Sandro - any chance we could get rough figures of what percentage of the ED player base regularly engage in PVP and what percentage of KWS scans are performed on player ships as opposed to NPC ships? It would really help to inform our ability to weigh up the pro's and con's of this debate.
Proposal Discussion Kill Warrant Scanner Feedback
- Thread starter Sandro Sammarco
- Start date
Sandro - any chance we could get rough figures of what percentage of the ED player base regularly engage in PVP and what percentage of KWS scans are performed on player ships as opposed to NPC ships? It would really help to inform our ability to weigh up the pro's and con's of this debate.
personally, i prefer the 2.4 version of kws, for prety much all of the reasons stated in the rest of the thread.
How about you just make the KWS work like you have described against PLAYERS but against the AI it works like it did before? I mean it's really that simple, you are trashing a mostly pve system for 3% of BH'ing which happens against players. The only people BH'ing players tend to be their mates wiping their bounty clean for them.
Why not still keep KWS and boost bounties then?
If anything we look for is PVE bounty hunting income, just increase bounties revealed by KWS for NPCs.
How that makes any sense considering system fundamentally changes and you have bounties tied to the ship?
Just increase bounties revealed by KWS. Done.
The mechanic seems fairly straightforward to me, Sandro. I'm mostly concerned about players racking up considerable bounties when working on BGS for their player factions and having to eat some massive costs months later when they go to a CG in open that just so happens to be part of the same superpower as the NPC Faction they crushed to get their PMF in control of a system....and get scanned by someone looking either for a payout, or to troll.
I just see it further reinforcing BGS work in Private Groups or Solo (and then the players staying there permanently) to avoid Emergent Content rebuys in Open Play. Which is the opposite of what I'd like to see, personally. More people in Open would be nice.
I'd propose letting bounties turn into fines again like they currently do on the live servers, but extending the "timer" to say, a month. That way its still a long-time consequence for one's actions, but allows a person a way out from massive bounties that will naturally get accrued over time.
I just see it further reinforcing BGS work in Private Groups or Solo (and then the players staying there permanently) to avoid Emergent Content rebuys in Open Play. Which is the opposite of what I'd like to see, personally. More people in Open would be nice.
I'd propose letting bounties turn into fines again like they currently do on the live servers, but extending the "timer" to say, a month. That way its still a long-time consequence for one's actions, but allows a person a way out from massive bounties that will naturally get accrued over time.
rootsrat
Volunteer Moderator
It's not just about the money. It's about the incentive to go visit various systems, it's about the story behind it (the one in your head), it's about the reputation gain as well.
Yeah, but crime system has changed. That's long and short of it. Story now is you get all superpower tied bounties from network. Like "ohh, this guy is wanted in almost all Federation!" that sort of story.
Redesign was bound to happen.
Thanks. It's nice to know that some people get it. I know David used to.
Rubbish! There is absolutely no reason to change a core game mechanic, in the game from inception, and now remove it because of some newer ideas.
The fact is simple.. PvE bounty hunting is being nerfed to cater for this C&P system which is a predominantly PvP problem.
As I understood it - since, in the new systems, the bounties will be linked to the ship/modules, just use two different ships. One for killing NPCs in the name of your PMF, the other to go to the CG and make some money.
The change in Engineering would also mean that you won't have to forego your top-end engineered modules in your second ship.
OK just Scrap the KWS, and have Wanted Posters gathered only from systems you have visited.
When you target a Ship it comes up Wanted or Not, Plus any Posters you have on Hand.
Let's make this as Complicated as possible, and throw a couple of nerfs in the mix as well.
When you target a Ship it comes up Wanted or Not, Plus any Posters you have on Hand.
Let's make this as Complicated as possible, and throw a couple of nerfs in the mix as well.
I must be missing something here, please feel free to tell me what it is but I still don't get why the kws needs to change at all even with the new c&p system.
It only *detects* the target ship's bounties in other jurisdictions, why does that make any difference to how the local jurisdiction processes local crimes?
If you kill a ship warned in another jurisdiction you still have to fly to that area to claim the bounty (or pay a factor a cut to do it for you).
I really don't see why it needs to change at all other than needing to report the ship's bounties rather than the pilot's.
It only *detects* the target ship's bounties in other jurisdictions, why does that make any difference to how the local jurisdiction processes local crimes?
If you kill a ship warned in another jurisdiction you still have to fly to that area to claim the bounty (or pay a factor a cut to do it for you).
I really don't see why it needs to change at all other than needing to report the ship's bounties rather than the pilot's.
That's not possible because new crime system conflict with way KWS worked in the past.
rootsrat
Volunteer Moderator
Correct, but - and I try to look at this objectively - the KWS redesign is a failure, because clearly it was seen as a PVP tool by the developers, which I honestly think is not the case. They have completely ignored the PVE part of it, the part where the KWS was mainly used. Regardless of the PVE-PVP split, I am fairly sure that PVP-ers don't bother with using KWS on their Cmdr targets, as most of them seem to be the "kill everything that moves, no comms, no questions asked".
That's where the flaw in the KWS redesign is.
Sandro's current proposal is a step in the right direction, but not enough IMHO. I am not opposing the change, I am opposing for the KWS to lose a lot of reasons that rendered it useful, not just from money point of view, but other aspects too, purely because it's purpose is to be a PVP centered module.
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Also:
% of systems with all factions aligned solely to one superpower
% of independent controlling systems systems
% of all other systems
Because this change would only change things from the beta for the first group. And I personally think that group is a lot smaller than the other two...but if the devs can prove thats not the case it may seem a more reasonable solution
It detects target ship bounties in other jurisdiction where dominant minor faction is aligned to same superpower.
Then it's pretty simple; the new system should not have been implemented in such a way as to make a previous core module redundant!!