private groups should be able to be left in place for people who just want to play with a group of friends (and for things like tournaments) without having a significant effect on the population of the open modes.

Although for the sake of maximising the chance of encountering other players, my preference would be leaving open as the one public mode and adding a PvP flag. It's a huge game world populated by a relatively small number of players (as MMOs go), so the fewer unnecessary divides between people the better.

I never understood the point of pve only mode. You are being shot at by npcs anyway, so what is the difference? Cmdrs shooting at you are a bit more skilled than NPCs, I dont see any other reason.
So you only want to be shot at by dumbed down entities is that it?

 

[Fendalton]

I never understood the point of pve only mode. You are being shot at by npcs anyway, so what is the difference? Cmdrs shooting at you are a bit more skilled than NPCs, I dont see any other reason.
So you only want to be shot at by dumbed down entities is that it?

The same reason that World of Warcraft has PvP and PvE servers, although you can't play to 110 in PvE then log into a PvP server. It just puts people who prefer to play that way together.

Although the PvE servers can still PvP if you '/pvp on' from memory, or if you're defending home cities like Stormwind or if you go into a PvP conflict zone (like the conflict zones in Elite)

 

[Gun Star]

I never understood the point of pve only mode. You are being shot at by npcs anyway, so what is the difference? Cmdrs shooting at you are a bit more skilled than NPCs, I dont see any other reason.
So you only want to be shot at by dumbed down entities is that it?

No people dont like being ganked by god roll engineered CMDR's with a need to itch their VG Sadism. There are reason why some PG's were created. You know so people can play the game without giving the satisfaction to CMDR's that just want to run around murdering people.

 

[Kerrash]

... I haven't seen a player wing outfitted for Thargoid combat since the first days of AX weapon availability...

It's a shame because I feel that was one of the goals. But all the will in the world can't make the player base interact in a way they do not want to.

... my preference would be leaving open as the one public mode and adding a PvP flag. It's a huge game world populated by a relatively small number of players (as MMOs go), so the fewer unnecessary divides between people the better.

You know what, I take back my previous post, it was incredibly naive.
Some kind of in game flag, much like "Report crimes", would make much more sense.

 

[Tadeus72]

Pvp flags are always abused wherever they are used. There are dozens of ways you can use a non-pvp-flag ship to help your pvp-flag-on buddies or just troll people and ruin their day. And you are practically immortal doing it. It's a bad old design.

 

[Fendalton]

No people dont like being ganked by god roll engineered CMDR's with a need to itch their VG Sadism. There are reason why some PG's were created. You know so people can play the game without giving the satisfaction to CMDR's that just want to run around murdering people.

But if everyone was in the same instance, you would find that the PvE players would FAR outweigh the PvP players.

 

[Kerrash]

But if everyone was in the same instance, you would find that the PvE players would FAR outweigh the PvP players.

Well at least bubbling together players would be easier being a binary option

 

[Morbad]

Pvp flags are always abused wherever they are used. There are dozens of ways you can use a non-pvp-flag ship to help your pvp-flag-on buddies or just troll people and ruin their day. And you are practically immortal doing it. It's a bad old design.

I don't like PvP/PvE flags either and this is a valid complain. However, it's not my main issue with it.

The flags are just as much of an unnecessary and arbitrary divide as separate modes, and they further emphasize the separation between CMDR and NPC.

If anything, I'd simply go back to the idea of not having CMDRs and NPCs look any different on sensors.

But if everyone was in the same instance, you would find that the PvE players would FAR outweigh the PvP players.

Without organization, and with inferior vessels, PvE ships are just fodder, even in what should be overwhelming numbers, even against builds as silly as a Corvette with only 600MJ of shields...

[video=youtube;4tI5prDuvZw]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4tI5prDuvZw[/video]

It's like dropping a piranha in a bait bucket.