the FSS, watching paint dry....

[Rat Catcher]

Frankly I'm just glad the conversation has finally moved on from understanding that it didn't need to be removed to the actual meat of the debate - justifying putting them back in.

Only took 158 pages for someone to get there

I missed that understanding, or is such understanding only with those who believe that it should never have been removed in the first place? From my reading of the 160 pages such an accord appears missing, but I suppose I could have missed it.

 

[Ralph Vargr]

I think functionality, equivalent to an old basic scanner, will be restored.

It's not too OP for the True Explorers, and gives the little explorers a chance.

 

[Burke]

Adapt or stop playing.

Tut tut. Why is it always with the anti crowd its exclusive? Why cant we have the side by side system that makes everybody happy? The FSS has plenty of reason to exist outside of the system map.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

Neither of us know how it works Max, what's important is what it does. And what it does (an ADS module) is functionally the same as what happens right now in the game if you visit a system that is new to you but previously fully explored by another player or pre-populated (like Sol).

It isn't the same though. It is similar, but not the same.

The ADS & FSS are entirely compatible, again we can see this in the current game simply by visiting a system as I describe in the previous paragraph.

That was added so that people know that the system has been explored and it does make some kind of sense too. It also only shows up the planets that have been scanned and tagged so you could turn up do the honk and only the star and a few planets have been found, the rest of the 20 or 30 wouldn't have been, so not it isn't the same at all.

Inarguably there was no benefit to removing the ADS. I argue it (and the BDS/IDS) should be put back into the game ASAP. It's too late to add them back into player ships but they can still be added back into outfitting and newly bought ships including the startwinder & freewinder.

It isn't inarguably. It is already contestable. You try to dismiss stuff when you don't really know the facts. Sorry but nope, I think they did the correct thing in getting rid of the ADS, IDS and BDS. It is a horrible mechanic in my view and shouldn't have been in the game from the beginning. Having two completely different exploration mechanics in the game is just asking for trouble and confusion when new players start.

 

[Burke]

You try searching FSS in google. You will be spending a long time finding anything about it and ED.

hehehe

 

[Rat Catcher]

Have you actually used the new process in unexplored space yet? The difference is pretty obvious.

Not really, only for about the last 50KLy, and yes the difference is pretty obvious, I have to interact with the game to be given a system map / orrery view rather than hold a button. The odd thing is that for some completely unfathomable reason these obvious changes appear to add something that wasn't there previously.

You were kind enough to post your method of getting through the FSS as rapidly as possible which demonstrated you have no issue understanding how to use the system, despite your loathing of it. I can even understand (in a very limited way) your continuing demands to lose a mechanism you, personally, find distasteful, but understanding your point of view doesn't alter mine.

In your comments regarding the re-insertion of ADS code being a simple operation should one assume that you have the needed programming skills to make such an assertion with confidence?

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

Tut tut. Why is it always with the anti crowd its exclusive? Why cant we have the side by side system that makes everybody happy? The FSS has plenty of reason to exist outside of the system map.

Please don't snipe my posts. I believe that is against the forum rules. By doing that you have completely misrepresented my post.

 

[Old Duck]

I think functionality, equivalent to an old basic scanner, will be restored. It's not too OP for the True Explorers, and gives the little explorers a chance.

I'm a True Explorer (literally the leader of TREX Squadron), and it is too OP for me. Whatever functionality is "restored" needs to be done in a separate, optional module. I've grown to accept that some people are tourists, but as a True Explorer, I don't want to be forced to use "Google Galaxy" (aka: ADS).

 

[Ralph Vargr]

I'm in Stage 5, and I have adapted to the new exploration system by flying towards anything I can see/detect. I like flying.

Frontier will not substantially change this mechanic, unless something goes more wrong than the Gnosis, or the holiday season.

Everyone can now calm down.

 

[Burke]

Please don't snipe my posts. I believe that is against the forum rules. By doing that you have completely misrepresented my post.

Im genuinely lost. If i broke any rules it was not intentional. I dont think i misrepresented you at all. Not like the first time you and others have come out with that in this thread.

 

[Ralph Vargr]

I'm a True Explorer (literally the leader of TREX Squadron), and it is too OP for me. Whatever "functionality" is "restored" needs to be done in a separate, optional module. I've grown to accept that some people are tourists, but I don't want to be forced to use "Google Galaxy" (aka: ADS).

Old Duck, I'm not singling you out. Your workaround has merit. You are constructive.

There *are* members of Beige Squadron who have been sent to the tool room, or policing the grounds for cigarette butts...

 

[Old Duck]

I'm in Stage 5

Of grieving?

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

Im genuinely lost. If i broke any rules it was not intentional. I dont think i misrepresented you at all. Not like the first time you and others have come out with that in this thread.

Maybe read my whole post and you will see that you have.

Here is the full post for you to see how:

There are a lot of assumptions going on here. Making the modules available doesn't work like that. The code has changed dramitcally. The module is a piece of code itself which need to talk to other bits of code. If that code has changed (which it may well have) so it can talk to the FSS code then there will be issues. None of us fully know how the code works. Just because it looks the same or similar from the outside doesn't mean it is the same on the inside.

The ADS and the FSS are not compatible with each other. So it needs to be one or the other. As the FSS is built in now, there will be no old style ADS from what I can tell. All I can say is sorry mate, but I really can't see it happening anytime soon or ever. Adapt or stop playing. Try to think of suggestions to make the current FSS more streamlined and better for your style of exploration instead of trying to bypass it entirely, as I think that will more likely be taken seriously. I think these are your only options I am afraid.

I never once said I was against having both systems in place (as long as they are mutually exclusive). I just pointed the issues that there are concerning that and why I don't think FDev will do it and why I think people need to adapt instead and come up with solutions with the new system to make their experience better.

So yes you did completely misrepresent me.

 

[Riverside]

Not really, only for about the last 50KLy, and yes the difference is pretty obvious, I have to interact with the game to be given a system map / orrery view rather than hold a button. The odd thing is that for some completely unfathomable reason these obvious changes appear to add something that wasn't there previously.

You were kind enough to post your method of getting through the FSS as rapidly as possible which demonstrated you have no issue understanding how to use the system, despite your loathing of it. I can even understand (in a very limited way) your continuing demands to lose a mechanism you, personally, find distasteful, but understanding your point of view doesn't alter mine.

In your comments regarding the re-insertion of ADS code being a simple operation should one assume that you have the needed programming skills to make such an assertion with confidence?

Ratkatcher, I have at no point made any suggestion that any of the new stuff be removed, and my position has not changed since my first post in this thread on page 6. My argument has nothing to do with the new stuff, only that the old stuff did not need to be removed and should be reinstated. I have made this clear in the majority of my posts for the avoidance of doubt.

In terms of Max's ultimatum to adapt or stop playing clearly I have adapted. My lack of understanding of how the new system works is not a part of the case I state.

The old stuff didn't need to be removed. They were needlessly removed, reducing player agency. In my view this should be corrected at the earliest opportunity.

 

[sewerratuk]

Ratkatcher, I have at no point made any suggestion that any of the new stuff be removed, and my position has not changed since my first post in this thread on page 6. My argument has nothing to do with the new stuff, only that the old stuff did not need to be removed and should be reinstated. I have made this clear is the majority of my posts for the avoidance of doubt.

In terms of Max's ultimatum to adapt or stop playing clearly I have adapted. My lack of understanding of how the new system works is not a part of the case I state.

The old stuff didn't need to be removed. They were needlessly removed, reducing player agency. In my view this should be corrected at the earliest opportunity.

Sounds like a fairly similar argument to instant ship transfers and SC micro jumps. There was a case for having both in the game so that people could get on with enjoying the stuff they wanted but look how those turned out.
Good luck with this one anyway

 

[Burke]

Sounds like a fairly similar argument to instant ship transfers and SC micro jumps. There was a case for having both in the game so that people could get on with enjoying the stuff they wanted but look how those turned out.
Good luck with this one anyway

For reasons i dont even really understand myself i brought my badly fitted asp x back from colonia for somwhere close to 30m. I think it was like 64 hours or something.

 

[CMDR acutefrenzy]

yeah exactly. Again and again the old explorers are just written off like they never existed. Fdev did it aswell. Astounded.

What is it that's been written off though? You can still honk. Now you need to resolve the energy signatures into planets, not just be gifted them... Its just a bit more involved, and you don't even have to waste time flying to planets you don't want to see. The issue here is that poor placeholder mechanics were all we had available and people have got used to the ease and speed that you could exploit them.
The community has been asking for more involvement in all aspects of the game. We got it. What is the problem? How have Fdev written you off? They've given you more to do. Improved your chosen career.

You don't see the Enterprise warping into 14 separate systems on a single stardate frantically scanning everything and jumping again before the nacelles have cooled.

Exploration: the action of exploring an unfamiliar area.
Investigation, study, survey, research

At no point would any description of exploration advocate ease or speed.

 

[Burke]

They've given you more to do. Improved your chosen career.

I didnt require more to do. While some complained it was boring or too difficult some of us was out and about. What you call improvment was the surgical removal of my playstyle.

At no point would any description of exploration advocate ease or speed.

Uh oh here we go. If i spent the rest of my life at it i still wouldnt make a dent. Is that not difficult enough? The greatest time sink in the history of gaming and you need more.

 

[EnemyTrait]

Hardened explorers and gamers: We have both. So yeah, a compromise that works for both styles would be ideal.
Why some are arguing which should be out is beyond me.

-At least they can't mess up shadowing on a blue blob mini-game.

 

[Rat Catcher]

Ratkatcher, I have at no point made any suggestion that any of the new stuff be removed, and my position has not changed since my first post in this thread on page 6. My argument has nothing to do with the new stuff, only that the old stuff did not need to be removed and should be reinstated. I have made this clear is the majority of my posts for the avoidance of doubt.

In terms of Max's ultimatum to adapt or stop playing clearly I have adapted. My lack of understanding of how the new system works is not a part of the case I state.

The old stuff didn't need to be removed. They were needlessly removed, reducing player agency. In my view this should be corrected at the earliest opportunity.

I agree totally with you and have never made a point otherwise - you have never suggested that the new system be removed, if I have indicated otherwise I will retract that indication with good grace.

The only point I have been debating is in the 'unnecessary removal' of the ADS and its simple replacement (paraphrasing your own indications) alongside the FSS mechanic. If it had been the developers desire to have 2 systems, surely the new system would have been an option, as it isn't one might assume that despite similarities in final function they might otherwise be incompatible?