This guy gets it. Why you rollin' solo, OP?
This guy gets it. Why you rollin' solo, OP?
A $.02 necro. Neato.
Be glad he didn't have three friends. Moar TLB pa's with a nice dose of FS cannons will absolutely ruin your day in a big 4 ship.
Gorram I didn't even see this was a necro. Haha. Glad it was... lots of good discussion I didn't see earlier.
Its kind of a weird experimental. It has no impact on NPCs, most players consider it unfun, and it seem redundant if your argument is "It counters Gimballed". There is already an experimental to counter gimballed in Dispersal Field, so what does TLB do other than frustrate players by making them feel helpless.
Yeah, continuous tlb from a wing gets pretty old. I don't mind tlb in limited doses, but then again I'm not going to stick around for a 1v3 or 4 just to get spammed with it. In fact, my entire protocol with scenarios that involve possible wing ganks is getting a revamp post 3.0.
On the first page, I see one person saying, "don't get hit by them", and another saying the big 3 primary goal is to face tank. Hmm.
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Powderpanic
Banned
Anyone who says they can dodge PA's in their big three by flying FAO is not talking about PVP
Powderpanic
The Voice of Griefing
Powderpanic
The Voice of Griefing
I don't understand. Why not just unlock from the target, "lead it" manually and fire those gimbals "like" fixed weapons? It takes some guess work, but chaff or TLB should be pretty much null at that point.
Rooks o7
Rooks o7
TLB is an invaluable asset on the PvP battlefield but a slight cooldown wouldn't go amiss. I've learned to deal with TLB and even use TLB on a few builds of mine yet weapons like the APA and the TLB effect is just too useful. If there were a 2-3 second cooldown it would be brief enough for the effect to continue making sense but not too brief as to make flying a large ship a little short of useless.
It's not the end of the world if they don't do a pass over it. But at the same time it wouldn't hurt.
It's not the end of the world if they don't do a pass over it. But at the same time it wouldn't hurt.
As I've said every single time TLB is raised, a correctly outfitted and flown big ship still defeats any one medium and most (not all) 2 x medium even under continuous TLB...
...but...
...to have to build the entire ship and almost the entire gameplan around dealing with one single special just seems completely disproportionate to me.
Frontier need to take a long hard look at every special triggered in its full force merely by hitting. Some ships are easier to hit than others. Feedback cascade, force shell, thermal shock, reverberating cascade ... these are all more than binary and the make-up of the target will affect or mitigate the special.
TL;DR: every 'binary' special, like TLB, like corrosive, like emissive, is crude and needs work. But TLB perhaps most of all as it has neither cooldown, nor downside.
...but...
...to have to build the entire ship and almost the entire gameplan around dealing with one single special just seems completely disproportionate to me.
Frontier need to take a long hard look at every special triggered in its full force merely by hitting. Some ships are easier to hit than others. Feedback cascade, force shell, thermal shock, reverberating cascade ... these are all more than binary and the make-up of the target will affect or mitigate the special.
TL;DR: every 'binary' special, like TLB, like corrosive, like emissive, is crude and needs work. But TLB perhaps most of all as it has neither cooldown, nor downside.
Why cant I rep you, but I can rep anyone else?
i add emissive to at least 1 weapon per ship thanks to TLB. I find it useful even in PvE combat.
Then where is the hard counter to fixed?
Oh right, there is none when it comes to Rails or similar weapons. And no, they aren't hard to use so don't try that excuse with me
Fixed weapons are high skill tools; gaining proficiency with them should be rewarded.
Powderpanic
Banned
You show us a video of you keeping your fixed weapons on a constantly boosting meta ship target, without being an FAO Lord. Then we can talk.
Do you even PVP bro?
Powderpanic
The Voice of Griefing
At least they used to be. With long range weapons and with the insta-yaw you get from G5 dirty on some ships, I'm not so sure anymore.
Then again, über shields are more or less hard counter to everything.
The point is that TLB (and similar 'binary' specials such as Dispersal, even though that has a cooldown) are in about the right place against medium ships, too weak against small ships, and too strong against big ships.
It's obvious, isn't it, really? Any special that has a simple trigger requirement of 'hitting' is going to affect big ships disproportionately and small ships not enough.
For this reason I still believe the solution is to scale the effect by sensor size and grade. Because big ships have big sensors they should suffer less than smalls (which should suffer more than now). Mediums about as now.
We already have this approach for SCB's and feedback cascade. Why not also for TLB, and a similar approach for some other specials?
It's obvious, isn't it, really? Any special that has a simple trigger requirement of 'hitting' is going to affect big ships disproportionately and small ships not enough.
For this reason I still believe the solution is to scale the effect by sensor size and grade. Because big ships have big sensors they should suffer less than smalls (which should suffer more than now). Mediums about as now.
We already have this approach for SCB's and feedback cascade. Why not also for TLB, and a similar approach for some other specials?
With a bit of practice, you can be effective enough not to suck with fixed weapons. Especially if one is used to using fixed to begin with. So again, where is the answer to my question?
Rinzler o7o7o7
Banned
He is half correct, hitscan is the hard counter to sperg-boosting meta ships, and it's fairly easy to master.
He is incorrect in thinking that fixed weapons need a hard counter though. The only counter to an opponent proficiently hitting you with fixed weapons is for you to hit him even more proficiently with your own fixed weapons.
Skill is rewarded.
You are making the incorrect assumption that the price and the size of the ship dictate how powerful a ship should be in a video game. But this is a simulation. Not a video game. In video games you follow a progression system that means the more you play the more powerful you are. In these video games you are progressively taking on harder and harder challenges like enemies. But this is a simulation. What you are doing in the beginning of the game is most likely what you will be doing your entire ED career. Things don't get easier over time. Instead everything you can do is available to you at the beginning of the game and you are expected to learn and get better at your chosen profession while customizing your ship to fill the role you have chosen.
Fair is not a consideration in a simulation.