Just a point of clarification, the FSS gives you the system map as well. What you are alluding to is those that want the system map immediately, not 15 seconds after the honk, not 1 minute after the honk, but immediately after the 5 second honk has completed. This discussion isn't about getting the system map via the ADS or the FSS, it is about a delay, abit a very short delay, that some are unwilling to tolerate.
Anti ADS people JUSTIFY your no compromise stance here.
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Just a point of clarification, the FSS gives you the system map as well. What you are alluding to is those that want the system map immediately, not 15 seconds after the honk, not 1 minute after the honk, but immediately after the 5 second honk has completed. This discussion isn't about getting the system map via the ADS or the FSS, it is about a delay, abit a very short delay, that some are unwilling to tolerate.
Yes. I wasn't clear enough, sorry.
No my friend, it wouldn't.
You see I love racing games, My favourite is a Highly modified (who's isn't) GTR2 and I race EVERY SINGLE LAP and drive the in lap of every test session for the sake of immersion, and though there is a pitlane control system I choose my own speed and direction... No, I love my racing and winning comes a distant second.
Games/Sims are about enjoyment...
When the fun stops Stop
Okay I will answer this bias thread, but wondering where your thread "Anti FSS people JUSTIFY your failure to adapt here'
To answer your question: Yes I am against compromise. FD made the decision to deem the ADS obsolete, in their view the FSS does everything the ADS was capable of doing with the additional benefit of the FSS being tied in to many other aspects of the game, I consider it part of the core gameplay for not only what we currently have been given but strongly suspect it will be required for future expansions, i.e. atmospheric landings. I believe that FD felt that having both the old ADS and the FSS would lead to problems down track, in that they will expect all players to have access to certain tools, in this case the FSS (and new DSS). If they bought back the ADS in any form it may lead to calls for dilution of the current capabilities of the FSS which may cause problems.
I know all of what I have just said is speculation, and that you and others will belittle what I have said, but you asked a question and I answered!
Yes, and not only that, I do remember FDev very simply claiming that the ADS did not satisfy/fit in with their vision of exploration - and that is really all that matters. All this noise about a compromise is just noise. I've seen different suggested 'compromises', I even suggested a non-compromise (engineering options for the FSS), but to no surprise, no single 'compromise' satisfies all the devoted ADSers - many of them don't actually seem to want to compromise, they just want what they want. Does that make them selfish and anti-compromise too?
The ADS was good at discovering terraformable.
I actually think the ADS required a tad more skill than the the FSS, particularly discovering aforementioned terraformable and earth likes. Ok, knowin a G start with a radius of 1.0 would have the habital zone at 500LS was actually the only bit of information you needed, none the less judging the potential reward using stellar classification of the start and distance required a little more thought than the FSS. It was the only way to discover terraforambles just outside the habital zone. I am sure there are those with better astronomy skills than me that could milk even more info out of the ADS.
FD did a good job of balancing payout. My income per hour of exploration/1000LY are both roughly the same.
Having said that, for the surface gains of the FSS alone, there is no way I would want to go back. I have seen so many more cool sites on the planet surface since 3.3. If you are not an Horizons owner, .... YMMV
Cheers
Simon
I actually think the ADS required a tad more skill than the the FSS, particularly discovering aforementioned terraformable and earth likes. Ok, knowin a G start with a radius of 1.0 would have the habital zone at 500LS was actually the only bit of information you needed, none the less judging the potential reward using stellar classification of the start and distance required a little more thought than the FSS. It was the only way to discover terraforambles just outside the habital zone. I am sure there are those with better astronomy skills than me that could milk even more info out of the ADS.
FD did a good job of balancing payout. My income per hour of exploration/1000LY are both roughly the same.
Having said that, for the surface gains of the FSS alone, there is no way I would want to go back. I have seen so many more cool sites on the planet surface since 3.3. If you are not an Horizons owner, .... YMMV
Cheers
Simon
Seriously i dont even know why i spend my time with a hardcore fanboi like you but.. who asked for a downgrade?
Dont answer...
The holes in your bucket are assuming that I've never played Skyrim before and or being in a 'New' start, many people that still play Skyrim are playing over and over and over, it's about enjoyment and for many current Skyrim players 'continued' enjoyment...
So when I go to HH I walk, and when I go back I WALK...
Well if you INSIST:
I might have to program a macro for copying and pasting this! Seriously, we don't need yet another thread on the topic.
The following is a prerecorded message in response to any and all threads that fall under the topic “The FSS Is $NEGATIVE_DESCRIPTION_OF_FSS_AND_RELATED_TOOLS”.
As a serious explorer, I personally love the FSS and related tools. When I drop out of hyperspace, I’m entering an entirely new and potentially undiscovered solar system. I mean, wow! Once I refuel my ship, I put a little distance between me and the star, then I “park” the ship, pop out of my pilot’s chair and go over to my science station (cue slide of Mr. Spock looking into his scanner). This is a seamless transition, like getting into my SRV.
This “science station” is the output of a visual, radio, and gravimetric telescope array built into my ship’s sensors. It sees 3D space around my ship, with the ability to zoom in and focus on specific objects in the solar system. In order to automatically focus in on a specific object (focusing over long distances is no trivial task), I need to match the frequency of the telescope’s focal algorithm to that of the planet or signal – the “tuning the dial” part of the procedure. This lets me zoom in and focus both optically and radiometricly to both “see” the planet and generate detailed statistics. Like Galileo, once I “discover” a planet using my telescope, I get credit for that discovery, assuming I’m the first.
Speaking of discovery, I really like that the system map remains unpopulated until I actually find, magnify, and catalog a planet. I was never a fan of the “Google Galaxy” map view we automatically were given with the ADS. That’s not discovery, that’s tourism.
Now I can continue to scan the entire system from this parked location, or I can choose to immediately go to a planet of interest and map it. One of the advantages of the latter is that my ship will automatically detect and catalog any planets nearby. So for example, if I select a gas giant with a dozen moons, I just need to scan the GG in the FSS, and then fly to the GG and the moons will be all scanned and cataloged using the close-range sensors, thus greatly reducing my time using the FSS. Not mandatory, but it’s a cool little trick for CMDRs who like having a reason to fly to planets to explore them.
I personally find the FSS very similar to real-life stargazing. I scan the sky IRL with my high-powered binoculars, finding planets and stars of interest, then crosscheck them using my astronomical software, which gives me a page of statistics. Then I can go visit them in my SUV….. Wait, forget that last part.
It is possible to be very fast and efficient using the FSS with practice. That said, I actually enjoy the extra time it takes me to scan and catalog a system, followed by mapping and even landing on planets of interest. It adds a sense of immersion, accomplishment, depth, and scale that was sorely lacking before 3.3 dropped.
That’s not to say I find the FSS and DSS to be perfect. I have a list of very minor changes and adjustments I’d like made to the FSS, DSS, and Analysis HUD. But I find the concepts Frontier implemented to be fun, engaging, immersive, brilliant!
Now there are those who want the old ADS back, or worse, want to integrate ADS functionality into the FSS for everyone. I would accept the ADS being brought back as the optional, expensive module that takes up an additional slot, just like it used to be, adding its features to the FSS when installed. The key word there is OPTIONAL.
This concludes my defense of the Full Spectrum System Scanner.
As a serious explorer, I personally love the FSS and related tools. When I drop out of hyperspace, I’m entering an entirely new and potentially undiscovered solar system. I mean, wow! Once I refuel my ship, I put a little distance between me and the star, then I “park” the ship, pop out of my pilot’s chair and go over to my science station (cue slide of Mr. Spock looking into his scanner). This is a seamless transition, like getting into my SRV.
This “science station” is the output of a visual, radio, and gravimetric telescope array built into my ship’s sensors. It sees 3D space around my ship, with the ability to zoom in and focus on specific objects in the solar system. In order to automatically focus in on a specific object (focusing over long distances is no trivial task), I need to match the frequency of the telescope’s focal algorithm to that of the planet or signal – the “tuning the dial” part of the procedure. This lets me zoom in and focus both optically and radiometricly to both “see” the planet and generate detailed statistics. Like Galileo, once I “discover” a planet using my telescope, I get credit for that discovery, assuming I’m the first.
Speaking of discovery, I really like that the system map remains unpopulated until I actually find, magnify, and catalog a planet. I was never a fan of the “Google Galaxy” map view we automatically were given with the ADS. That’s not discovery, that’s tourism.
Now I can continue to scan the entire system from this parked location, or I can choose to immediately go to a planet of interest and map it. One of the advantages of the latter is that my ship will automatically detect and catalog any planets nearby. So for example, if I select a gas giant with a dozen moons, I just need to scan the GG in the FSS, and then fly to the GG and the moons will be all scanned and cataloged using the close-range sensors, thus greatly reducing my time using the FSS. Not mandatory, but it’s a cool little trick for CMDRs who like having a reason to fly to planets to explore them.
I personally find the FSS very similar to real-life stargazing. I scan the sky IRL with my high-powered binoculars, finding planets and stars of interest, then crosscheck them using my astronomical software, which gives me a page of statistics. Then I can go visit them in my SUV….. Wait, forget that last part.
It is possible to be very fast and efficient using the FSS with practice. That said, I actually enjoy the extra time it takes me to scan and catalog a system, followed by mapping and even landing on planets of interest. It adds a sense of immersion, accomplishment, depth, and scale that was sorely lacking before 3.3 dropped.
That’s not to say I find the FSS and DSS to be perfect. I have a list of very minor changes and adjustments I’d like made to the FSS, DSS, and Analysis HUD. But I find the concepts Frontier implemented to be fun, engaging, immersive, brilliant!
Now there are those who want the old ADS back, or worse, want to integrate ADS functionality into the FSS for everyone. I would accept the ADS being brought back as the optional, expensive module that takes up an additional slot, just like it used to be, adding its features to the FSS when installed. The key word there is OPTIONAL.
This concludes my defense of the Full Spectrum System Scanner.
I might have to program a macro for copying and pasting this! Seriously, we don't need yet another thread on the topic.
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I'm not anti-ADS, and I'm quite happy on all kinds of compromises, however ... I am pro superiour brilliant solutions: https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php/471067-FSS-ADS-and-SLBS
But the compromise keeps both camps happy, don't want the full reveal at honk, don't buy the ADS, want it buy the ADS. Amount of data the ADS honk returns could be scaled back to a reasonable compromise I think
hmm "Hence threads like this one", no not really I like the FSS and the new gameplay. This thread has come about because I sympathise with those not liking the new fss. I sort of agree that if this had been in from the start things would be different, but people would STILL be griping about gameplay they didn't like and suggesting better methods.
Actually no, the various "compromises" are more a lose/lose than a win/win.
We're gamers. This is not the same as sportsmen. Along with "for the love of the game" there's this streak in all of us (even though some of us prefer to resist it) to zero in on the "best" technique to accomplish anything. Unfortunately in any compromise that allows both the old ADS functionality and the new FSS gameplay the "best" or "most efficient" approach to exploration would be neither fish nor fowl, using parts of one or the other's functionality. I can quite understand FD wanting to avoid that becoming the "norm" so ensured it would be a complete replacement of the ADS rather than attempting an incoherent phased approach or some hybrid.
Given that, however, it can never be a question of compromise. It can only be a choice between keeping the placeholder and introducing the new gameplay. And FD made their choice for their game.
It is quite simple.
The FSS system opens up the gameplay to all people,
not just those fitting a DSS scanner.
The FSS overlay gives options to gameplay,
you can either look directly for specific objects,
scan the whole system and get info directly on screen
or even passively resolve the data by travelling through.
Especially checking USSes which now spawn new after
the initially generated USSes timed out with the FSS is a boon.
The FSS system opens up the gameplay to all people,
not just those fitting a DSS scanner.
The FSS overlay gives options to gameplay,
you can either look directly for specific objects,
scan the whole system and get info directly on screen
or even passively resolve the data by travelling through.
Especially checking USSes which now spawn new after
the initially generated USSes timed out with the FSS is a boon.
The ADS meant there was no process involved in exploring a system, if it returned, this would again be the case.
This design isn't great, as there is no actual "thing" to do in this part of the game.
If the ADS exists, this will always be the case from a design standpoint.
So my reason is, putting the ADS back in is moving backwards in design of the game.
This design isn't great, as there is no actual "thing" to do in this part of the game.
If the ADS exists, this will always be the case from a design standpoint.
So my reason is, putting the ADS back in is moving backwards in design of the game.
No, with just the FSS you honk, open it up, tune into the frequency of the high-value object but then you have to look around in the FSS to find that object.
With the ADS available as well as the FSS, you honk, open up the system map, select the high value object, rotate your ship until you are pointing directly at that object, open up the FSS and you are then directly facing that object in the FSS, which means no hunting is required. One can easily use the combination of the ADS and FSS in that way to quickly scan a high-value object even if it's 30 mins flying time away.
You can see this for yourself by doing the above in the bubble in a system you haven't explored, but others have, where the system map does get populated. I know as I have done this a few times in the bubble as an experiment to prove the method.
If you really don't like the FSS and want the old ADS method back I don't see the problem with the ADS disabling the FSS.
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Yes, of course we find the "best way", but one that works specifically for us. This isn't a PvP meta, it's about playstyle choices.
If they were to bring back the ADS as a separate module, I still wouldn't use it. Whatever "advantage" it confers by showing a populated system map is outweighed by the fact that it's wasting a precious module slot, and using/adding extra power and weight to my build. Neither of which I want.
So no, not everyone would be using both for the "optimal" build. I'd venture to say that not even the majority would, given the trade-offs.
Plus there's always this option:
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Its toxic stuff like that explains why you are getting annoyed by my opinion on your offtopic personal gripe. Different opinions are a thing, you should try to get used to that if you use forums.
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