Friendly fire. Totally stupid.

operant

O
Hessfire said:
Actually they are, it's called Regeneration Sequence.
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I have one of those, but thought it only worked on wingmen - not 'innocent' npcs. But then again the other firing in anger at the same time is normal.
I will try again - with a little trepidation.
 

Magnum62666

M
fully supporting what you said, 9 year years of service in the army myself. Why some people cant rationalize that all actions have consequences that must be fully considered before doing is beyond me. And then it .s me off because they come complain hoping things change for them at the expense of others who can follow and understand the rules and regs.
 

Phisto Sobanii

Phisto Sobanii
wesmacdon said:
Really. What terrible advice. Of course 'don't shoot police' will prevent you getting a bounty. But that doesn't mean the devs should consider a commensurate response when it does happen. As they apparently have in beyond.
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'Watch your fire' is terrible advice? Ok. Cool. Guess it doesn't matter that utterly and totally prevents friendly fire incidents as the game exists right now.

That said, I am fine with FDEV easing the friendly fire mechanic in 3.0 if only so we can swing the Git Gud Hammer even harder on these types of bonkers threads.

EDIT: I'm the guy yelling here. :D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hLpgxry542M

This is a weapon of mass destruction! You are not a cowboy shooting from the hip!
 
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Crank Larson

Crank Larson
operant said:
I have one of those, but thought it only worked on wingmen - not 'innocent' npcs. But then again the other firing in anger at the same time is normal.
I will try again - with a little trepidation.
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It does only work on wingmen. The lasers will damage anything else. There isn't an equivalent of smart rounds for lasers as far as I am aware.
 

Iskariot

Iskariot
operant said:
Good for you.
And thanks for sharing.
Guess we should all follow your sterling example.
(Not sure what the 'other game' is, but you know and that is all that matters.).
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It is always good to follow sterling examples.

"The other game" is a phrase often used on the ED forums.
Perhaps you are too new to know.
 
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Phisto Sobanii

Phisto Sobanii
wesmacdon said:
When the topic of conversation is the appropriateness of punishment when friendly fire accidents occur - yes, it is terrible advice. We all know that we should check our fire and I do. But accidents will continue to happen. You can't justify any level of punishment by simply saying 'don't do it then'. The whole point, if you haven't noticed, is that it is an accident. A fine is a reasonable punishment. It's a kick up the backside for not being careful but not so severe as a bounty that could see your ship destroyed. Perhaps a ban on entering res sites in the system for a period of time as well? This thread is about the reaction to friendly fire when it occurs. Simply stating the obvious that it should be avoided contributes nothing useful.
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Basic competence, which so many here appear to lack, is absolutely worth discussing since it helps you avoid whatever the punishment might be now or in the future. And c'mon - the punishment now is a joke. A minor assault bounty that clears after mere minutes and a hyperspace jump. Oh no. 3.0 likely won't be much worse, as friendly fire will be harder to achieve and the bounties still won't be all that significant.

Go ahead keep passing out the fish, me and plenty of others will be busy teaching fishing.
 

Becks

Becks
wesmacdon said:
When the topic of conversation is the appropriateness of punishment when friendly fire accidents occur - yes, it is terrible advice. We all know that we should check our fire and I do. But accidents will continue to happen. You can't justify any level of punishment by simply saying 'don't do it then'. The whole point, if you haven't noticed, is that it is an accident. A fine is a reasonable punishment. It's a kick up the backside for not being careful but not so severe as a bounty that could see your ship destroyed. Perhaps a ban on entering res sites in the system for a period of time as well? This thread is about the reaction to friendly fire when it occurs. Simply stating the obvious that it should be avoided contributes nothing useful.
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No, it's not an accident. It's reckless discharge of a weapon.

The bounty you get is valid for 10 minutes, then it is changed into a fine after highwaking.

From the perspective of the police, you are not a friendly contact. You are a neutral contact as you could be anybody from the greatest samaritan to the worst mass-murder this side of Sol. So naturally, after firing a few times on them, they turn hostile.

"This is why, Serviceman Chang, we do NOT eyeball it. You are not a cowboy shooting from the hip."
 

Winterwalker

Winterwalker
Mad Mike said:
I would be a liar if i said i had never had to brave sir robin it due to a mistake... but that is part of the fun of the game imo.
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Yup.

I also have a trigger finger made of lead.
Do I win £5?

[video=youtube;XXEXIq2cGI8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XXEXIq2cGI8[/video]
 

Phisto Sobanii

Phisto Sobanii
wesmacdon said:
Why don't you start a little thread about avoiding friendly fire incidents and leave this one for what happens when it does occur? You can keep fishing or whatever on there?
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Haha. Nooooope. What I'm saying belongs right here. Ultimately, the issue is basic flying and combat competency. Discussing the punishments you receive when you are reckless is just a symptom of that fundamental ignorance.
 

Hessfire

H
mitth'raw'nuruodo said:
And in real life, would your fellow soldiers immediately start ignoring the enemy and firing at you? (Hint: they don't) Think before you make stupid analogies.

There are many ways a game can determine intent. Hundreds of games in the past have dealt with friendly fire in a much smarter way. There is a distinct measurable difference between one or two stray shots at a ship that is not even targeted, and multiple intentional shots taken at a targeted ship. And the game can also easily verify if the ship you "inadvertently" fired at is part of your active mission objectives or has bounties on other systems, removing any chance of exploits.

I came back to ED after many years, and was surprised to see this nuisance still happens.
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Ever been in a live fire situation?

Ever served in the military?

OK, then here is a bit of truth dropping in on you - it ain't like you imagine. If I, or someone in my company started in with "spray and pray" tactics that resulted in a friendly or non-combatant getting injured or killed THE ENTIRE UNIT would be under orders to stand them down and relieve them of their weapon. Upon return to camp, they would face a review board and possible court-martial. Spray and Pray is reckless, dangerous, and since a bullet does not know intent nor discriminate has no place. It is the job of any soldier to engage the enemy, take every action to minimize civilian casualties, accomplish the objective, and return home alive. Reckless, irresponsible psychopaths have no place in today's military - repeated psychological evaluations do their best to make sure of that.

And before you come across with "its just a GAME" I will remind you that while YOU may have made the choice to role-play a psychopath, others have not. There are changes coming with Beyond, but the cost will be penalties that far exceed the paltry 200-600 credits they are now - and they don't expire or die down till paid off.

Enjoy
 

Phisto Sobanii

Phisto Sobanii
Winterwalker said:
So why cry when you fall foul of that game's obvious (and logical) rules?

Is it the end of the world? No. Should you have been more careful? Yes?
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It seems like wesmacdon is getting so utterly and completely ganked rhetorically he's got to resort to cheap shots and telling us to go away.
 

wrmiller

W
Last night in a CNB I was literally 2-300 meters from the belly of a conda I was attempting to gut, when out of nowhere a NPC slides right between me and the conda. Oops... The stupid NPC got raked with four g5 overcharged MCs at point blank. Yup, I'm wanted. Who cares...

So I finished my conda kill and then turned around a obliterated the clean NPC that I had the audacity to wound for being stupid. Felt SO much better. ;)

OP: go to a CNB or haz res, because there are no stupid cops with their lousy flying skills to gang up on you when they screw up. The only reason I don't hang out in anarchy systems and BH is because I like to get paid for my fun.
 

Hessfire

H
wesmacdon said:
Yes but...It really is just a game.
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That's the best you've got?!? Seriously?!?!?
So let me see if I've got this straight - You are horribly outclassed, outgunned, and just plain dead wrong - and the BEST you can come up with is "it really is just a game"?

I give up...

You want to wallow in your ignorance and ineptitude - go right on ahead.
People here have tried to offer you advice - you choose to not only ignore it, you insist that everyone else including FDev are the ones that are wrong.
We provide examples, you dismiss them as irrelevant.
Your pig-headed, single-minded assertion that the game must change to suit you is just beyond me.
Enjoy the changes coming in Beyond, but don't come crying here when they drop. You see while the damage threshold for Assault Bounties will go up a bit - the penalties will be going up a LOT. Right now it is coming in at a % of YOUR rebuy, plus a percentage of your victim's rebuy, plus the 200-600 credits. Additionally they don't expire, and the percentages go up with repeat offenses.

Have fun...
 

Phisto Sobanii

Phisto Sobanii
wesmacdon said:
Lol. Yes..you've got me. I simply requested the punishment for an accident be reconsidered. 'Don't commit the accident' doesn't address the point. We have established it is best to watch your fire. Point taken. No-one is disagreeing. But that doesn't mean it isn't legitimate to question if the punishment for friendly fire accidents is fair. That's the thing. I'm not disagreeing with you. You're just talking about something that, although related, is a different topic.
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Great! Now that we've agreed basic competency is important...

...in light of that the punishments are absolutely fair and will likely continue to be fair in 3.0.
 
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