It's time to revisit the PVP rebuy. Distant Ganks 2 makes the point.
- Thread starter Chaparral
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- kingziggy pvc_community
Politics? Oh heavens no. I was only discussing the quoted economic theory and literary philosophy as it pertains to distant ganks effect on the longevity of PVP health in Elite. My opinion is that this kind of "culling of the weak" philosophy will only lead to a natural implosion of ganker ranks, and a reduction of the much needed adversarial content that they provide.
I was thinking along those lines, too. I mean, what's there not to get, right? This is just elevating the discussion to a more intellectual level.
This is indeed germane to the subject of PvP rebuys.
Personally I have and will continue to advocate for a distance cap on respawn for murdered CMDRs, along with a (non-trivial) method by which they can retrieve their data in any mode they wish (assuming they have a rebuy).
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I can kind of picture Jenner just sitting there at his computer right now, reading Feros/Ziljan/jason's last posts and kind of drumming his fingers on the desk trying to decide how long a duration the bans will be for
Jenner
I wish I was English like my hero Tj.
I can kind of picture Jenner just sitting there at his computer right now, reading Feros/Ziljan/jason's last posts and kind of drumming his fingers on the desk trying to decide how long a duration the bans will be for
I can kind of picture Jenner just sitting there at his computer right now, reading Feros/Ziljan/jason's last posts and kind of drumming his fingers on the desk trying to decide how long a duration the bans will be for
Sartre tells me that I cannot escape the consequences of my choice when I press the open button, as it is part of my essential freedom, but I still wish the murdered not to have to eat so many jumps / so much dataloss (assuming they have rebuy).
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Well that might be a stretch to call Rand an "intellectual elevation" but it's more the dangerous self destructive tendencies her ideas engender that I'm concerned about in the case of Distant Gankers. I've heard more than one Distant Ganker say (paraphrasing): "if this culling means the end of PVP in Elite so be it". Imo that's not a healthy attitude. This unhealthy frustration is very understandable given how unsupported structured PVP is the game, and by that I mean how difficult it can be to even find someone to blow up, let alone someone who is motivated to stick around and fight back.
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It's not difficult to find someone to blow up and/or someone motivated to fight back. In my view, the 'culling' comment comes from another place. My best guess is the folks behind Distant Worlds 2, their alleged actions in response to Distant Ganks 2, and the general attitude towards PvP and criminal gameplay in the Elite community since forever.
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Maybe if you read more than the first and last sentence of her work you would have a different take on it more in line with my own. Ah well.
Anyhow, back on track: pray tell how could DG possibly lead to "the end of PvP in ED." Please make it a good story because I'm kinda nodding off counting my money and having a chuckle at the expense of all the poor people.
If you're a ganker then everyone is a target, however believe it or not, the vast majority of PVPers and PVP dabblers are not gankers. They pick their targets to be appropriate and legal, or at least legal in a cold-war sense. Hence it can be VERY hard to find a target, often taking hours or days. Sometimes bounty hunters get so desperate for action they end up rat thumping each other over 500CR bounties because someone misfired at a friendly who had crimes on. This has been reduced with better white hat organization and 3rd party apps, but the bottom line is that lawful PVP is still mostly hurrying up to wait. And wait....
Well sure, the more rules of engagement you embrace the less people you'll have to explode or fight. But wasn't your quote from one of the DG2 folks? They famously have little to no rules of engagement, yes? That's the context of my comment.
Regarding philosophy... it's better to be funny than right.
Are you a betting man?
Your literary distaste now has me helping the other side. 5c anyone? In any case, I believe it when Ziljan when he says he has heard a ganker state this opinion. I suspect such sentiment has to do with the possibility of FD further increasing the safety net and defense engineering such that open mode is basically safe for any build and skill level, and it is almost impossible to die in.
My take is Ziljan is more concerned we baddies are going to ouraborus ourselves in some such way that we all just stop playing, and then he has to hunt NPC pirates, which is lame.
I have neither worry. Epicurus has taught me to to enjoy what I have and not ruin it by wishing for more, so I will accept the current state of the PvP rebuy.
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The Google Fu here is furious.
Wiki - Philosophy page must be about to crash.
Wiki - Philosophy page must be about to crash.
Nahh I remember most of this nonsense from undergrad. Some of it I have sitting ostentatiously on a shelf.
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There are at least half a dozen ways this could kill PVP and only 1 that it could save it, and that 1 way means that Frontier would be "rewarding" what many in the community see as the worst kind of behavior. That failing to fix PVP would also harm the vast majority of lawful PVP players might be hard for most people to care about once all of the salt is weighed and measured.
Here are the ways that PVP could die:
-installment of a PVP flag, allowing people to just ignore PVP at will, entirely, everywhere
-creation of no PVP zones that just happen to coincide with CGs, community events, engineers, and every other place where players are likely to be found
-draconian enhancements of C&P
-hefty account punishments for "harrassment" now deemed to include a subjective definition of "ganking"
-half of DG getting perma banned for breaking the EULA, or gaming the PG ejection ban
-Frontier deciding that this bad behavior needs to be punished by not adding any PVP specific content, resulting in the slow death of PVP by loss of interest in the game
Of course the opposite of the last one is only way to save PVP imo, long term, and I don't think it's too hyperbolic to say you guys are putting the future enjoyment of the game in jeopardy, for people like you and me at least.
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I have more faith in Fdev then you do, I guess.
And on another note, "ruining PvP for guys like you and me." This expedition is the first time I've ever encountered even a whiff of you actively engaging the PvP end of things, so to me it looks like you should be thanking us for getting you off the bench and into the game. Your welcome in advance
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I don't think the pendulum will swing that far in the other direction, mind you a bunch of people would cheer if it did. I do think the probability of Fdev doing something is rising.
Has anyone else seen an uptick in people asking about and getting into PvP for the first time? Maybe it's just me, but DG2 seems to be sparking interest.
I will now high wake when I see a hollow square instead of immediately switching to solo, if that's what you mean.