News Chapter Four - Exploration Reveal

Imagine, if you will, that you're on holiday. It's a medium-sized town you're in, with a small business district, residential areas and a lovely, sprawling cobbled area full of local shops selling all sorts. The birds are singing about how sunny it is, and you can hear waves in the distance somewhere.

You're idly window-shopping in the local shops bit. Except...something's different from yesterday. Yesterday you could see through the windows and read the signs above the shops. Now all the windows are blacked-out and there are no signs. All the doors are locked, and as you walk around it's clear every building in the town is the same. You ask a passing policeman what's going on and he gives you a phone book consisting just of numbers and postcodes. He also hands you the most beautiful phone you've ever seen. As you use it, its colour changes in impossible swirls and patterns. It also has a very pleasing melodic beeping sound as you dial, with a different tone for each number.

It turns out you have to dial numbers in the book and ask whoever answers where they are. Most people are in similar apartments in town. Someone tells you they have a pet shop. A few are office buildings. As you continue to dial using the stunning phone, you notice the buildings around you start to unlock their doors and you can see through the windows, and the phone miraculously gives you directions.

After a while you start realising that the businesses are generally in a couple of postcodes, people's houses in a few others, and the shops are in a couple more. You get an idea what sort of building it's likely to be by the postcode in the book. You dial for hours, enjoying the process of using the phone (although that's getting a bit boring now as it takes too long for what is often just someone's home number). Once or twice you get a cake shop or a museum, and decide to pop in for a look around and a bite to eat. Once, in your hundreds of calls, you get a beautiful little church which is a joy to walk around for a few minutes. Once you get someone's house but it's a house on the side of a hill overlooking a sandy cove, so you walk (a long way) up there - but are rewarded with a STUNNING view, which you take in for a few minutes before moving on.

*******

See, that might be an exaggeration and not borne out by the beta or the real thing. But this is what I'm afraid it will be like.
 
Yes, this worries me as well. Be mindful there are a lot of doofus yogurts on the forum who feel the need to typify the kind of exploration you're talking as such. We're not real explorers, or we're fast food explorers.

Hell, get rid of getting credits for the honk for all I care. Just show me the map, or some other visual I can use to see what's orbiting what.

Yeah, that map surely helps finding that nice ringed landable hellscape planet close to the sun and things like that. It might also be very annoying to map those 70 planet systems with four stars and planets scattered all over.
I LOVE the energy distribution thing a lot, but some kind of overview, how planets are aligned is really useful for finding all those visual treats.
 
To be fair, exploring for credits is legit too. I mean even in RL people do it to find new oilfields or whatever it is their boss wants. These things would seem (to me at least) to be narrow band stuff. One would tune the scanners to whatever and look for it.

Other people just want to see what's there. No need for fine tuning for the most part, just enough that one can see what bodies are there so they can get closer and see. Maybe take a selfie or two.

Then again, I'm personally of the opinion that a long jump range isn't needed for exploring either... It's great to get you to the start quicker and to get you home, but it does nothing for discovery.
 
*Raises hand*

I've been here since the beginning. (Ok, not quite. Tj has, but not me). Still, I remember that and I have to say - the fact that *everything* is revealed by a honk really shouldn't have been in from the get-go imho. I get why some people will miss that, but I really do think it will greatly improve the process and enjoyment of exploring *for me.* I never liked how exploration was implemented so I'm glad FD are finally adding to it.

The problem is that the system we have now has been with us for years and people are used to it. There's just no way FD can touch it without angering some people.

I can't agree with that.

IMO FD got it right at the start.

There were 3 types of scanner that a CMDR could purchase, a player had the option (given credit availability), how much of the system they wanted to be revealed upon entry.
It was their choice. Purchasing an ADS & then moaning that it made exploration too easy is nonsense...."then don't buy an ADS!!!!".

This new system removes that option, soon we'll ALL see nothing but the main Star, whether we like it or not!

Whether the 'trade off' for then not SCing to these planets, will balance this, let's wait & see.

My playstyle has always been honk to reveal, look at system map, am I staying!
 
Dear Frontier,

I have been doing some thinking about the new changes to the Discovery Scanners and whilst it looks interesting, personally the two things I don't like are:


  1. Losing the ability to get basic information about all bodies in the system with a single honk. I think many or some don't like losing that ability.
  2. Flying around in SuperCruise. Yes, I don't mind doing that even if it takes 10 minutes or more as I love flying my space ship and it's great to do that whilst watching my favorite streamers. :)

However, I do realise, however, that some don't enjoy flying round in SuperCruise for long periods of time and are excited about that part disappering. I also recognise that many, including myself, are interested in the skill required to use the new Discovery Scanner.

So here's a suggestion to hopefully suit many players:

You can change the functionality of the new Discovery Scanner in the right hand panel between 2 modes as follows (the names can be changed to better ones).


  1. Legacy Mode - this works the same way as the current scanners work. Honking gives you basic information on all bodies in the system as it does now. If you honk using this mode, you need to SuperCruise to all bodies of interest to get more detailed information as you do now.
  2. Advanced Mode - this works using the new method you are proposing in the original post of this thread.

If you choose do do this, the engineer options would need to transfer across to the new Discovery Scanner and if anyone has already done engineering on their Detailed Surface Scanner then they would need to be transfer over during the update.

Anyway, this is just a suggestion which I realise that some may want a mixture of both modes but the above is what I would be happy with.

Thanks.
 
Just wondering if it's possible for the EM spectrum widget do dah thingy to be displayed as you honk, and for it to stay up on the normal screen as you keep the honker button down?

That means on my way to sage a* or whatever, I can honk, and use the EM spectrum to work out if there are any ELW or things that interest me, then immediately jump if there isn't anything interesting.

This would actually be a time improvement, as I wouldn't have to check the system map.
A good idea.
 
Given what's been said I would suggest each planet type will have a specific signature along the graph as the SRV scanner does with rock types. They did point out IIRC that there would be overlap between them in some cases.
This would be great if not essential ... I'm just not convinced it does so yet hence the need to try and get this point seen and noted by the dev's. As a suggested alternative, how about being able to switch to different types of scanner mode other than gravitational anomalies (e.g. spectrographic analyis that allows us to focus on things like water, amonia or CO[SUB]2[/SUB] for identifying water worlds, amonia worlds of earth likes rather than just things with high mass).
 
Maybe a compromise?

Discovery Scanner
  • 'Honk' generates energy signature, and basic map outline with featureless planet place holders and 'discovered/mapped' tags
  • Energy signature interpretation tells you if there is anything worthwhile to scan
  • 'Tuning' the scanner works like the old Detailed Surface Scanner, but from a distance and a nice interface

Detailed Surface Scanner
  • Get up close in super-cruise and launch probes to map surface
  • Finds persistent POI
  • New 'first mapped by' tag

I still like the idea of a distant Nav-Beacon Interrogator module as a basic stand-in to the old Discovery Scanner, especially as default equipment for new Sidewinders, etc.
 
Meanwhile, back on page 112.

It's not just about being used to it. Here is what it is:

Now, if I travel long distances I check the system map each jump and see what the Stellar Forge has cooked up for me. This might distract me into diving into a system. So a travel session turns into an improv exploration session. I check out more systems than not having the system map at my disposal. And the shame is, with these new probe mechanics, I could be distracted once more during my distraction. It's a vortex of distraction.

If this new system is implemented, I'll just travel. I will indeed honk and scoop and scan the occasional ELW, but there's nothing to tell me: check out this system, it's a great looking system. Travel doesn't turn into an exploration event, it's just buckyballing where I am headed and that's it.

So, no, it's not just force of habit, or getting used to a new mechanic. It's about having less incentives to investigate a system.

edit: Blimey, should have realised this was 10 pages ago. Pre-empt added at beginning of the post.

Hi Ziggy.

You will be able to see! You will just see it in a different way once your brain gets around translating it. That being if they implement it properly!

*EDIT: Actually Zig - if there was an orrery - would that make it up to you?
 
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Would it be possible for Frontier to add the MAPPED BY (insert name here) to all bodies that ALREADY have the DISCOVERED BY (insert same name here) tag, when this goes live?


Just a thought.
 
Hi Ziggy.

You will be able to see! You will just see it in a different way once your brain gets around translating it. That being if they implement it properly!

*EDIT: Actually Zig - if there was an orrery - would that make it up to you?
edit: how rude of me, Hi Gypsy.

I won't be able to see. Because to see I need to know the locations of the objects relative to each other and their trajectory. Not just the type and number of objects.

An orrery would make me touch myself at night, but it would only solve the problem I talked about if it's populated after the honk.
 
with these new probe mechanics, I could be distracted once more during my distraction. It's a vortex of distraction.

If this new system is implemented, I'll just travel. I will indeed honk and scoop and scan the occasional ELW, but there's nothing to tell me: check out this system, it's a great looking system. Travel doesn't turn into an exploration event, it's just buckyballing where I am headed and that's it.

So, no, it's not just force of habit, or getting used to a new mechanic. It's about having less incentives to investigate a system.

Can't quite agree. You jump in, do the new scan and have a quick look at the graph. You then work out what the system it likely to contain. If it doesn't suit your definition of 'interesting' (which can be very subjective!) you move on, if not you do a proper scan, getting the image and then possibly do a probe scan.

Of course it's entirely possible that a 'boring system' might have something interesting on the surface of one of its 'boring planets'. So there could well be an incentive to scan those you don't like the look of.
 
Can't quite agree. You jump in, do the new scan and have a quick look at the graph. You then work out what the system it likely to contain. If it doesn't suit your definition of 'interesting' (which can be very subjective!) you move on, if not you do a proper scan, getting the image and then possibly do a probe scan.
See post above :)

Of course it's entirely possible that a boring system might have something interesting on the surface. So there could well be an incentive to scan those you don't like the look of.
edit: every system with landables might have something on the surface. So I'll just have to scan them all when I'm traveling?

See, that's not the incentive I was talking about. It's more like "while I'm down here" (no! bad!)
 
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After the novelty of the new toys wears off, players will realise that what they are "discovering" is the same old, same old, but taking more time and effort. Just a different tedium.

Except Adam has actually said there will be more things to discover, in the recent live stream at least if not on this forum.
 
Still reading this ENTIRE needlessly massive thread, including the repetitive, pointless rubbish and impatient duplicate posts from people who clearly failed to read or comprehend the OP...

Page 93 so far and already sick and tired of the whinging and crying about probe ammo being locked behind a "grind wall"...

Very simple EXAMPLE synthesis recipe for 200 probes

1x Iron (of 300)
1x Carbon (of 300)

200 x 300 refills = SIXTY THOUSAND PROBES

GET A GRIP ON YOURSELVES, CHILDREN!

[Edited for simplicity]
 
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After the novelty of the new toys wears off, players will realise that what they are "discovering" is the same old, same old, but taking more time and effort. Just a different tedium.

They explicitely said there will be new things to find in space and on planets, cause they made new stuff and would populate the galaxy with those. Beside that, yeah, the game is realistic so yeah, lots of rocks, gas giants, ELW, Ammonia worlds and the like since it is what's out there in our galaxy ^^'
 
Still reading this ENTIRE needlessly massive thread, including the repetitive, pointless rubbish and impatient duplicate posts from people who clearly failed to read or comprehend the OP...

Page 93 so far and already sick and tired of the whinging and crying about probe ammo being locked behind a "grind wall"...

Very simple example synthesis recipe for 200 probes

1x Iron (of 300)
1x Carbon (of 300)

200 x 300 refills = SIXTY THOUSAND PROBES

GET A GRIP ON YOURSELVES, CHILDREN!
Considering they haven't worked out what the synth recipe is yet, I think you might be a little over-enthusiastic in slinging this stuff about.
 
Rightho FD.

A question on behalf of Ziggy, myself and others:
How hard will it be to discern relative positions, trajectory ,size and properties of objects using the new wave system?

I think that's a fair enough question.
 
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