missed the point didn't ya...
Tbh, your post was a bit rambly.
Maybe sum up your point in one sentence?
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Tbh, your post was a bit rambly.
Maybe sum up your point in one sentence?
There needs to be no reason in a PvP game. But if you bring sharks and carebears together there better be. It isn't a FFA killfest in ED. Not every NPC attacks "just because they can". If you design your game you have to figure out whether you want total carnage or a setting that makes some sort of sense with lore and story.
If you allow pilots being killed thousands of lightyears "just because they can" you can as well kick all that lore and setting in the bucket, because it makes no sense anymore anyway, unleash the restrictions of the NPC behaviour and make it a FFA throughout the game.
You make it sound as if Rinzlers video is the video from The Ring
If you watch it 3 times, Rinzler reaches out from the screen and pinches your nose.
i Wish i could, but i never got into the 'twitter' generation, and cant condense what i'm saying. Something things take more than a sentence, else we end up explaining the meaning of one sentence for 50 posts.
I do my best to explain a point without misleading people, so that we don't go down pointless avenues (still working on that).... but these days, people scan read and see what they want
You make it sound as if Rinzlers video is the video from The Ring
If you watch it 3 times, Rinzler reaches out from the screen and pinches your nose.
Be nice if there were a few more stats on the player page
Time in Open/solo/PG : Second account (100% open)
Death to play : Second account (0 deaths to players)
And already got a nice set of ships, half the engineers unlocked and my FSD boost, all in open. Love the challenge
we can’ all be as skilful and generally wonderful I am
.some people seem to assume, when I’m making a case it because It’s in my interests… Nah, half the time it because a topic needs balance
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That is certainly bad - and, frankly, if it was up to me I'd just set it up so the game didn't award credits for doing stuff that had already been done - but at least PP is still "alive" and redeemable.
In a "worst case scenario", the people who do enjoy it would be driven away and it'd die completely, giving FDev no reason to try and redeem it.
It's strange but when I read your post I hear it in the voice of Donald Trump
How so? It's a very reasonable and accurate statement
We discussed this a little on lave Radio last night with the most excellent Nat's Wright and Obsidian Ant.
Now before I start let me define a 'Griefer' to be a player who is out to spoil the enjoyment of others players, so Murder Hoboing, Seal Clubbing or people who UA bomb stations that had been set aside for people doing a charity run for cancer, would all come under that category. Pirates, Powerplay PvPs or people trying to blockade CGs would not be griefers in my opinion. There is also a borderline case of people working a certain player faction who are in conflict with another player faction could be considered another exception as well.
There was a lot of recommendations but one of the most surprising was from Shan and Nat; people who Min/Max their explorer builds for jump range are putting themselves at risk; especially against the combat ships. Nat was explaining that she'd altered her build to make the ship as fast as possible in real space for the loss of half a light year of range. That way you outrun the attacker and get away. She did it quite successfully in open a few days ago, much to the complaint of the griefers at the time. That is one solution because a lot of players when they start out Max/Min and then are surprised when they're ship doesn't stand a chance against a purpose built griefing ship. You have to remember that pirate ships are different because they have to put space aside for cargo and hatchbreakers, so a probably balanced trader vs Pirate is a bit more of a fight.
One of the reasons for this is that Frontier haven't made the NPCs 'Dangerous' enough. In solo, you can min / max a trader and be quite successful but take that same build an try and run a CG in open and it won't last long if there are players who are trying to prevent the CG. As long as there are ships which can’t fight back, aren’t fast enough to run away or don’t have a wing to defend them, don’t expect any mercy or good will from griefers, you’re exactly the kind of player they love to spoil.
To the griefer’s themselves, I’d like to know why do you do it?
Is it because;-
1) you know that the other player will be hurt at the lost game time / progress and that makes you feel better?
2) highlight a point or protest to Frontier about the game you don’t like?
3) Is it jealousy that certain events are not about you so you’re going to spoil it for the rest of the player base or try and make it about you?
4) Why do you complain at being blocked at other commanders in solo or private groups when you don’t seem to get that if you spoil other people’s enjoyment of the game they either a) stop playing the game or b) not want to play in a game with you?
5) just because you can?
For those that don’t know, all these arguments have happened before in another space MMO. Jumpgate suffered from a serious case of griefing and there wasn’t a solo mode or pvt group to escape to, so newbies just got seal clubbed and it got the rep as a player killer game. The upshot was that nobody wanted to join and player numbers dwindled until it died.
TLDR:
1. Players who Min/Max really only have only themselves to blame.
2. Frontier should have put the ‘Dangerous’ in in Elite-Dangerous so that Min/Max-ing is prevented in Solo and PVT groups.
3. To parody the great Geoff Goldblum:- Griefers are so preoccupied about that they could that then don’t stop to consider if they should!
4. Griefer’s don’t complain about players in solo or PVE groups. Chances are, they are there because of you.
P.S. It was quite funny that there was a concerted effort from the griefers to fool people that open was safe for pilot in the DW2 group and there was quite a lot of anger when they weren’t believed and the vast majority of people stayed safe in the private group.
Now before I start let me define a 'Griefer' to be a player who is out to spoil the enjoyment of others players, so Murder Hoboing, Seal Clubbing or people who UA bomb stations that had been set aside for people doing a charity run for cancer, would all come under that category. Pirates, Powerplay PvPs or people trying to blockade CGs would not be griefers in my opinion. There is also a borderline case of people working a certain player faction who are in conflict with another player faction could be considered another exception as well.
There was a lot of recommendations but one of the most surprising was from Shan and Nat; people who Min/Max their explorer builds for jump range are putting themselves at risk; especially against the combat ships. Nat was explaining that she'd altered her build to make the ship as fast as possible in real space for the loss of half a light year of range. That way you outrun the attacker and get away. She did it quite successfully in open a few days ago, much to the complaint of the griefers at the time. That is one solution because a lot of players when they start out Max/Min and then are surprised when they're ship doesn't stand a chance against a purpose built griefing ship. You have to remember that pirate ships are different because they have to put space aside for cargo and hatchbreakers, so a probably balanced trader vs Pirate is a bit more of a fight.
One of the reasons for this is that Frontier haven't made the NPCs 'Dangerous' enough. In solo, you can min / max a trader and be quite successful but take that same build an try and run a CG in open and it won't last long if there are players who are trying to prevent the CG. As long as there are ships which can’t fight back, aren’t fast enough to run away or don’t have a wing to defend them, don’t expect any mercy or good will from griefers, you’re exactly the kind of player they love to spoil.
To the griefer’s themselves, I’d like to know why do you do it?
Is it because;-
1) you know that the other player will be hurt at the lost game time / progress and that makes you feel better?
2) highlight a point or protest to Frontier about the game you don’t like?
3) Is it jealousy that certain events are not about you so you’re going to spoil it for the rest of the player base or try and make it about you?
4) Why do you complain at being blocked at other commanders in solo or private groups when you don’t seem to get that if you spoil other people’s enjoyment of the game they either a) stop playing the game or b) not want to play in a game with you?
5) just because you can?
For those that don’t know, all these arguments have happened before in another space MMO. Jumpgate suffered from a serious case of griefing and there wasn’t a solo mode or pvt group to escape to, so newbies just got seal clubbed and it got the rep as a player killer game. The upshot was that nobody wanted to join and player numbers dwindled until it died.
TLDR:
1. Players who Min/Max really only have only themselves to blame.
2. Frontier should have put the ‘Dangerous’ in in Elite-Dangerous so that Min/Max-ing is prevented in Solo and PVT groups.
3. To parody the great Geoff Goldblum:- Griefers are so preoccupied about that they could that then don’t stop to consider if they should!
4. Griefer’s don’t complain about players in solo or PVE groups. Chances are, they are there because of you.
P.S. It was quite funny that there was a concerted effort from the griefers to fool people that open was safe for pilot in the DW2 group and there was quite a lot of anger when they weren’t believed and the vast majority of people stayed safe in the private group.
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Nat is smart.
To Phoenix_Dfire, I'd like to know why do you ask why?
1) Is it going to give you early warning of an impending attack?
2) Does knowing why influence how you build your ship?
3) Are the reasons why going to help you stay calm and not panic?
4) Does having your curiosity satisfied make the high-wake escape quicker?
5) Or are you looking for some way to look down on other players of the game?
Well this is a nice thread... lots of sarcasm, with a helping of toxic "ALL PVPERS ARE BAD!!!!111!!"
one comment I keep finding pop up is the "I shouldn't have to consider being shot at during exploration", this is wrong. you have no idea what you are going to find out there so prep for the worst case. I explore in a combat T10 currently and covered 13,000 LY in under 6 hours to prove it could be done just as easily as any other exploration ship... and this was with all the server issues and the T10s SC bugs.
one comment I keep finding pop up is the "I shouldn't have to consider being shot at during exploration", this is wrong. you have no idea what you are going to find out there so prep for the worst case. I explore in a combat T10 currently and covered 13,000 LY in under 6 hours to prove it could be done just as easily as any other exploration ship... and this was with all the server issues and the T10s SC bugs.
Bob Lighthouse
Banned
i Wish i could, but i never got into the 'twitter' generation, and cant condense what i'm saying. Something things take more than a sentence, else we end up explaining the meaning of one sentence for 50 posts.
I do my best to explain a point without misleading people, so that we don't go down pointless avenues (still working on that).... but these days, people scan read and see what they want
LOL
Here, this is what you need and it's the 50th anniversary edition just for you!
https://www.amazon.com/Elements-Style-50th-Anniversary/dp/0205632645
Seriously...
[yesnod]
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There doesn't need to be any sense in people's motivation, other than the fact some men just want to see the world burn. This doesn't contradict any bit of the game's lore and story.
And there is (or used to be) an NPC archetype, 'terrorist', whose sole purpose is to blow up the player's ship.
You may be asking the wrong questions....
Maybe you should ask, Why are there no PvP related events or CGs?
oh, didn't know nat played in open
but to answer 1) Yoga pants, you may even get that reference, even though its a light hearted thread, it relates to some of the reason why this happens, and its not really about the game, but the person and personality that the griefer are upset by, and have to lash out.
but to answer 1) Yoga pants, you may even get that reference, even though its a light hearted thread, it relates to some of the reason why this happens, and its not really about the game, but the person and personality that the griefer are upset by, and have to lash out.
The Following it is not directed at the post but that 'Triggered Me' into a rant
...and this is an area where the Player killers, well any killer of NPC or play seems happy to let Elite Cuddle them... All this talk about Elite being cutthroat and open is dangerous, 'but don't touch my credits' if i mess up
Players now get put in a detention facility, so, they are caught, Therefor, can be charge for all crimes... The insurance company can now seize their asset to cover the full cost of any ship they destroyed (unless the law if also cuddling murderers or just insane)
Have the bounty system as is, it works, but also have, total fines. Total fines account for the value of ships destroyed (in full), this is then added to your rebuy. If you cant over it, you are bankrupt... you know , how new player end up when they get ganked?
So funny, that players that kill newbs and tell them its part of the game, yet would probably not welcome a total fine system that could make them lose it all (as happens to new players) as a result of being destroyed, as a result of their skill in the game.
Hay, can prove me wrong and the hero gankers out there can get behind the idea of total value fines... I know i would be more willing to hunt you down if i knew it could brake your bank... Infact, you may even get reverse greifing by rich people, letting you get kills of billion credit ships, just to help top up your total fines, before Dusting ya
All the tuff talk, but at the end of the day, some people only take that stance because they are safe, and cuddled by C&p
You don't see any holes in your proposal that "griefers" could use against you? That's amusing.
One point in your post makes me want to comment: in my opinion Dove Enigma would never had been in the spotlight the way it was if there wouldn't have been the attempt to UA bomb it. All this vitriol and hate I read about that event against the UA bombers is imho total bull*. The UA bombing was the best (emergent content) that could've happened to the expedition. It would have been an obscure rand note of some dozens of explorers, and not the hundreds of pilots from everywhere dropping meta alloys at Colonia. Sorry, I'm just triggered by the mentioning of that event as something bad.
Keep telling yourself that.oh, didn't know nat played in open
but to answer 1) Yoga pants, you may even get that reference, even though its a light hearted thread, it relates to some of the reason why this happens, and its not really about the game, but the person and personality that the griefer are upset by, and have to lash out.
yes, lets not go down that road out. I have had to state before, because people do not think before they type... I have language issue, in fact, i construct sentences backward in my head and then then try to make them understandable to normal people... I'm trying, always learning, but don't appreciate begin mocked.
stick to attacking the argument and not the person, ty
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Almost all CGs are PvP related. If you're hauling cargo/nuking NPCs for a particular Power/Faction or some other result, you're a target for enemy CMDR's. The current CG is a PvP event, with Alliance vs Federal objectives, and Imperial pledges have an abundance of legitimate PvP targets.
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Reasonable post - I just picked out a detail, that doesn't matter at all. It won't be answered anyway honestly. And besides, we already know the true answer.
No the question needs to be why the game was designed like this and allows griefing to happen. Not that it'd change much - but if you become aware that this is the real problem, you'll be more cautious when you buy the next game that boasts about putting PvE and PvP into the same bucket.
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