Why are we still arguing about open v solo, ganking, griefing, etc.?

[Phisto Sobanii]

It did seem entirely irrelevant. Don't care what other people said. Don't care that he doesn't see it as wrong. All I care is that I can avoid being in a game with people I do not want to play with. All I am doing is saying why I don't want to play with them. They don't have to change at all, it is not a requirement.

Um... you said PvErs won't deride PvPers for the mode they choose to play in.

PvErs go off on us for playing in Open. Many prefer we don't play the game at all.

 

[Sylveria]

It did seem entirely irrelevant. Don't care what other people said. Don't care that he doesn't see it as wrong. All I care is that I can avoid being in a game with people I do not want to play with. All I am doing is saying why I don't want to play with them. They don't have to change at all, it is not a requirement.

Best thing to do in cases where people are obviously just trolling others for salt is ignore them completely. It's inevitable they will continue to engage you directly with forum-fu in futile attempts to destroy credibility, especially when they know they're losing a debate. Always ends up in derailing threads because they don't agree with said topic and really can't refute them with actual proof. Eventually it just leads to some moronic assertion they should be rewarded for their efforts to engage in risky behavior versus those who learn from mistakes and evolve.

FD is the only ones with "power" here, no matter what the desperate would have you believe. That's where your efforts are best spent.

 

[Phisto Sobanii]

Best thing to do in cases where people are obviously just trolling others for salt is ignore them completely. It's inevitable they will continue to engage you directly with forum-fu in futile attempts to destroy credibility, especially when they know they're losing a debate. Always ends up in derailing threads because they don't agree with said topic and really can't refute them with actual proof. Eventually it just leads to some moronic assertion they should be rewarded for their efforts to engage in risky behavior versus those who learn from mistakes and evolve.

FD is the only ones with "power" here, no matter what the desperate would have you believe. That's where your efforts are best spent.

Wait, who here is acting so poorly? I just see a heated discussion between adults.

 

[Tarman]

We've now reached the end of the ride. I have brick marks on my forehead from trying to bust down a wall of intractability to show another side of things, but other than that I don't feel that much has been actually accomplished.

On the plus side, I think I found my real "people" in this game, like one of those hokey fantasy orphan stories.

I feel like I need a new branding, since the PVE-player branding seems too exclusive a group for me to be a part of. Ima go by Open-Only player instead.

 

[Sterling MH]

Yeah, you'd get some sympathy if you'd actually appeared to accept the other side to your other side. You refuse, however. Because YOU enjoy PvP doesn't mean anyone else will. And just because YOU think you are playing a risk doesn't mean you are, nor that others are avoiding risk by not playing your way.

We still argue because your side doesn't listen and doesn't care about people who don't PvP in ED. And we have stopped trying to engage you because to us that appears to be a fools errand.

 

[Phisto Sobanii]

Yeah, you'd get some sympathy if you'd actually appeared to accept the other side to your other side. You refuse, however. Because YOU enjoy PvP doesn't mean anyone else will. And just because YOU think you are playing a risk doesn't mean you are, nor that others are avoiding risk by not playing your way.

We still argue because your side doesn't listen and doesn't care about people who don't PvP in ED. And we have stopped trying to engage you because to us that appears to be a fools errand.

It's really, really not about those who PvP or not. You either know the score and play the game, or not. I can try to explain what I mean by that if you're interested.

 

[Sylveria]

...if you're interested.

And now you finally understand. Congratulations Padawan.

Hint: It's not about "risk and reward".

 

[Phisto Sobanii]

And now you finally understand. Congratulations Padawan.

Hint: It's not about "risk and reward".

Nah, more about not wasting my breath on those that clearly don't know the score and have zero interest in it.

I suspect strongly that you are one of them.

 

[Sylveria]

Nah, more about not wasting my breath on those that clearly don't know the score and have zero interest in it.

I suspect strongly that you are one of them.

[video=youtube;jmd3SejK_so]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jmd3SejK_so[/video]

 

[Phisto Sobanii]

What?

It wasn't obvious our ethos on the game isn't exactly compatible?

Anyway, you or Sterling want to hear what I have to say, or not?

 

[Stigbob]

That's not fairly self-evident at all, that's a generalization. I try not make them, though nobody's perfect. I've just seen lots of real examples over the years that bust the stereotypes, as well as being an example of it myself. I've gamed with folks who were super level-headed and competent despite not even being half-way through high school. One of my zombiegame striketeam leaders was 15 when she started commanding, and she ran one of the most successful and largest teams we had till she graduated high school and went to college. Also gamed with adults who were the most petty and wound-up people I've ever met and couldn't win or lose or even play the game with any grace whatsoever. I left an RPG group because the two adults were arguing for real about who was going to fly the pretend spaceship even before the game itself started.

As far as yourself not being able to play villains, then acting is not your career path. If you ask actors though, many of them LOVE to play villains, because they're frequently more interesting to portray than the hero. They're usually nice people IRL, they just pretend to be terrible for fun. There are also actors who play mostly heroes, who are purported to be such complete holes IRL that their own heroic characters would despise them. Acting isn't representative of anything but how well you can get yourself into someone else's shoes.

None of this denies the existence of salt miners, but it also doesn't deny the existence of surface-level salt mines. They feed into each other. Meanwhile they both cloud actual discussions with their crowing and bleating when both of them just need to be mainly ignored.

I don't care. If the only thing I have to judge a player by is them station ramming in the game, as far as I'm concerned it's the only thing I need to know about them as nothing else about them is remotely relevant to me. I'm not going to start second guessing it, I'll just block them and forget they ever existed.

 

[iFred]

After 2 years I'm still reading threads debating the pros and cons of open v solo. Most often the debate focuses around ganking and griefing. Why? It's so frustrating to read the same thing over and over with the same complaint.

ED is a MMO. Open should be the jewel in the crown. Discouraging players from playing in open for any reason is just dumb. It doesn't matter why they play solo, just that they do. If we want a vibrant MMO community, then we should not be discouraging players from playing in open. If you are a ganker, griefer or just see yourself as a player who likes killing other players because the game allows it, then just think twice. If the P v P seems like an unfair match, then it probably is. This would be big first step in getting players back into open.

If killing other players is your thing, then there are easy ways to do this without ruffling feathers:

- Join a P v P group.
- Invite friends for matches.
- Find players who want consensual P v P (with report crimes off).
- Stick to players who are "wanted" (we all know the risks of being wanted).
- Give Power play a shot (custom made reservation for hunters and prey).

If you P v P with players who are ready to take you on, then not only will it be more fun if you win, but even if you don't you will probably take something away from the experience and be a better (more skilled) player because of the experience.

Uh - finally someone who sums it up and gives advice to other mature players. I´m very thankful reading it.



Oops. Not.

To be honest: I don´t care what you say. In the current state theres no single reason to play Open, and as long as we dont have a couple of very very good reasons to go into Open - this would include a working C&P-system, a good economy, bigger instances - you can probably wait forever until i press the open-button. And you know why? Because I can and because I bought/backed a singleplayer game. To be 100 % correct: An offline singleplayer game.

See ya

 

[Tarman]

I don't care. If the only thing I have to judge a player by is them station ramming in the game, as far as I'm concerned it's the only thing I need to know about them as nothing else about them is remotely relevant to me. I'm not going to start second guessing it, I'll just block them and forget they ever existed.

Sounds good to me; a practicable choice.

 

[Sylveria]

Sounds good to me; a practicable choice.

Yep. Agreed. And once we've all increased the size of our block lists, we'll have effectively shown exactly the point FD should have known all along...

PvP and PvE will never exist in harmony together in a "single shared universe", ever.

Separate servers. Open PvP, Open PvE.

 

[Phisto Sobanii]

Yep. Agreed. And once we've all increased the size of our block lists, we'll have effectively shown exactly the point FD should have known all along...

PvP and PvE will never exist in harmony together in a "single shared universe", ever.

Separate servers. Open PvP, Open PvE.

Harmony in a game with a dystopian setting.

What a curious notion.

In any case, I believe along with many others that the community behind that game could have some semblance of harmony - enough to be more functional and enjoyable than it is right now - if PP (Open Only, of course!) could be improved and provide the end game content so many of us crave.

Based on what I see here and around dozens of Discords, it seems like FDEV is noticing that need and coming around to it.

 

[Space Dandy]

We are still arguing because FD in it's wisdom decided to give us:

Open
group
solo

instead of

Online
private servers
offline

like they should have.

All this to "protect" code I believe....

 

[Stigbob]

We are still arguing because FD in it's wisdom decided to give us:

Open
group
solo

instead of

Online
private servers
offline

like they should have.

All this to "protect" code I believe....

I suspect it was to attract enough customers to justify making a game in this neglected genre at all. Without all of us it might not have been possible, so don't sweat other peoples menu choices.

 

[Space Dandy]

I suspect it was to attract enough customers to justify making a game in this neglected genre at all. Without all of us it might not have been possible, so don't sweat other peoples menu choices.

No that was what kickstarter was for.

Also I don't care what mode people play in, now if only others wouldn't either we wouldn't have this thread and we wouldn't have peeps asking for content to no longer be mode agnostic like it rightly should be.

 

[jasonbirder]

In any case, I believe along with many others that the community behind that game could have some semblance of harmony - enough to be more functional and enjoyable than it is right now - if PP (Open Only, of course!)

You genuinely believe that the way towards community harmony is through the simple mechanism of BANNING 50% of the Elite playerbase from a significant gameplay element ???
HOW would that promote harmony...

(Ignoring the obvious realism/lore flaw inherent in relegating the results of economic/covert conflict between Galactic powers controlling hundreds of worlds, with populations in the trillions and economies essentially too big to be measured to the outcome of some simple pew-pew between a few dozen (at most a couple of hundred) active PvPers for each power....)

 

[Sterling MH]

Thing is, Jason, they don't care about harmony. It's only said that way to make people not going in to be targets the ones in the wrong.