Engineering : A compromise to prevent having to "grind" G1 --> G5 on every new module?

[GraXXoR]

I have a metric fracktonne of mats, so I think I’ll just give all my modules (20+ships) a G5 onceover.
That way, when the new system comes out I can start them off at G5 instead of having to work them all up from G1

 

[NeilF]

In other words: increase storage limit. Same result.

Yes and no...

So when do you go to an Engineer? When you see some of the materials at 40? 50? But some are still at 5? What materials do you need next? So back to the spreadsheets you go, or off you go to The Engineer only to find you need X of Y. So off you the Material Broker and fly to get some Y... Yadda...Yadda...

Just imagine for a second, that whenever you want, in any station, you could simply go into a screen and basically say, for the Engineer you've selected, any materials they're interested in, give them to them, and your reputation simply goes up. eg: So after a few days, of just playing the game, and at your leisure handnig in mats, you can see a particular engineer's reputation (level) looks like this:-

You now know, you can go there and "spend" some of that reputation on some Grade 2 related.

And at glance you could see all the Engineers you've unlocked and see all their levels (as above). And in a station contribute any materials they're interested in to them.

Done...

Also - and I warn you - this is probably a very shocking surprise to many so make sure you're sitting firmly:
(here it comes)
There are actually players out there who like gradually carrying out upgrades as part of their ongoing 'story'.
And that includes me

But storage increase? Sure.. 100 isn't enough. Far from it.
A bit smaller trade ratio? yeah, why not. A fair and probably needed compromise.

And I'd argue the people who want to be "casual" with the Engineers (as I would), while the new mat limit helps this, it simply delays the faff IMHO. What mats do I need for what upgrade at what level... Etc...


My proposal from years ago is how I would see a laid back friendly and simple Engineers working - https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...axed-not-a-contrived-quot-accounting-job-quot

It's something I can actually imagine getting involved with as it doesn't make The Engineers into an Accounting Job, and simply something you can take part within a friendly fashion!


BUT, that's all water under the bridge... We are where we are now. And the proposal in the OP at least (for me) means I have to spend less time needlessly doing that tedious Acountancy Job...

 

[Macros Black]

Ah., but YOU'RE choosing to waste YOUR time?
---> How many of those weps can you use at once? (which ship has the most hardpoints?).

All the rest are gathering dust and - your choice of course - it's only hoarding.

Every time I open ED, I choose to waste my time.
And yes, I'm a ship hoarder, I must have at least 30. My ships are usually configured for very specific roles, and I seldom re-arrange weapons between them, but it happens.

If the new system goes though, my module reuse will increase significantly and my visits to the Engineers will be reduced to a bare minimum.

Edit: And come to think of it, it will probably stop me from buying the new ships, if I don't already have the modules.

 

[NeilF]

I've updated the OP...

ADDITIONAL SUGGESTION
So you have a Grade 5 "Long Range" beam laser. And you want to try an "Efficient" beam laser. As the weapon in question is G5 you're allowed (once again using the same Grand Father mechanic) to change it to "Efficient" so it will become a top G4 "Efficient" beam laser now. You can then roll it up through G5.

So add the two suggestions above together - Imagine you have a G5 "Long Range" beam laser. And you want to keep it, but also create a new G5 "Efficient" Beam Laser. You would do the following:-
1) Clone your existing G5 "Long Range" beam laser onto a brand new beam laser (Grand Father mechanic) so it would become a top level G4.
2) You would do a single G5 roll on it. Because then...
3) You would convert it to "Efficient" (Grand Father mechanic) so it would become a top level G4 ("Efficient").
4) You would now roll it up through G5.

You now have your original Grade 5 "Long Range" beam laser and a new G5 "Efficient" beam laser.

And more importantly you have more time to play the game, and more will to live!

 

[Shotgun2097]

Frankly, I think there's more chance of convincing my dog to guard a plate of sausages than there is of convincing players to upgrade their ships gradually.

at least this made me lol as i imagined this scenario

 

[Vardaugas]

Most simple solution would be to assume high average number of rolls (like 2/2/3/4/10) needed for the grade to finish, require reputation for grade 5 access and then put a tick on each grade that adds up the materials to a pile and when you click to engineer, the whole material is used and the mod is at max of the selected grade. Then you can buy your experimental effect and done.

 

[Boff'in]

Are people *still* complaining about this?

But on paper it's more mats, boo hoo.
Yes you are 'correct' you are not "wrong" in that determination.

Now please get over this.

In reality, it's less time and every mat I collect is useful towards the process thanks to the traders, and I'm not wasting precious materials on a NEGATIVE ROLL.
oh and I can actually filter missions for material rewards did you know I can upgrade remotely on the fly.
All I need is one module with the same upgrade, and every ship I own then I can then apply the same blueprint......for my frickin fleet.

Oh yeah, but it's technically handfull more mats lower-grade mats, instead of soley searching for grade5 stuff all the g time and constant emptying out lower materials, and complaining about the RNG because those lower grade materials aren't worth my time or storage space, because I've got g5 unlock, and I don't care about the lower 4 grades materials anymore.

So far, post beta, (when hardcore fans melted down over this),
Chapter1 released to the general public, and well, the forums didn't explode in the same way.
The game didn't stop.
I don't see rants every day over this whole g1->g5 thing, massive boycots, or major publications going HA-HA FDEV messed up.

I guess it's not as painful as some very noisey people predicted, and by the looks of it, the new system appears to be easier and quicker regardless of the ipso-facto "moar materials required.....waah"

 

[Blackcompany]

Are people *still* complaining about this?

But on paper it's more mats, boo hoo.
Yes you are 'correct' you are not "wrong" in that determination.

Now please get over this.

In reality, it's less time and every mat I collect is useful towards the process thanks to the traders, and I'm not wasting precious materials on a NEGATIVE ROLL.
oh and I can actually filter missions for material rewards did you know I can upgrade remotely on the fly.
All I need is one module with the same upgrade, and every ship I own then I can then apply the same blueprint......for my frickin fleet.

Oh yeah, but it's technically handfull more mats lower-grade mats, instead of soley searching for grade5 stuff all the g time and constant emptying out lower materials, and complaining about the RNG because those lower grade materials aren't worth my time or storage space, because I've got g5 unlock, and I don't care about the lower 4 grades materials anymore.

So far, post beta, (when hardcore fans melted down over this),
Chapter1 released to the general public, and well, the forums didn't explode in the same way.
The game didn't stop.
I don't see rants every day over this whole g1->g5 thing, massive boycots, or major publications going HA-HA FDEV messed up.

I guess it's not as painful as some very noisey people predicted, and by the looks of it, the new system appears to be easier and quicker regardless of the ipso-facto "moar materials required.....waah"

In reality its a garbage system that started bad and got worse.

Low effort RNG grind is the domain of mobile games and shady free to play developers. Or it was. Until Frontier decided, of their own volition, to join those ranks.

 

[Strangepork]

Summary
Under Beyond, if you engineer a module which was created under the previous Engineer mechanics, it's converted ("Grand Fathered") to the highest level of the next Grade down. So re-Engineer a G4 module generated last year, it will give a top level G3 module.

The following suggestion simply offers this same approach for new modules, if you've previously Engineered that same sort of module before.

Suggestion
Clearly people are possibly not enjoying the prospect that with each and every new module they have to G1-->G5 it.

So I wonder if a compromise might be, if you've already got modules of the same size/type (onboard, on another ship, in storage - ie: You've engineered one before), which are a higher grade of engineered than the one you're currently engineering, then you have an option available to "Clone Existing".

If you take this option it then lists all the other ones you have (which are higher than your current one), showing their grades etc, and if you select one it then simply rolls your module at the highest grade at the grade below the one you're cloning (ie: The same as the "Grand Father" mechanic)? No side effects would not be considered etc.

So if you were engineering a new FSD, and you had other ones of the same size, you could choose to "Clone" a G5 one, and your new one would be rolled at highest G4 level. Thus meaning you've at least jumped up to a fairly high level with it. I'd suggest the "cost" for doing this would be the material cost of that roll level, so in this example it would cost the materials for a G4 roll.

In this way, at least if you've ever engineered a similar weapon/module before you can jump a long way up the grades on a new one.



Note: I'm sure there's there's more ifs/buts about this proposal, but it seems a possible compromise?

Note: If you consider at the moment, the wise thing to do in preparation for the new forced G1-->G5 mechanics, is to simply buy lots of modules and do a single G5 roll on them, and store them. Then come the new mechanics, you can level them up through G5 at your leisure. BUT, with the above mechanic, you can achieve exactly the same (all via the new mechancis), in a sensible way!



ADDITIONAL SUGGESTION
So you have a Grade 5 "Long Range" beam laser. And you want to try an "Efficient" beam laser. As the weapon in question is G5 you're allowed (once again using the same Grand Father mechanic) to change it to "Efficient" so it will become a top G4 "Efficient" beam laser now. You can then roll it up through G5.

So add the two suggestions above together - Imagine you have a G5 "Long Range" beam laser. And you want to keep it, but also create a new G5 "Efficient" Beam Laser. You would do the following:-
1) Clone your existing G5 "Long Range" beam laser onto a brand new beam laser (Grand Father mechanic) so it would become a top level G4.
2) You would do a single G5 roll on it. Because then...
3) You would convert it to "Efficient" (Grand Father mechanic) so it would become a top level G4 ("Efficient").
4) You would now roll it up through G5.

You now have your original Grade 5 "Long Range" beam laser and a new G5 "Efficient" beam laser.

And more importantly you have more time to play the game, and more will to live!


ps: Personally I'd suggest this "convert" option should use a version of the Grandfather Mechanic where it lowers it down to the lower grade of it's current grade. NOT, the highest level of the next lower grade. A subtle difference, making things a little slicker.

I have a suggestion, whereby FDev embue the Engineers and their bases with the properties of modern quantum mechanics, all engineering becomes free for all, however we can only either know where an engineer or there base is / or how fast they are moving, never both at the same time.

 

[Boff'in]

/me rolls dice, I got a 4

plus skill level, hmm that was 8,

8+4 that's an attack strength of 12.

/me rolls dice for Blackcompany
Dang they got a 6.

Add that to the skill level, 10, attack strength of 16.
Their 16 his higher than my 12, curse the luck of the dice.

I loose this round! Minus two stamina.

Wait I'll roll for luck to see if I can deflect the blow.
/Me rolls 2 dice. 4 and 2, that's 6
My current luck is at 7, narrowly, I got lucky,
-1 luck (must remember to take luck potion after combat).

-1 stamina instead.

Okay, you win this round!!
Time to roll for the next round of random numbers have been powered gameplay for literally millennia.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dice

 

[GG7]

I fail to see what all the fuss is about regarding this whole G1 - G5 thing per module.

The upgrade process takes less than 2 minutes per.

Are we really at such a low point in gaming where even something as trivial as 1-2 minutes to fully upgrade a module is considered a grind?

WOW! Just... WOW! [rolleyes] [wacky] [wacko]

 

[DeathStroke]

SNIP

I'd rather just have the old system back. As as it was, it's still better than what we have now.

 

[Jankules]

I fail to see what all the fuss is about regarding this whole G1 - G5 thing per module.

The upgrade process takes less than 2 minutes per.

Are we really at such a low point in gaming where even something as trivial as 1-2 minutes to fully upgrade a module is considered a grind?

WOW! Just... WOW! [rolleyes] [wacky] [wacko]

Correct,but if you want to do mods of 30 distributors,30 fsd and 30 thrusters as I did,OP gave us really good advice!It saved me tons of materials(gr1 to gr4) and planty of time.