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have i missed some info?
surely 4.0 will be a paid for expansion?. I thought this year being "free" (as in an extension to horizons) was a 1 off?
Where is the paid 'content' LEP holder get for 'free'
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have i missed some info?
surely 4.0 will be a paid for expansion?. I thought this year being "free" (as in an extension to horizons) was a 1 off?
Nothing missed, it's just my own musings on the subject. From what I can tell, they still intend to carry on improving the core gameplay (such as combat zones, res sites, the BGS, NPC comms and NPC Crew). I can't really see them charging us for them as they will be core gameplay areas and will be difficult to cordon off.
My theory is, is that FDev will continue to carry on with the free updates next year to the core areas of the game because there is still a lot to improve upon after 3.3, but will also be releasing paid for premium DLC's (maybe atmospheric planets, gas giant, space legs etc) like we are getting this year to help pay for these updates.
It's just a theory that kinda makes sense from what we have seen this year and what has been hinted at on the streams. No guarantee that it will happen like that and far from confident myself.
It's just an idea of how it may go forward which kinda fits.
I am also thinking that Horizons maybe bundled into the main game at the Q4 update, so that they have a unified product to make DLC's from instead of breaking it all up.
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Depends how much thought and effort they put into the next set of dev. Hopefully we'll never see another "Beyond" again.
I'm going to chime in on the original topic.
I got a LEP by winning the silent auction the christmas before last. I pay a decent amount with the expectation of a return on my "investment". And yes, I am fully aware that the money went to a good cause. That made me feel even better about having the winning bid. However, where the money went, and what it was used for is irrelevant. Money was given for a product. The product at the time was the guarantee that all future premium paid content would be free. At the time of my purchase, the business model was still set up as paid expansions. Thus giving the buyer (me, and all other owner's) the expectation of future product that others would have to purchase.
So here's my take on this whole fiasco by FD. First and foremost is that FD has every right to do what they did, and in a very limited way have fulfilled their obligation to the owners of the LEP. That being said, it is a pretty cr***y business that changes their business model in this fashion and not do anything for the customers that paid real money with the expectation of receiving a product that others have to pay for.
TLDR?
FD changed their business model. Completely within their rights. LEP owners got nothing for thier purchase of extra content that others had to bay for. and FD doesn't feel as thought they need do anything. Welcome to capitalism at its finest!
I got a LEP by winning the silent auction the christmas before last. I pay a decent amount with the expectation of a return on my "investment". And yes, I am fully aware that the money went to a good cause. That made me feel even better about having the winning bid. However, where the money went, and what it was used for is irrelevant. Money was given for a product. The product at the time was the guarantee that all future premium paid content would be free. At the time of my purchase, the business model was still set up as paid expansions. Thus giving the buyer (me, and all other owner's) the expectation of future product that others would have to purchase.
So here's my take on this whole fiasco by FD. First and foremost is that FD has every right to do what they did, and in a very limited way have fulfilled their obligation to the owners of the LEP. That being said, it is a pretty cr***y business that changes their business model in this fashion and not do anything for the customers that paid real money with the expectation of receiving a product that others have to pay for.
TLDR?
FD changed their business model. Completely within their rights. LEP owners got nothing for thier purchase of extra content that others had to bay for. and FD doesn't feel as thought they need do anything. Welcome to capitalism at its finest!
Nonsense, they didn't change their business model in that regard. They always said that they release smaller free updates and bigger paid for updates. This doesn't change just because Beyond is free. They already told us that more paid for updates are coming.
We already know that there are more paid for DLC's coming that the LEP owners won't have to pay for but people like me will do. I fail to see the issue at the moment to be honest.
An LEP owner too (from Kickstarter) I have "a feeling" the idea might be to try to get away from the pre-purchase model, which requires your customers to have full 110% faith that an early update in a pre-paid set, isn't representative of the whole expansion. I think it's a hang over from kickstart partly and that developing a game with as much scope as ED would be a major undertaking for even a large publishing house, let alone a medium sized, self publishing developer.
If I was FDev I would be trying to use 2018 as both opportunity to consolidate the base game (Beyond) but I would also 'want' (not saying it's definitely possible though) to develop 4.0 in parallel. Then when it comes time for 4.0, I think benefits in selling that as a full expansion, available there and then in finished form.
Because it comes in piecemeal I feel even excellent content will almost always meet with a sceptical reception when pre-paid, especially by people who don't see any need to demonstrate faith in the developer. Needs maybe must, if your game is going from standing start, however if you can get development ahead of the customer base then at least people know what they're getting, when they decide to buy or don't buy the expansion.
It can be reviewed fairly then, in the round, rather than by a genuinely uninformed and probably reactionary steam community setting the agenda on one side and equally unsure white knights, fighting the other corner. Any overt criticism of the game, or the way it's developing can (for example) be seen (by me) as an undermining attack on the game I invested in / backed at kickstart if it puts even one person off playing it.
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I just hope 'Atmospheric Landings' is not a paid for expansion. That would be directly contrary to the original game and would no doubt cause a riot. 'Space Legs' on the other hand could be content for which they can charge for, which the LEP would cover of course.
Clarification: I remember landing on atmosphere planets on the AMIGA so perhaps they wern't on the original BBC. I can't remember.
Clarification: I remember landing on atmosphere planets on the AMIGA so perhaps they wern't on the original BBC. I can't remember.
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Atmospherics will most likely be a paid expansion just like non-atmospherics was a paid for expansion. The amount of work needed for realistic atmospheric planets compared to what was before is a completely different kettle of fish. You cannot compare the two.
As to the original Elite game, well it didn't have any planets to land on, so not sure what you are talking about there.
You are probably right. The BBC did some split screen magic to give us a coloured HUD and B+W wire frame display but I can't remember landing on planets. Not until it came to the AMIGA as Frontier: Elite II I think it was called. So going by that, they will probably charge for Atmosphere Landings.
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I played the original Elite on the Spectrum 48k and it was wireframe. No planets that you could land on. It was Frontier where you could land and they looked like this:
I am hoping that ED's atmospheric planets look at bit better.
So I'll say it again: Beyond is free because they couldn't reasonably charge for it (with the exception of Squadrons). The vast majority of Beyond updates relate to core features of the game, they couldn't in all good faith make us pay for that, but they also wanted to push those updates out because even Frontier realize they are 3 years overdue. And fortunately they had a financial cushion allowing them to do it.
That Beyond is free is in no way an indication there will be no more paid expansions, whatever form they may take. At some point Frontier still needs to make money, and although paintjobs may or may not make them a lot of money, there is no reason to drop paid expansions altogether, especially when there are still heavy hitters to come like space legs, which will generate plenty of hype and publicity and sales.
That Beyond is free is in no way an indication there will be no more paid expansions, whatever form they may take. At some point Frontier still needs to make money, and although paintjobs may or may not make them a lot of money, there is no reason to drop paid expansions altogether, especially when there are still heavy hitters to come like space legs, which will generate plenty of hype and publicity and sales.
I know what you're saying. And I look forward to "it".
But how well has FD been at releasing things on time? Especially with full expansions. Or following through on what they said?
Look, I'm really not trying to be a FD basher, because I still play ED on a regular basis, and enjoy my time in game. My problem is that the way FD communicates relevant information with the community. This thread is a perfect example. FD changed things up, put out information in a way that makes LEP holders feel as though they're getting tossed to the road side, and players voice their feelings on the matter.
Look at it this way. If you go and buy a new car with fancy options, and the dealers tells you it will take three month to get it from the factory, and you agree because it's worth the wait. Then you go back to the dealer in three months and are told that they changed things at the factory, and you will now have to wait an entire year more for your new car. Would you wait? After all the dealer told you it would only be another year. I know I would walk. And I'm talking about a new car, and I like cars way more than gaming.
I loved that game. Getting into orbit without atmospheric shielding was always a challenge.I played the original Elite on the Spectrum 48k and it was wireframe. No planets that you could land on. It was Frontier where you could land and they looked like this:
I am hoping that ED's atmospheric planets look at bit better.
We do not know what it will be, whether it will be on time. As long as it comes, I don't see the issue. The issue with the LEP is that you paid for something that you didn't know what it will be. With the car, you know exactly what you are getting. With the LEP you are paying for stuff upfront on faith that they will do it for something that isn't even in the design process yet.
It's one reason why I never buy LEP's for any game as you just do not know that the expansions will be any good or what you want. They are a risk, but at the end of the day should be cheaper then buying them all seperatly. Whether it's what you want and when is a seperate issue.
This is an outrage! Give it back, at once.
Same here. It was a horizons per-order bonus.
I still think Frontier should at least re-implement paid closed Betas as the norm, i.e. which we LEP's don't have to pay for. Naturally, ones with every possible unlock eg engineering mat reductions.
As I say, it did used to be the norm, it was the norm when I bought my LEP and it would be a relatively modest way of giving us something back.
(And it might actually, y'know, help with the bugs as well.)
As I say, it did used to be the norm, it was the norm when I bought my LEP and it would be a relatively modest way of giving us something back.
(And it might actually, y'know, help with the bugs as well.)
now that we know Mac support is being dropped i think this is a very safe bet indeed.
i just hope what ever the next paid DLC is it is significant and is then the "premium" content for the next 12 months or so. (ie just bug fixes from then on whilst the main team work on the next major expansion).
(ie like morrowind or summerville (not sure on the name) is to ESO).
The last thing ED needs is a bunch of tiny paid DLCs that people can dip in and out of like some sort of gaming Tapas. That will do nothing to help tie in all the game features and will just amplify the concern that each in game feature feels like a disjointed mini game.
At least if it is a major DLC with all features for the next 12 months + FD can make sure it is all fully meshed into the game and not have each little feature as a side show having to stand on its own because FD cant assume that just because a player has "mining expansion planetary drill bit" DLC that they also have "planetary prospector underground deep probe" DLC
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Your example isn't good because FDEV never announced a specific timeframe for future content. They just said that you'll get all paid expansions for free during the lifetime of the game.
I am sure they will carry on with the smaller free updates for story purposes. But as to how the premium downloads and updates to the main game will work after beyond is very difficult to know.
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