[Video] Griefing : is there a problem?!

[Dizzy B High]

There are a number of different reasons why the Distant Worlds 2 expedition is exceedingly harmful to both our natural galaxy, and the future prosperity of humanity. I sought an opportunity to voice these concerns to Distant Worlds 2 leadership many times, and each time, they ignored my urgent request. And that is why, as a last resort, I ordered the Distant Ganks 2 fleet to attack the expedition, which has subsequently led to the destruction of thousands of explorers.

If the DW2 leadership would have sat down and listened to my concerns, I'm certain that we would have reached a peaceful agreement and brought an end to this bitter conflict. But there is so much at stake here that, if diplomacy is off the table, then wiping out their fleet actually serves the greater good because it will actually stop more harm than it causes. When destroying thousands saves billions, then violence is justified. There is a such thing as a just war, and this is one of them.

If you are that concerned about the future prosperity of humanity, then why don't you tell all the people on DW2 what is so dangerous and so important that they shouldn't take part? If it's really that bad surely they will heed your advice and stop participating.

We all know the reason your not doing that is because there is no reason, other than trying to seek the attention you so desperately crave.

The fact that the only people you can get onside are similar people desperate for attention, says bucketloads.

 

[Ian Doncaster]

In what way did it get changed?

There were two changes from the original 3.0 release to make it easier for people with short-range ships to manage their bounties (I think both of these were changed in 3.1):
* Refuel allowed with anonymous access.
* Voluntary hand-in for transportation allowed with no notoriety.

I strongly suspect that both of these were more to ease the complaints of PvE bounty hunters who had picked up assault bounties, though, since anyone *expecting* to obtain a bounty can just plan ahead a bit and not downsize their FSD in the first place.

 

[Wolf Starslayer]

Revamped C&P just made it far too easy to avoid consequence of your crimes. Go on a murder spree then all you have to do is change ships and the game ignores you, no bounty hunters,no police; nothing. Really is easy mode for criminals.

 

[Vedmo]

There were two changes from the original 3.0 release to make it easier for people with short-range ships to manage their bounties (I think both of these were changed in 3.1):
* Refuel allowed with anonymous access.
* Voluntary hand-in for transportation allowed with no notoriety.

I strongly suspect that both of these were more to ease the complaints of PvE bounty hunters who had picked up assault bounties, though, since anyone *expecting* to obtain a bounty can just plan ahead a bit and not downsize their FSD in the first place.

I remember quite a few people with undersized d rated low weight FSD's complaining of being stuck in a system after some mishap.

 

[Deleted member 115407]

There are a number of different reasons why the Distant Worlds 2 expedition is exceedingly harmful to both our natural galaxy, and the future prosperity of humanity. I sought an opportunity to voice these concerns to Distant Worlds 2 leadership many times, and each time, they ignored my urgent request. And that is why, as a last resort, I ordered the Distant Ganks 2 fleet to attack the expedition, which has subsequently led to the destruction of thousands of explorers.

If the DW2 leadership would have sat down and listened to my concerns, I'm certain that we would have reached a peaceful agreement and brought an end to this bitter conflict. But there is so much at stake here that, if diplomacy is off the table, then wiping out their fleet actually serves the greater good because it will actually stop more harm than it causes. When destroying thousands saves billions, then violence is justified. There is a such thing as a just war, and this is one of them.

If you are that concerned about the future prosperity of humanity, then why don't you tell all the people on DW2 what is so dangerous and so important that they shouldn't take part? If it's really that bad surely they will heed your advice and stop participating.

We all know the reason your not doing that is because there is no reason, other than trying to seek the attention you so desperately crave.

The fact that the only people you can get onside are similar people desperate for attention, says bucketloads.

Zarek Null Underpant of the galaxy, because he's full of sh.....

@777Driver

Case in point. And a mild one at that.

For the longest time, Zarek has been roleplaying a bad guy on these forums and in the game. He does it well - his megalomania is creative and entertaining. He has promoted and organized his own story-driven PvP player events, and to my knowledge has never insulted or belittled other players in the course of sticking to his character.

In response to his roleplay, he receives tons of vitriol, both here and on reddit. Direct personal attacks, slander and insult, you name it.

Again, the roleplay requirement that some folks make for "legitimate" PvP is just an excuse to justify their anger at having been blown up. No amount of roleplay will ever actually satisfy them, and Zarek Null is a perfect example of that.

 

[Zaphod Hawke]

I know you only ever play in solo [zZzZz].

I know you're trying really hard to believe this, Bobby boy...

But repeating something over and over again can't make it true.

Sometimes the boogieman is real.

There were two changes from the original 3.0 release to make it easier for people with short-range ships to manage their bounties (I think both of these were changed in 3.1):
* Refuel allowed with anonymous access.
* Voluntary hand-in for transportation allowed with no notoriety.

I strongly suspect that both of these were more to ease the complaints of PvE bounty hunters who had picked up assault bounties, though, since anyone *expecting* to obtain a bounty can just plan ahead a bit and not downsize their FSD in the first place.

Correct assessment.

These things did nothing to change the situation for PvPers/gankers. None of us fit undersized FSD's anymore.

Revamped C&P just made it far too easy to avoid consequence of your crimes. Go on a murder spree then all you have to do is change ships and the game ignores you, no boubty hunters no police; nothing. Really is easy mode for criminals.

Lots of us thought hot ships and modules was a stupid idea.

But it's more annoying than difficult.

Why is it so difficult to come up with actual criminal gameplay?

We have been making it up as we go since the beginning.

@777Driver

Case in point. And a mild one at that.

For the longest time, Zarek has been roleplaying a bad guy on these forums and in the game. He does it well, and to my knowledge has never insulted or belittled other players.

In response to his roleplay, he receives tons of vitriol, both here and on reddit. Direct personal attacks, slander and insult, you name it.

Again, the roleplay requirement that some folks make for "legitimate" PvP is just an excuse to justify their anger at having been blown up. No amount of roleplay will ever actually satisfy them, and Zarek Null is a perfect example of that.

All will bow before the great Zarek Null!

Z0

 

[The Replicated Man]

@777Driver

Case in point. And a mild one at that.

For the longest time, Zarek has been roleplaying a bad guy on these forums and in the game. He does it well - his megalomania is creative and entertaining. He has promoted and organized his own story-driven PvP player events, and to my knowledge has never insulted or belittled other players in the course of sticking to his character.

In response to his roleplay, he receives tons of vitriol, both here and on reddit. Direct personal attacks, slander and insult, you name it.

Again, the roleplay requirement that some folks make for "legitimate" PvP is just an excuse to justify their anger at having been blown up. No amount of roleplay will ever actually satisfy them, and Zarek Null is a perfect example of that.

100% Nailed Vin!

People take "ganking and griefing" way too personal in this game. It is a video game guys! Eat the Rebuy, and learn from your mistakes! It's not rocket science here!

 

[Deleted member 115407]

All will bow before the great Zarek Null!
Z0

Z0!

(Good point there, too. Many of us started this adventure by roleplaying New Dominion fanatics. Nope, not good enough for people. Our roleplay was completely invalid.)

 

[Vedmo]

100% Nailed Vin!

People take "ganking and griefing" way too personal in this game. It is a video game guys! Eat the Rebuy, and learn from your mistakes! It's not rocket science here!

Great advice for gankers too, shoot your target till it blows up and get on with your day. Chest thumping over kills and revelling in 'salt mining' over PvP happening is just as absurd as complaints of PvP happening.

 

[Zarek Null]

Gankers having more dakka than explorers doesn't really require an admission. Are you new to being an overlord ?, you seem to have been badly briefed by your underlings.

Why is the fact that my military is superior a cause for their belittlement? It should be a cause for praise. Do you also belittle Olympic athletes for likewise being the best and being able to easily outrun cripples? Shame on olympiads for being so exceptional at running!

Why do so many commanders elevate the frail, the weak and the incompetant, and condemn the strong and successful? It is because their rational mind has been corrupted by backward values. Praise the excellent and condemn the mediocre; those are right values.

Every pilot has the same ships, weapons and tactics available to them. We should praise those that make skillful use of the choices and resources given them, and criticize those that make bad decisions leading to loss and destruction.

 

[Ian Doncaster]

I remember quite a few people with undersized d rated low weight FSD's complaining of being stuck in a system after some mishap.

Yes. And they weren't actually stuck, even then - they could always have made an attack run on the station to be conveniently teleported to the nearest detention centre.

They just didn't think that was a "fair" outcome for their lousy trigger discipline, so alternatives were asked for and added.

(And now the "hand yourself in" feature is itself complained about in turn by the even less competent criminal who can't tell the difference between a fine and a bounty, of course.)

 

[The Replicated Man]

Great advice for gankers too, shoot your target till it blows up and get on with your day. Chest thumping over kills and revelling in 'salt mining' over PvP happening is just as absurd as complaints of PvP happening.

Who's Chest Thumping?

 

[Stigbob]

Revamped C&P just made it far too easy to avoid consequence of your crimes. Go on a murder spree then all you have to do is change ships and the game ignores you, no bounty hunters,no police; nothing. Really is easy mode for criminals.

Except for notoriety, but that decays when you are offline now so its pretty pointless. I always thought under the new C&P system it meant your ships were like your characters, I can have a rogue a smuggler and a paladin all on the go with the same account.

Some people will exploit it to minimize risk, but that's just how exploiters are take this away and they'll just log.

 

[Der Zeitgeist]

Z0!

(Good point there, too. Many of us started this adventure by roleplaying New Dominion fanatics. Nope, not good enough for people. Our roleplay was completely invalid.)

Keep trying though!

I'll just continue watching your streams from time to time. If I see some quality PvP developing there, I might even consider unblocking you guys some day.

 

[Phoenix_Dfire]

Most players will agree that anything goes in an anarchy system so if you are in out in open then you need to watch your back and be prepared for it.

Ironically, most of this discussion has been about DW2 and for most of the expedition you will be flying through anarchy systems so you have say its the explorers that have to be aware against player killers, if they are flying in open.

However if people had infiltrated the DW2 private group, which everybody knows has a no player killing rule, with the purpose of killing players (Like has been done to Mobius in the past), then they would have crossed the line into griefing and harassment. Trying to entice DW2 Commanders into open is a bit 'below the belt' but as long as the DW2 commanders are aware of it, then it's actually quite funny.

Best thing to do if you have been griefed / seal clubbed etc is what Yamiks has already suggested. Take the rebuy, block the player and move on. I'd started a second account so that I could take part in DW 2 but got seal clubbed (My standard cobra vs an A rated Challenger). I should have known better than fly in open with a weak ship. Knowing I didn't have time to build up the funds and Mats to go get an explorer ship ready in time, I've decided to abandon the 2nd account for the moment but not before blocking the offending player on all my other accounts. So I'm defending the bubble from thargoid attacks in my main account instead, if I wasn't having to deal with all the connection drops).

Except for notoriety, but that decays when you are offline now so its pretty pointless.

Really, I though you still had to be in game but it could decay if you were docked to a station.

 

[Stigbob]

I know you're trying really hard to believe this, Bobby boy...

But repeating something over and over again can't make it true.

Sometimes the boogieman is real.

When you were in my friends list (last time you were challenging me to some manly and vigorous PVP) I could see you only logging into solo mode and inferred from that you probably only fly whilst wearing a massive pink blouse.

 

[Vedmo]

Who's Chest Thumping?

Many people are, check out any of the hundreds of pages on DW2 ganking. I did not mean to imply you are.

 

[Guest 161958]

@777Driver

Case in point. And a mild one at that.

For the longest time, Zarek has been roleplaying a bad guy on these forums and in the game. He does it well - his megalomania is creative and entertaining. He has promoted and organized his own story-driven PvP player events, and to my knowledge has never insulted or belittled other players in the course of sticking to his character.

In response to his roleplay, he receives tons of vitriol, both here and on reddit. Direct personal attacks, slander and insult, you name it.

And what makes you think these detractors aren't roleplaying too?

null - by name and nature

 

[The Replicated Man]

Many people are, check out any of the hundreds of pages on DW2 ganking. I did not mean to imply you are.

I mean the same thing goes for all the PvE bois too. If you try and silence one crowd, what about the other side of the coin? Elite's PvP community is as much a part of the picture as the PvE one.

I personally don't see any differance between a post about getting one's first anaconda or a trip to beagle point, vs a PvP scenario where a player kills another.

 

[Unknown Zombie]

@777Driver

Case in point. And a mild one at that.

For the longest time, Zarek has been roleplaying a bad guy on these forums and in the game. He does it well - his megalomania is creative and entertaining. He has promoted and organized his own story-driven PvP player events, and to my knowledge has never insulted or belittled other players in the course of sticking to his character.

In response to his roleplay, he receives tons of vitriol, both here and on reddit. Direct personal attacks, slander and insult, you name it.

Again, the roleplay requirement that some folks make for "legitimate" PvP is just an excuse to justify their anger at having been blown up. No amount of roleplay will ever actually satisfy them, and Zarek Null is a perfect example of that.

I appreciate the creativity and effort Zarek puts into his roleplay and I find it entertaining. I like how he saw this whole thing as an opportunity for him to do what he likes to do -- play an interesting bad-guy character. I frequently cringe when I read the kind of responses he gets from people who seem oblivious that he is playing pretend in a game where the whole point is (surprise!) about playing pretend.

However, when a player explains what they did in crude terms such as "dunking on people that can't help themselves" I no longer find it interesting because at that point it's simple trolling.