Two wrongs do not make a right, and before you pursue an agenda of revenge you had better dig two graves - one for you, the other for your target.
Xeno Ally nameplate??
- Thread starter DukeIronHand
- Start date
Goose4291
Banned
True, but as per my earlier post, we all know that isnt going to happen sadly...
Lets try this again.
If one place is building weapons that has a chance of defeating you, but no-one else is where do you hit first?
If you head stright to the escape pod they follow you and get very mad if you start picking in it up in an instant.
But also if you are out of their range if they catch you picking them up they get agro on you.
One started fighting me when I was already 3 km out.
Anyway it is interesting.
So far I saw them picking up
occupied escape pods and damaged occupied escape pods
and nothing much else. I can be wrong with the damaged ones.
So my quick conclusion is along the line that they maybe Need something biologic/organic that is dead. Can be they can't differ between stasis in escape pod and a dead meat?
I picked up foodcartriges, biowast, scrap, synthetic meat and droped them in front of them. They scaned them but didn't pick them up.
Haven't tried animal meat because I couldn't find that in the pleadians.
I am active batteling them since a time..or well try it...not too successful yet.
Got hyperdicted twice while I countered the disabeling field the one time (there were 4 thargoid ships!) I failed on the second hyperdiction (2 Thargoids).
Thought that they will kill me after disabeling me ..it was right after an intense battle.. but nope....
I think we need a list of all the canister they are interested in and pick up and what they do not pick up. Could be interesting.
They've been searching the wreckage of ships they trashed for escape pods - normal and damaged - since the day they became interactive. Heck, I captured a video of it on day 1.
So far, they want: Escape pods (all kinds), Imperial Slaves, Slaves, and Meta-Alloys. I have not given them anything, but several commanders have documented how they aggressively scoop up units of Imp. Slaves/Slaves when jettisoned. Same with Meta-Alloys. If you jettison enough, they call in more ships to harvest faster.
They get hostile if you have Meta Alloys on board and you don't eject them and back off. They get really hostile if you have Guardian relics onboard; if you jettison these relics, they will destroy them.
They are ignoring everything else.
Yep, they're peaceful alright.
The Thargoids could consume the entire bubble and people would still say it's humanity fault.Yep, they're peaceful alright.
One question that's never been answered ... If Aegis is so bad, why wasn't a Mycoid Torpedo the FIRST weapon they developed? That's the one weapon we really need to ensure peace in the galaxy.
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One problem with Bio-weapons, they are not 100% reliable. Survivors from them typically have natural immunities, or access to antigens. Further more, WMDs of any sort should be treated as weapons of last resort or do people need to be reminded of the fundamental principles behind the Cold War between NATO and the Warsaw Pact - Mutually Assured Destruction.
WRT the Thargoids - If they can destroy station power plants, they could have totally destroyed the station leaving no survivors. Instead they restrained themselves somewhat - consider it a kick in the proverbial nether regions and a get off my lawn warning. Afterall, they did not attack Achenar, Sol, nor Alioth - the natural targets for a first strike intent on annihilation (or subjugation).
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Since they're not exctinct despite the INRAEGIS butchers best efforts, it is obvious the bugs have developed some sort of vaccine / defense vs the infamous mycoid virus.
The principle if mutually assured destruction requires mutual destruction be possible. If, as you say, the Thargoids are so powerful they could easily destroy us, then we should be working as fast as possible to make sure that we can return the favor.
What your suggesting would be as if the 1940s Soviets just said, "well, the Americans have a bomb that could destroy us but they haven't destroyed us yet, therefore, they must be peaceful so we don't need to create our own bombs."
This would be more interesting if the foe/ally status was revealed by scanner. If another CMDR has a Xeno Ally nameplate, I can't see any indication of that other than visually, correct?
Not quite, my reference was if humans attempt to annihilate the current Thargoids without considering why they are attacking in the first place then we lose any right to the moral high ground - so far, this seems to be more a territorial dispute than anything else.
As I said earlier, their claim to Pleiades is stronger than ours - IF they had attacked well-established stations that had not been directly involved with factions openly hostile to the Thargoids then that would be another matter entirely. Even then they appear to have shown restraint.
Others have seen the points I have been getting at but you are obviously completely blind to them. Attitudes like yours (seemingly based on this discussion) are what drives the mentalities of certain notorious dictators in human history and it has rarely ended well for them.
There is a difference between developing defences and escalating aggression - the Nuclear Arms Race was more the latter than the former.
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+1
By their careless attacks, some CMDRs have now escalated a conflict they know nothing about to the point of no return, just because they could. These pewpewnagers had their fun murdering with sometimes 12+ ships ... isolated bugs ships. At this point, the whole human bubble is at risk, while INRAEGIS is banking billion of credits selling AX weapons, condemning billion human beings to death once xenowar is in full swing.
Even Arissa cougar Duval and Edmund simpleton Mahon condemn INRAEGIS and they're not exactly peace loving hippies.
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You're basing all this on 21st century technology invented by humans. Please see all the records we've obtained from the Guardians, who used bioweapons as their FIRST choice with great success (long before their final civil war).
They eventually moved on to create bioconstructs (humanity apparently also has these in 3303, as featured in the EDRPG in detail, but directly mentioned by Ram Tah), and automated ships and soldiers (most likely organic, due to their biotech proficiency and dislike for inorganic tech). I still say all the evidence points to the Thargoids being the left over weapon systems from the Guardian civil war. This would help explain why Guardian society is understandable by us, but the Thargoids are so alien. You're hoping to negotiate with (organic) Skynet.
There are only 3 interstellar races that have been in our galaxy by the time of 3303. The Guardians, who warred among themselves, used bioweapons extensively, and wiped themselves out. The Thargoids, which have been fighting a factional war among themselves for who knows how long, have a hive mind, and not much discernible culture. Finally, you have humanity.
Perhaps peace is possible, but you're being naive if you're painting humanity as the bad guys and the only ones who fight and commit atrocities. The Guardians wiped themselves out in a civil war! The Thargoids are fighting each other (2 factions), and the "good" faction hopes to use us as a bullet shield from the bad faction! But yep, humanity is the bad guys here...
As for why they left the stations intact: maybe to test how we would respond? Maybe they wanted to cripple the station, instead of destroy it, so they could capture as many people as possible? Maybe there is some captured Thargoid tech on board they still want back and didn't want to destroy it (hoping to come back later and grab it)? We still don't understand them. But they understand us - they've had human collaborators working with them before.
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Please note what Arissa said, though. She specifically condemned INRA's betrayal of Jameson after he delivered the Mycoid virus. The rest she just implied was troubling.
Also, I still have yet to fire a single shot against the Thargoids. I have, however, rescued (on day 1) 6 escape pods from two different wreckages sites and high tailed it out before the Thargoid could open fire (in both cases it was just Red and angry). Today I've rescued 808 people from Titan station with my Cutter, and plan on rescuing more soon.
I'm on the anti-Thargoid side because of all the evidence I've seen in game and from the books.
Also, I hate to break it to you, but the bubble is at risk whether we pew pew or not. The club hasn't been engineering this fleet build up between the Empire and Feds for over a hundred years, as well as planning 3 separate escape routes, just because they think the Thargoids might be a threat. They know the Thargoids are coming (Osresrians, being chased by Klaxians) and they're going to cut a swathe right through our space.
Goose4291
Banned
Insulting players for blowing up pixels that arent even owned by another player.
This 'community' really is the gift that keeps giving.
Not totally, there have been numerous cases in Sci-Fi of bioweapons being mostly effective but with some of the targets surviving due to apparent natural immunity or developing a counter-measure for it. If any of the current Thargoids have data from the first WMD deployment against them then they have had more than enough chance to either become immune OR to develop an effective counter-measure.
Then there is the morality point you have skill fully ignored but have proved my point for me wrt the M.A.D. principle by referencing the Guardians effectively killing themselves off by using WMDs.
The use of any WMD is tantamount to committing a war crime, especially if the intent is mass genocide like some seem to be advocating. Just see the terms of the Geneva Convention. The nature of WMDs means collateral damage is largely inevitable as they do not distinguish between hostiles and neutral parties by their fundamental nature.
Where the Thargoids are concerned, there seems to be more than a computer based intelligence at work. They seem to be a form of sentient life as opposed to mere weapons with some advanced logic circuits. Even then advanced logic circuits could result in sentience theoretically over time (especially in a Sci-Fi setting).
We do not actually know the reasons for the attacks, but so far they have been constrained to Pleiades - and perhaps we were wrong to assume we have any right to claim territory there given the Thargoids seem to have been there first - c/f Barnacles.
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Not insulting, pointing out a flaw in their logic.
I do not believe any of us are actually saying we should roll over and play dead, but some do seem to be intent on creating chaos and havoc - something which benefits no-one in the long run, except any nihilists perhaps.
Some have compared the proposition of abandoning the Pleiades region as being akin to appeasing tyrants, but assuming that we have any inalienable right to the region is tantamount to being a tyrant. Human history is littered with cases of one culture subjugating another on our own planet because the subjugator believes they have a right to something the other culture effectively has a stronger claim too.
There is a stark difference between us defending ourselves and pursuing an unjustified agenda of expansion. The main reason that we seemingly expanded into the Pleiades region was because of the barnacles which apparently are owned by the Thargoids (or perhaps could even be a form of Thargoid).
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They did more than that. They've also made themselves immune to all our normal weapons and made every bit of their technology corrosive to ours (almost like their version of the mycoid virus).
I didn't ignore it. I just don't find it the most relevant tangent. First, there is a difference between morality and law. The Geneva Coventions used the former to make the latter; that's also for all future conflicts. It arose out of the weapons used during WWI.
Second, the Guardians didn't wipe themselves out with WMDs. They used simple bioweapons like virus and other pathogens as WMDs throughout their history (while never developing nuclear/explosive WMDs. They were wiped out by their automated soldiers/ships wiping out both sides... nearly. There were a few survivors that could no longer breed; they couldn't fix that with a biological solution, so they let themselves die out.
Yeah, Skynet and the Cylons were both sentient, not much hope there. The more appropriate analogy is the Thargoids are like the Jemhedar after the Founders wiped themselves out; doesn't look to good there either.
These specific attacks, no. Overall? Yes, providing you've read the official ED books, some of which were written by the official lore writers for this game. If you had, you wouldn't be arguing about morality. The best we can hope for is to hurt them so hard they turn around and flee. They don't make trust worthy partners, don't see us as even remotely equal, and are extremely hostile toward us. So far, we're still only seeing the advanced scouts. We may never see the full scale invasion in the game.
Now I'm going to go back to rescuing survivors. Current total of souls saved (maritime sense) is 1384 at Oracle. I'm going to keep doing runs in my Cutter (144 at a time) until I've maxed all factions and then move on to the next damaged station.
Btw, anyone needing Bromelite for that one Engineer? You occasionally get some as part of the mission rewards. Also getting a LOT of MEF, Exq. Focuse Crystals, Biotech Conductors, and CIF. Bleh. I have to keep chucking it. Slowing down the rescue effort.
Most of the CMDRs sale them as slaves. For all we know, the Goids are saving those poor guys !
Haha yeah sure. Let me guess, they took out The Oracle and Titan's Daughter because their advanced Thargie sensors detected potentially catastrophic flaws within the station's reactor vessels, they were trying to save us when they blew them up!
At the risk of breaking people's immersion, if Fdev intended for there to be some alternative to pew-pew with the Thargoids, it's up to them to drop some hints as to what that alternative might be.
And then there's the issue of return on investment.
To be blunt, if FDev give people 2 choices, it pretty-much guarantees that half their work will never see the light of day.
Usually, the best a dev' can hope for is to create the illusion of choice while still ensuring that players end up doing the stuff they're "supposed" to do.
Let's face it, though; do we really think that FDev will have gone to the effort of creating "peaceful co-existence with the Thargoids" content, given the likelihood that everybody playing the game would whatever was required to allow it to happen... even after the only assets we've been provided with are weapons?