News Chapter Four - Exploration Reveal

[Cobra1984]

Can one of the Fdevs maybe comment if there is more to be announced regarding exploration or if the scanner mechanic is pretty much the height of it.

Thanks Fdevs.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Then I don't see any point in Fdev starting this thread, if that's the case then they just want to create the illusion that our opinion matters.

During the live stream they told us they have read the concerns, and would take it into consideration. It's all we can ask for. At the end of the day, they are the only ones who have the knowledge in what way changes can impact their designs.

The impression I got was that there were quite a few wrinkles which needed ironing out. For instance, how are we going to know whether something was already discovered by another CMDR? Plus we never got to see the mechanism in action, even in a pre-staged environment, which hints that nothing is set in stone yet.

 

[Ian Phillips]

Can one of the Fdevs maybe comment if there is more to be announced regarding exploration or if the scanner mechanic is pretty much the height of it.

Thanks Fdevs.

So far it would appear that they are planning to talk more about what is to come in Q4 in a livestream after 4 oct. So probably 10 oct.

 

[GJ51]

If scan ranges are limited, how many distant objects may never get discovered even when the system is visited? How far do you travel before you conclude that there's nothing left to find?

I've seen secondary stars 400k+ LS from the primary.

Do those no longer get explored? Even if there, how would you know? Which direction?

 

[Cobra1984]

So far it would appear that they are planning to talk more about what is to come in Q4 in a livestream after 4 oct. So probably 10 oct.

Thanks Ian

 

[Habu2u]

Thank you for that Micha, you worded it far better than I did but said pretty much the same thing. Nav panel is not a replacement for system map. We now will have to scan as well. In the end though it simply means that every player has to do this not just the explorers for who it is supposedly intended.

Let me be honest, I have no problem with this for exploration as I do a bit myself. I can live with the new system when I go out there. But to hit every single player with it is a game changer. There are many who will not follow this post because it is for explorers and will have no idea what is planned.

Not sure why you think it's going to hit everyone else that's staying in the bubble doing trading/mining/etc. They can do without the new system unless they want to mess around with it. Otherwise, just buy the system information from the galmap when they set up their route, or scan the nav beacon once they enter the final system to which they're going. Not quite as "one button" as currently done, but hardly a major hurdle to get their information.
Regards

 

[Genar-Hofoen]

If scan ranges are limited, how many distant objects may never get discovered even when visited? How far do you travel before you conclude that there's nothing left to find?

I've seen secondary stars 400k+ LYS from the primary.

Do those no longer get explored? Even if there, how would you know? Which direction?

I guess we wait a week or so for more answers.

 

[znôrt]

The impression I got was that there were quite a few wrinkles which needed ironing out.

the impression i got is that they just made all this up, had nothing more than a few ideas and two crappy screenshots, and are brainstorming right now. oh, and that sandro has given way to a successor. wait & see.

 

[dayrth]

Are you sure? I could have sworn that Adam had stated that on one at Frontier had tested it in VR yet, and that he said they'd look into that promptly?

What he said was that he had not tested it (implying that he did not know if anyone had tested it) and he would look in to it. He did not say that it had not been tested.

 

[Brian of Ardagh]

If scan ranges are limited, how many distant objects may never get discovered even when the system is visited? How far do you travel before you conclude that there's nothing left to find?

I've seen secondary stars 400k+ LS from the primary.

Do those no longer get explored? Even if there, how would you know? Which direction?

Adam stated that the new DSS range isn't decided but that doesn't prevent you from getting closer to a more distant object to get a scan. I also think that the number of objects in the system isn't an unknown quantity, one screenshot shows number of bodies mapped so the total is known somewhere. I think the key is the number of energy signatures in the scan panel.

One thing that came to mind was the Nav Panel, today when you honk you know how many objects are discovered and in the Nav Panel you get a list of all objects and their distance from your current location. Will the panel show no objects until the energy signatures are resolved?

I guess we will need to wait for further clarification before we know the extent of the proposed changes.

 

[askavir]

the impression i got is that they just made all this up, had nothing more than a few ideas and two crappy screenshots, and are brainstorming right now.

This ^^^

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

…aside from when you dismissed something based on multiple false claims. Or when you dismissed something based on assumptions of how the UI will work (because it's not finished yet, and we don't know). Just because you don't like the word or don't like the inescapable fact that you express biases does not mean I'm making things up.


False.

We have less information unless we're talking about completely different circumstances, which was the whole point you tried — and hilariously failed — to dismiss. Again, this is just a fact and moving the goalposts does not alter that fact. If anything, trying to do so just further shows the truth of it. It even says so right in the OP. If you want to prove FDev wrong on this point, go right ahead. [haha]


…and your explanation was demonstrated to be irrelevant to the context of the discussion. Before, you had all the information you needed for the activities and decisions being discussed; afterwards, you do not have that information. Period. If you think otherwise, please quote the part of the OP or the presentation that supports that — the part where they say that the new honk populates the system map and provides all the HUD markers that tell you where the planets are. You know, the part where the new system does not blindfold you compared to the old one and forces you to play the minigame to slowly loosen that blindfold but instead reveals all that navigation and body information from the get-go.

If you can't do that, then at least have the decency to accept the fact that you are wrong. You don't even have to make a big show of it — just accept it.


Good. Finally. Then don't dismiss what people say just because you don't like the conclusion or because your interpretation of the unknowns suggest the possibility of something unrelated.


Again, the wordplay does not alter the reality of what you're doing — it just make it look worse.


…and yet, you've made unfounded assumptions about numerous things unrelated to mechanics. Nice attempt trying to sneak that shift in there, though. You've made assumption about how access to information will affect the minigame, even though you don't know how the minigame will work yet. You've made assumptions about what people know and about the sufficiency of this knowledge, even though you've made factually incorrect statements that demonstrate that you aren't even fully aware of the systems you're discussing. You've even implied that your judgement of what counts as “fully informed” is some kind of objective truth, which is as huge and as unfounded an assumption as they come.

Your dismissal of criticisms based on your subjective (in many cases inaccurate) assumptions of what is known and not, and your acceptance of support that must by necessity equally rely on unknowns has everything to do with bias. It is a bias. And again, that's fine: just own it. It's when you try to dismiss your biases as actually being some kind of objective truth that you run into problems. Well, that, and when you have to resort to personal attacks because your other arguments aren't holding up. Neither gain nor need is a factor in this — it's just a fact of life.

My god man. You should listen yourself. Saying I moved goal posts when I set them there in the first place. That's classic.

Where have I made unfounded assumptions regarding this mechanic.

You are just and and out lying now so please stop.

Most of your post is just utter gibberish as it does not apply to what I have ever said.

As to personal attacks, what personal attacks?

I think you need to have a long look in the mirror as the only person that is making it personal is you at the moment. I have no idea what your issues are with me. I wasn't even talking to you then, and you start replying to stuff which you didn't even understand and was not pointed at you.

So please tell me what these assumptions are that I have made.

No intact don't bother I have no wish to talk to you as you are being dishonest at the moment.

 

[Dutchman141]

During the live stream they told us they have read the concerns, and would take it into consideration. It's all we can ask for. At the end of the day, they are the only ones who have the knowledge in what way changes can impact their designs.

The impression I got was that there were quite a few wrinkles which needed ironing out. For instance, how are we going to know whether something was already discovered by another CMDR? Plus we never got to see the mechanism in action, even in a pre-staged environment, which hints that nothing is set in stone yet.

I know they're reading the forums, it was my reply to Eagleboy who gave me the impression that Fdev will do what they want in disregard of what our opinion is.

We have seen far to little to make a good verdict, wether it be positive or negative, it's just that what I've seen so far is not what I'd like.

 

[shreddog]

I assume you are kidding around

My attempt at satire

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

I know they're reading the forums, it was my reply to Max who gave me the impression that Fdev will do what they want in disregard of what our opinion is.

We have seen far to little to make a good verdict, wether it be positive or negative, it's just that what I've seen so far is not what I'd like.

Why on earth did you think that. I never implied that. As to our opinion which our do you mean? The people that are positive or the people that are negative or the people that see potential in it but could see some tweaks to make it better for most people's play styles.

 

[Tippis]

My god man. You should listen yourself. Saying I moved goal posts when I set them there in the first place.

Lolno. The goal posts were set by Genar-Hofoen. You objected by moving them (and being wrong about a number of things). Time does not run in reverse — “first place” is not second on the ball.

Where have I made unfounded assumptions regarding this mechanic.

Here, here, and here, notably.

You are just and and out lying now so please stop.

Most of your post is just utter gibberish as it does not apply to what I have ever said.

As to personal attacks, what personal attacks?

[…]

No intact don't bother I have no wish to talk to you as you are being dishonest at the moment.

It's so handy when I can just quote a whole section to provide the answer to that section.

 

[Cobra1984]

the impression i got is that they just made all this up, had nothing more than a few ideas and two crappy screenshots, and are brainstorming right now. oh, and that sandro has given way to a successor. wait & see.

It does seem like there's an awful lot missing. It's not an exploration update whatsoever and my initial reaction was that they're just doing the minimum to keep the game ticking along.

Not the impression I had from the expo presentation.

 

[LeoBartlet]

the impression i got is that they just made all this up, had nothing more than a few ideas and two crappy screenshots, and are brainstorming right now. oh, and that sandro has given way to a successor. wait & see.

I believe it was said during the stream that the dev leading this was only put on the job a few weeks ago. Now it's entirely possible that work had been planned on done on this feature before he took charge of it or in typical Frontier fashion work only started a few weeks ago.

 

[Han Zulu]

Qohen, who made the mock up of that cockpit UI with all of the nice extra exploration info? I love it, that would be fantastic to have in game!

I've often wished Elite had a customizable UI much like World of Warcraft has, where we can move UI windows around and even make visual mods for it. That would add so much uniqueness and usefulness to the game.

Agree. My current setup is with 4 monitors. Three of them to make a 5000-pix wide screen, and an auxiliary screen for 3rd party tools below the other ones, and it would be really cool if I could have the dashboard on that one and let the wide-screen only show the cockpit.

 

[disorganise]

Did anyone stop to think the mystery body game is actually already (sort of)
there?

Next time you jump into a system, do not open the system map. Instead, use the navigation panel to make your decision as to whether to stay and scan or not. Only once you're done scanning are you allowed to open the system map.
Try it for half a dozen systems or so. But don't cheat.
Sure, the new proposed system avoids the travel to do the scans, and that's a good thing. And it involves a bit more than point and wait which is also a good thing. (and also adds the new gui etc rather than a list of unexplored bodies and their distance)
Anyways... It just occurred to me whilst still catching up through the thread. As you were...