If your goal is big 3 then yes.
But that's already talked on other threads.
I personally believe flying big ship should be a status of good and experienced Elite player.
I do agree on the sstatus thing ...but as it is now... just go have some LOVEly time with some space rocks for a month non-stop and get the big ship no problem!
...yaaaaaayy soo much experience.. so much skill...
But that's how some people choose to engage with game. In real life some people would grind for money to get Lamborghini or Ferrari too. And that's fine. That's their choice. No one really forced them to do so, they choose their path themselves (and yes, I wouldn't mind to drive Lamborghini at least once in my life too).
I could grind for Anaconda, but frankly it is a huge ship which I will be too nervous to fly. I am really surprised it is sort of go to ship for many players despite it clearly not being best for anything.
These "grind" arguments need to stop already.
You can get up to 250k bounty reward for shooting a single ship, even more with powerplay bonus.
You can do the road to riches and earn 30mil within 1.5 hours, then upgrade to an aspX and do it some more for even faster earnings. You should be sitting at 300mil within 10 hours. That's hardly a grind, is it?
Take part for the lowest payout tiers in community goals, a one time delivery is done with no effort at all, you can do this for all current CGs that aren't mutually exclusive.
It's so easy nowadays to sit in an anaconda within 2 weeks of playing with 2-3 hours/day at most.
That's not more than 35-40 hours.
What other multiplayer game allows players to reach endgame content in that timespan?
You can get up to 250k bounty reward for shooting a single ship, even more with powerplay bonus.
You can do the road to riches and earn 30mil within 1.5 hours, then upgrade to an aspX and do it some more for even faster earnings. You should be sitting at 300mil within 10 hours. That's hardly a grind, is it?
Take part for the lowest payout tiers in community goals, a one time delivery is done with no effort at all, you can do this for all current CGs that aren't mutually exclusive.
It's so easy nowadays to sit in an anaconda within 2 weeks of playing with 2-3 hours/day at most.
That's not more than 35-40 hours.
What other multiplayer game allows players to reach endgame content in that timespan?
The only thing in the video that makes sense is that there isn't any skill based progression, everything is based on endless repetition of trivial tasks. I agree that progression needs skill, and some aspects of the game should be less grindy like military ranking or gathering materials. I would also make outfitting far less expensive than it is now, while keeping the ships themselves expensive.
However, most of the youtuber's suggestions and alternatives are completely moronic...
So we would get new ships not buy purchasing them with in-game money, but by “killing an anaconda while flying a vulture” and so on… What the frak?!
So getting ships would work like steam achievements and similar crap?
Also loved at how he speaks like some game design illuminati while at the same hinting at things like “why not getting ships and modules for free?…”, and speaking of exploits as a "good thing for the game". Yeah, top game design here lol, it's a wonder he doesn't work at CD Projekt Red...
As for skill for measuring progression over just simple repetition or trivial taks over time, yes I agree, skill should count maybe by having better paying missions that were actually difficult (which has never been the case), however the moan and whine would be exquisite in that case… The vast majority of the “thing X is too hard!!” threads come from players using large ships, the salt would flow in streams if they would now be stuck in haulers and adders because of the skill-only based progression system…
However, most of the youtuber's suggestions and alternatives are completely moronic...
So we would get new ships not buy purchasing them with in-game money, but by “killing an anaconda while flying a vulture” and so on… What the frak?!
So getting ships would work like steam achievements and similar crap? Also loved at how he speaks like some game design illuminati while at the same hinting at things like “why not getting ships and modules for free?…”, and speaking of exploits as a "good thing for the game". Yeah, top game design here lol, it's a wonder he doesn't work at CD Projekt Red...
As for skill for measuring progression over just simple repetition or trivial taks over time, yes I agree, skill should count maybe by having better paying missions that were actually difficult (which has never been the case), however the moan and whine would be exquisite in that case… The vast majority of the “thing X is too hard!!” threads come from players using large ships, the salt would flow in streams if they would now be stuck in haulers and adders because of the skill-only based progression system…
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This represents a fundamental flaw in Elite's game design, IMO.
Ships are gated by rank, but there is no skill required to attain those ranks, only repetition over a timespan. Just like with the Pilot Federation ranks up to Elite, Naval ranks don't require any special skills or knowledge for players to attain. There are no tests to pass. No achievements to attain. Just do the same things over and over until you make a certain counter reach a certain value. Some people will piddle their way up the ladder, incrementing that counter here and there without paying much attention to it, until they look at their stats and notice "oh hey, I finally made Rank and can get that ship. Yay!"
Others will set that ship as their goal and use every method possible to increment that counter as fast as possible, taking any shortcut they can.
But in either case, it's all about making a number. Or two numbers, actually: one in rank, the other in credit.
I agree with those that say the big ships should be the hallmark of an experienced player, but Elite's design doesn't allow for it. Elite ranking, both Pilot and Naval, should have been constructed from the start to require actual skill and experience, but they don't. You don't have to engage in brilliant trade strategy to become an Elite Trader. You don't have to become an ace fighter to become Elite in Combat. You don't have to discover anything new or venture to distant galaxies or even leave the bubble to become an Elite Explorer.
And you don't have to do anything except haul performance enhancers or donate lots of credits to become a King or Vice Admiral or whatever they are and "earn" the right to buy a big ship, befitting the responsibility, knowledge or skill of someone "entitled" to those ships. Whether or not you see it as a grind or choose to make it a grind it doesn't matter. How fast you do it doesn't matter.
It's just about making counters go up. It will never be more or less interesting than that unless FDev decides to change it.
Ships are gated by rank, but there is no skill required to attain those ranks, only repetition over a timespan. Just like with the Pilot Federation ranks up to Elite, Naval ranks don't require any special skills or knowledge for players to attain. There are no tests to pass. No achievements to attain. Just do the same things over and over until you make a certain counter reach a certain value. Some people will piddle their way up the ladder, incrementing that counter here and there without paying much attention to it, until they look at their stats and notice "oh hey, I finally made Rank and can get that ship. Yay!"
Others will set that ship as their goal and use every method possible to increment that counter as fast as possible, taking any shortcut they can.
But in either case, it's all about making a number. Or two numbers, actually: one in rank, the other in credit.
I agree with those that say the big ships should be the hallmark of an experienced player, but Elite's design doesn't allow for it. Elite ranking, both Pilot and Naval, should have been constructed from the start to require actual skill and experience, but they don't. You don't have to engage in brilliant trade strategy to become an Elite Trader. You don't have to become an ace fighter to become Elite in Combat. You don't have to discover anything new or venture to distant galaxies or even leave the bubble to become an Elite Explorer.
And you don't have to do anything except haul performance enhancers or donate lots of credits to become a King or Vice Admiral or whatever they are and "earn" the right to buy a big ship, befitting the responsibility, knowledge or skill of someone "entitled" to those ships. Whether or not you see it as a grind or choose to make it a grind it doesn't matter. How fast you do it doesn't matter.
It's just about making counters go up. It will never be more or less interesting than that unless FDev decides to change it.
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Basically FD is inviting flows of salt because they allow people to grind their ships. It is however consistent with their open approach. You can have Anaconda, but if you can't fly it and if you obsess with having teh best optimal module set, you will have hard time to supporting it due of costs. Similar to exploring galaxy - if FD would have went with awesome sounding hyperpath discovery people would have given up on exploring.
ED is asking for certain buy in but if you don't try to do that that's fine but game then just won't work fully for you.
This game is about grinding only so... If not for ships we grind for engineers... If not for engineers we grind for CG's... If not for CG's we grind for reputation for permit and so on untill death. In every system same fkn tasks for different factions and powers -really?!
ED is more grinder than regular mmorpg. I even think Black Desert Online is less grinding than ED. BUt there we have player guilds and real pvp between them, so grind for gear there is worth the time...
BONUS: Now I have to fly seven times for Kongga Ale to unlock fkn Lori Jameson. But to be abble to fly to her I've been grinding Elite rank for Shinrarta system permit, but first I've been grinding other engineer to even got invitation from her. Fkn ridiculous!
People are saying they have >2000 hours played in ED -No, really?! How is that happened...
ED is more grinder than regular mmorpg. I even think Black Desert Online is less grinding than ED. BUt there we have player guilds and real pvp between them, so grind for gear there is worth the time...
BONUS: Now I have to fly seven times for Kongga Ale to unlock fkn Lori Jameson. But to be abble to fly to her I've been grinding Elite rank for Shinrarta system permit, but first I've been grinding other engineer to even got invitation from her. Fkn ridiculous!
People are saying they have >2000 hours played in ED -No, really?! How is that happened...
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It is design that keeps ED approachable for casual players unfortunately. FD is damned if they do, and damned if they don't.
Although to be fair if you engage in game fully and don't rush for ships your skill grows organically. So it basically all comes down to player choice.
"Do you think people would flock to these money-trains if there was no big need for money?"
1. Absolutely, yes. Players always flock to the easy, rewarding route, even if its utterly boring and ruins the game.
2. If there was no big need for money, the main reward mechanism in the game, then that would be an indication that the game is broken. People should always want more money.
But I'd like to see more of a risk/reward thing going on - you should be able to get a ton of money through skillful, dangerous activities. Elite seems to more often end up offering higher rewards for the low risk repetitive stuff - and since people always flock to the easy, rewarding route this leads to boring grinding, rather than having fun.
1. Absolutely, yes. Players always flock to the easy, rewarding route, even if its utterly boring and ruins the game.
2. If there was no big need for money, the main reward mechanism in the game, then that would be an indication that the game is broken. People should always want more money.
But I'd like to see more of a risk/reward thing going on - you should be able to get a ton of money through skillful, dangerous activities. Elite seems to more often end up offering higher rewards for the low risk repetitive stuff - and since people always flock to the easy, rewarding route this leads to boring grinding, rather than having fun.
I can see both sides of it.
Having never really used exploits, myself (and not because I'm above it, they just usually get nerfed before I find out about them), I can totally understand why people take "shortcuts". I'd rather be out bounty hunting, but trading pays better, and outfitting an Anaconda & Cutter is expensive. That being said, if everything was handed to me right away I'm not sure I'd appreciate what I have (which isn't much) or even play the game often.
Having never really used exploits, myself (and not because I'm above it, they just usually get nerfed before I find out about them), I can totally understand why people take "shortcuts". I'd rather be out bounty hunting, but trading pays better, and outfitting an Anaconda & Cutter is expensive. That being said, if everything was handed to me right away I'm not sure I'd appreciate what I have (which isn't much) or even play the game often.
BONUS: Now I have to fly seven times for Kongga Ale to unlock fkn Lori Jameson. But to be abble to fly to her I've been grinding Elite rank for Shinrarta system permit, but first I've been grinding other engineer to even got invitation from her. Fkn ridiculous!
People are saying they have >2000 hours played in ED -No, really?! How is that happened...
Yep a true mystery!
Do you think everyone should have everything within 40 hours? Cos that's the alternative. Choose your evil.
It;s not a progression system that's needed, that's already in place, whether you think it's too slow or not, the problem is the lack of fun, that's why things feel like a grind. Nerfing mission board exploits has nothing to do with it.
It;s not a progression system that's needed, that's already in place, whether you think it's too slow or not, the problem is the lack of fun, that's why things feel like a grind. Nerfing mission board exploits has nothing to do with it.
The conda isn’t the best at anything, but it’s GOOD at everything if you outfit it proper.
That’s the definition of a multi-role, just like the cobra and python.
My take is that there is enough grind in this game with the rank progression and engineering. Credits/money doesn’t need to be yet another one.
Was Quince and Rhea too much? Hells Yes. But the new mission system is a little too low, and there is too little variety in what to do to make money (passengers). It’s not profitable to smuggle or become a drugs dealer. Piracy should be big easy credits with a huge downside when the police catch you.
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Really, if you just go out and enjoy playing the game, the rest will come to you and it wont be a grind. Sure, you cant get it in short order that way but getting it is far more enjoyable. Its taken me since its public release to actually be able to get the big ships. Im working on the Corvette casually. It will be here soon enough but it probably wont be my main ship. Actually, I dont have a main ship. I fly the ship that I built for that specific task. That means I fly them all now and then. I have a few.
Bob Lighthouse
Banned
I'm on PS4 and will have the Corvette in a day or two.
I already have a Cutter and Anaconda, not to mention a dozen other ships.
No exploits here, just playing the game.
I don't get these posts at all.
I already have a Cutter and Anaconda, not to mention a dozen other ships.
No exploits here, just playing the game.
I don't get these posts at all.
Really, if you just go out and enjoy playing the game, the rest will come to you and it wont be a grind. Sure, you cant get it in short order that way but getting it is far more enjoyable. Its taken me since its public release to actually be able to get the big ships. Im working on the Corvette casually. It will be here soon enough but it probably wont be my main ship. Actually, I dont have a main ship. I fly the ship that I built for that specific task. That means I fly them all now and then. I have a few.
I'm currently grinding Federation Rank in Sothis/Ceos in order to get the Corvette. I've been at this for three total days, averaging three ranks per day.
I started this grind as Midshipman Rank. I am now Post Commander. (Just got the rank a few hours ago.)
On average, it takes me one full trip from Sothis Mining to the Ceos station in order to gain 10% of my rank bar. That's 20 Data delivery missions.
So, from rank 1 to 12, it would take a total of 2400 Data Delivery missions. That math does not include the fact that each rank ramps up the requirements by about 1.5%.
I have played since game-launch. I have a total of over 700 Hours. I should not have to dedicate DAYS of time on top of what I've already done to do nothing but TENS OF HOURS of data delivery missions in order to reach my dream ship.
It will be another day or so before I hit my goal. Due to my experience with how hellish this grind is, I will not be going after the cutter. I doubt I'll even touch missions at all for quite some time.
This makes me fear for the future of Elite. I love this game. I'd honestly argue that it's my favorite game of all time. (Megaman X being a close second.) I don't want anything to happen to this game. I want it to last decades. That won't happen unless FDev takes a serious look at the reward structure.
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That doesn't make things rare. It never has. It never will. All it does in encourage engaging the game in the worst ways.
Unfortunately that doesn't work for 2 of the big 3. They're tied to rank which is tied to missions. Skill is a wholly irrelevant factor to earning them.
Want to go exploring as a primary focus and work towards a cutter at the same time? Too bad.
Spent several hours shooting pirates at a bounty hunting CG? No progress towards that corvette.
Trading loop between stations? Nada.
Fighting for your faction in a CZ? Hope the stations are popping massacre missions regularly, otherwise it's wasted.
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