Next update?

[Curlyriff]

We're reading threads. Infact, seven of us here at Frontier excluding myself have read this thread. Overall, there has been 536 logged in members that who have read this thread. [yesnod]

Brett,

Cheers for the quick reply and fact of how many have read the post. I am not worried about it myself as you would have read a few pages back as such. I don't even own the game, I am playing on a friends copy when over there because of my lack of funds till the 5th but then I will be fully supporting you guys.

 

[AaronTuckwell]

You could also argue that Astragon's own Waterpark Tycoon is a copy of the Soaked RCT3 expansion pack or that Singles was a direct copy of The Sims. It's not, but just because the subject matter is similar and the game play is essentially the same, it doesn't mean that they were stolen ideas..

So, as you'd expect from a Theme Park Sim, you are going to have similarities between 2, maybe even 3 or 4 games. That's not some-one stealing, it's just that the subject matter doesn't lend its-self to many variations of idea. I mean, a theme park is a theme park.. You can sugar-coat it all you want but it's rollercoasters, rides, restaurants, staff and peeps. The only feasible variation is the delivery of the game system and the mechanics..

 

[Angelis1]

We're reading threads. Infact, seven of us here at Frontier excluding myself have read this thread. Overall, there has been 536 logged in members that who have read this thread. [yesnod]

Seven people at Frontier saw this thread and ... no one can answer ...
(except what james called "little tidbits" : your answer about the path system, CPU/GPU issues, and the poll about Gulpee.)

I know now that this is your "culture of secret" at Frontier, it's not the first time, so I think this is part of your strategy, and nothing can change that.
And of course ... I think I should be happy, because we are more involved than any other large AAA development studio ... So ... YEEEEAHHHHH ! [bored]

But the truth, the real truth, the one that hurts, is :

- 3301 posts in the "Alpha Bug Reporting" = An answer by someone from the "Planet Coaster QA Team" is almost every threads.
- 7072 posts in the "Suggestions and Ideas" and 4874 posts in the "Alpha Feedback Forum" = not a SINGLE answer on what idea/suggestion you are going to integrate ... not even a simple "Good idea, we'll discuss this suggestion during our next working meeting" ! Absolutely nothing !

Conclusion : We wanted to participate in the development of the game, interact with the team, influencing decisions to make them better, but we are just ... Bêta testers ... and we have to pay for it.
You said you wanted "feedbacks", when you just want "bugs reports".

Seriously ... Few indie developpers can do that in their garages, but Frontier can not ?

Seven people at Frontier saw this thread you said ? Okay then ... maybe you read it diagonally.

Selected pieces :

[...] And while we may not be unanimous in our response to that, it's clear what the majority view is. A one week delay gets almost no community angst. Apart from a few 'awww it's taking so long' people, mostly we are patient when we are waiting for quality code. But 4 weeks of silence draws a lot of criticism. We are not patient when waiting for news. So i think it's clear that Frontier would draw more community love if they accept the delay and devote a day a week to talking to us. I do not mean 'tell them anything to shut them up' stuff (the pre-Alpha news started to get like that, i don't consider 4 screenshots to be 'news'), i mean serious talk, like what's going to be in the game that we care about. What's going to be fixed, etc, the effect all the feedback has had on dev work, etc.

[...]

FRONTIER: we are not just a free resource, we paid to be here. We love the game, (more accurately, the genre), just like you. And NEWS is the currency you repay us with. If we don't get paid, with news, i predict the people working the hardest here will stop working; or at least enough of them to have a material effect on the quality of the game you have by the end of this year.

You made some very valid points, and I hope Frontier takes heed of what was said.

[...] How ? where ? When ? Please communicate on that !!!! give us proof of that and make sure do not too much silence too long in the future. [...]

[...] I hope you will make a big news about it, to make us realize how our voice has importance for Frontier.
I think I am right saying that this is what many of us expect.

Personally, I prefer know how we have oriented the choices in the development of the game with our suggestions, ideas and debates, rather than knowing that we have done a good job as "alpha testers" (even if it's also good to congratulate people for this, of course)

Sry but I think frontier have to show us updates independent from the current alpha! Even if they work on the next update, they should show us new information

Yes, I'm asking myself the same thing. I don't see (except for bugs) any dev feedback or very few about the community feddback. Are they listening? Probably... But about what? Which community feedback suggestions are they working on?

When I bought Early Bird, I tought I'll have the feeling to contribute to a game by beta testing it and give my feedback. But we hear nothing about all the alpha suggestions... Maybe the CHC hear more about these feedback, but as an Early Bird without CHC member, I don't see posts about what's next.

I really hope that this will change in the following weeks.

They have chosen to say nothing until the 24 May big update, that's a pity.

I have to agree, the communication has gone from OK to poor. From the devs side sometimes its easy to miss, since you are listening and paying attention, but they forget from our perspective we dont actually know any of this.

As for the assumption that its hard to communicate and would take key people away from development, thats pure . They simply need to do something simple like a weekly update. Once a week have the community manager/PR people do an update for the community. Its not hard and it should be a KEY part of their job. Finding 30 minutes a week to do an update post with a few followups is not hard and would do a world of good here.

I honestly feel very disappointed in the lack of communication since the alpha release. I don't need fancy devlogs or even a bunch of screens, but I feel like the total lack of communication is a bit of a slap in the face to the people that have not only spent $75 (or more) on the alpha, but also spent a LOT of time testing and brainstorming about how to improve the game. All we need is some info about what you guys have decided to change, and what we can expect in the next update. Will we get more theming items? More rides? New coaster types? Any news on water? Etc. I get that you don't want to make empty promises, but at the same time... at least give us some idea about what you're planning on including and/or updating. That's not too much to ask I feel, especially when you have a large team and dedicated community managers.

Etc...

You know that within a month, during phase two, it will be impossible to really talk with you (Just as was the case with the launch of the alpha, lots of noise and unnecessary comments everywhere, impossible to have), so please: take the opportunity now (and also, in anticipation, during the "dead time" between phase 2 and 3)

It's not like it's hard to find topics of discussion we expect right ? I mean, I made a whole anwser in the sawser' topic "What do the Coaster Heads want most in Planet Coaster", which, I think, represent what all the player want in priority. So, yes, of course, this varies depending on the people, in a different order, etc... but, overall, I think it's pretty close to reality.

Interesting question.
I'll try to make a very precise answer (in case it can help Frontier)

Top 5 of "What I wait the most, in the near future" :

1) UGC
It's simple : without it, I cannot build the park I have in mind so ... So It's kind of obvious that it's the first thing I'm waiting. I even can not import the logo I made to start to make my entrance. I also need to change some walls and roof textures to make the mainstreet I want, and also many building piece that I need but that does not exist. And this is why I'm not playing the game so much but just talking on the forum for now, because the game is not very interesting for now because the lack of content, and without custom content, I turn in round. It's my one top priority. There is hundreds of "themes" that 3D artists can create in a limited time too, so ... That could help.

2) Dark Rides (and btw, any other "tracked rides" like gokart, labyrinth, minigolf, or idk what's planned)
That mean anything to make it : few omnimovers types, custom 3D objects, custom music in speakers, a new light system with walls blocking light and the particle/effects system.

3) The Terrain Editor + Water
Because, just like the "modular building tool" (or what the "particles system/mixmaster" can be), it's the kind of tool that give you unlimited freedom of creation, and it's exactly what I want in a game like that : the absolute freedom.
(I also hope it come with the "Map editor", so we can start sharing our maps in the "Phase 3")

4) The 1.0 Rollercoaster Editor + Water Rides
The Coaster editor (and not the "preview" that we have here, behind a cheatcode, but a version that works better, with more different types of coasters (like the wooden coaster that I wait, even if I'm not a "coaster guy").
And the water rides, like the Log Flume or the River Rapids, well ... because It's as fun as a rollercoaster (or a tracked ride) to build.

5) The Transport Rides
I just can wait to build my first train and ride it, and also see what we are going to have in term of transports types available

--------------

Top 5 of "What I wait the most, from our feadbacks" (Alpha - Phase 1) :

1) 3D Gizmo
Because I guess we all want :
- the possibility to "Move" any objects, in any directions (which is what we have now, but with the limitation of the grid)
- the possibility to "Rotate" any objects, in any directions (which is impossible, apart from the technique consisting to put an object on a roof to have a 45° angle, but ... it's just a limited trick)
- and of course, the possibility to "Scale" any objects !!!

2) Better path system (+ Stairs is a plus)
Well ... The path system can be improved A LOT
(we have proposed many solutions, including before the alpha begins), here is a summary

3) More official content
New themes (who said "Fairytaleeeeeeee"), new foliage (including smaller foliage, because everything is sooooo big), new rides (if possible, something more interesting than just "flat/thrillrides", that you just need to put on the ground, entrance, exit and that's all)

4) Custom signs
I'm not talking about 3D custom signs from UGC, but the possibility to write your own text, with different fonts and style on a sign, to try to start making our rides/"restaurants"/etc. "unique"

5) Better camera system
which could be a maximum simplified by using another approach (I proposed the principle of the "minecraft camera" elsewhere, for example)

--------------

Top 5 of "What I wait the most, from our Suggestions and Ideas" :

1) Visit a park in first person view usign WASD (or ZQSD in France)
The first person experience with, if possible, the VR support

2) Hotels & Resort
Everything that allow to build all arround the park, still with the "Scripted objects / Modular buildings" approach, allowing to build Hotels, free shuttle between park(s) and hotels, night village, a parking lot, etc...

3) "Seated" Restaurants + chairs and tables (=/= "Standing" fastfood we actually have)
I guess we all want to reproduce what the theme park have (since RCT3) and "Restaurants and Souvenirs shops" are a (very) big part of any big theme park in the world, so ...

4) Parades
A "tracked" Parade system with : vehicles customization, dancers, marching bands, entertainers, etc...

5) Fastpass / Split booth / PreShows
The fast track queue + Split booth + Pre Show Area

--------------

I could make a bigger list in each category of course (top 10, 20, etc ...) but I tried to "prioritize"

Voila [yesnod]

So, Is it possible to talk about it ? And a real talk !!!

We are no longer the "10 years old players" that we have been, Now we have grown, we have become adults, and for some, as skilled as you, in our respective areas of expertise.
I am getting a little tired of being infantilized, just under the pretext that we are in a "Company => Customer" relation.

Is it possible to about it with you, the Frontier team ? Talking about what is the plan, why this, why not this, and not just "marketing answer" but a real interactive conversation between you and us.
Knowing that you have enough topics on which you can keep surprises, if you really want to play the "secret card" on few questions.

Or ... at least ... if you not want to answer questions (because this take too much time, what I can understand), at least make a weekly sticky topic with news and informations, where some Frontier team member answer occasionally ? (using the same format as the "Alpha Update 0.1.X" topics which was good I think)

I don't know, something ...


(Sorry for the long post, here is a potato in a rollercoaster)

 

[Aaronroberts12567]

Planet Coaster & RCTW are not Coaster simulators, they are Theme Park simulators, and theme parks contain coasters of all types, flat rides, dark rides, transport rides and water based rides, as well as food and gift shop outlets. For pure Coaster sims, you have to be looking at No Limits, which is just a Coaster Simulator. They both have coaster in the name, but in essence they are really based on full blown theme parks.

You forgot bouncy castles!

between tester and dev

Theres that word "tester" again, I don't remember frontier saying that you're all alpha testers, just that you could play Alpha.


Ok, I've given up reading through from my last post because, the white text on the dark grey is starting to hurt my eyes.

In my honest opinion, I think someone from frontier should write up a schedule, or a new "dev blog" and be like "Look, we do read the forums, we've already got problems mentioned fixed, and are planning on updating in May, heres some content in the next build, and there will be a few other surprises for lack of communication" and then finish with the schedule and be like
"May- coaster builder
June / July - fixed bugs, a bit more content"
Just mention a schedule so people can atleast know what to expect and WHEN to expect it, yea I get that you guys are busy, but it doesn't take 2 minutes before leaving work to let people know whats going on, we don't need your WoW facts, or a post about how you've had however many members look through this thread, YOU'RE the people that people are turning to for a game after the other (thats nothing more than a name now) was so dissapointing, you have enough staff to get someone 2 minutes after work to quickly write something up and stick it to the top of your page.

To other people, STOP WHINING, go look through friends and have a laugh at dumb threads, cheer up!

 

[SymphonyX]

^^^^ Well said Angelis! ^^^^

 

[stuk71]

blah blah blah...

[rolleyes]

 

[Stream]

What he said ^^ You guys need to be more interactive or people will stop helping you out. I was fine with paying $75 for the early bird because I felt like I was going to have some sort of voice in the direction of the game, but now it just feels like you wanted people to find bugs and that's it.

You guys have a huge opportunity to create one of the best sim/management games in recent history here, but you guys HAVE to listen to your community for that to truly happen.

 

[xyphic]

Part of my frustration is that I'm seeing a lot of developer and community team activity over on the Elite forums. There are regular Elite livestreams (currently in the run-up to the Beta for the next release). It just feels a little like the Planet Coaster community has been forgotten about, and I'd have to echo what Angelis said. There's been a lot of great feedback on the Alpha; what we're waiting for now is feedback on the feedback. I'd hoped going into this process that there'd be more of a dialogue, but it feels very one-way right now.

- - - - - Additional Content Posted / Auto Merge - - - - -

You guys have a huge opportunity to create one of the best sim/management games in recent history here, but you guys HAVE to listen to your community for that to truly happen.

This, and it's not necessarily obvious that by "listen to" we actually mean "enter into dialogue with".

 

[Dubbie]

Understated point, Atari have already shown in some of their updates they are willing to steal ideas

Example?

 

[widlanquebec]

Angelis, you summarized it all. Thanks. Let's hope we'll have information soon and have really the feeling to participate to the game process and not just be bug reporter.

 

[Ahloween]

This is my first post so I will try to make it short and sweet. I am 45+ yrs old, I grew up with the genre and they will always be my favorite out of a sea of titles. I've been keeping my eye on this and recently bought RCTW. After 3 hrs of gameplay I actually refunded it, something I have never done before. I have never seen a game so horribly made and I was completely shocked. PCoaster looks exactly like what I have been wanting all these years but I am reluctant at this stage to buy it. I've seen devs suck the money out of their fans prior to release and never deliver time after time. I am more interested in the business side of things that give me a purpose to stick around ( smooth graphics obviously as well ).

I see something happening here and wanted to speak up. Members are feeling frustrated at the lack of "helping to develop" promises and bring to our attention that communication was much better before and at early release. It is painfully obvious that with spring here and summer approaching that this will only get worse as devs have less and less time to work on the game and more time BBQ'ing with their families. Ultimatley this will push the final release well into 2017. It's sad. It is. Because I've seen this over and over and over. Devs are so productive during winter months, rollout promises and early releases to fund their leisure activities during summer. Fans are left hanging, updates get painfully slow during these months, and by the end your left with a mediocre game with very little content while they move on to another game, doing the same thing.

In essence what you are left with is a game half made but they have reaped enough profits to move on before it is finished. This seems to be the new trend in gaming lately and EQ Next is a shinning example of this scenario. I sincerely hope this is not the case with PCoaster, but can clearly see this unfolding in that direction.

So with my last comments I will say that PCoaster has the potential to be the best game of all time. I have read they plan the full release Q4 2016. Since there is not even water in the game yet (even with a early release seems absurd) I guarantee you this will not be released until 2017 and probably right before spring. [yesnod] I know some of you may disagree, while devs shake their heads in disagreement. But those of you investing your time and money on a very incomplete game will learn the hard way. GL however, I am looking forward to this release.

 

[Dubbie]

So with my last comments I will say that PCoaster has the potential to be the best game of all time. I have read they plan the full release Q4 2016. Since there is not even water in the game yet (even with a early release seems absurd) I guarantee you this will not be released until 2017 and probably right before spring. [yesnod] I know some of you may disagree, while devs shake their heads in disagreement. But those of you investing your time and money on a very incomplete game will learn the hard way. GL however, I am looking forward to this release.

So you are basing the release date on the absence of water in the game? Lol.

 

[Inge Jones]

I have to agree with Hallowene that there is a long way to go, and I am prepared for the possibility of a release date delay, but it's not a huge problem really. Sims releases are often delayed and we survive.

 

[Empo]

reading especially the last page has been very informative. I've been on and off the last 2 months(?) or so due to real life problems. Coming back to the forum now with a clear mind and not having played a lot I was hoping to gather more than what is availble. The lack of communication is sad and it seems the fears I had before the beta seem to have come true: it was going too good to be true. RCTW was hitting all the wrong buttons and kept on doing so all the while Frontier kept hitting the right ones until.... While I do hope it's not my imagination that the triumph over their competitor hasn't made Frontier lazy, reality is a cruel mistress. Or master, depending on how much South Park you watch.

 

[Stream]

I don't really think it'll come out this year either, but I feel like we'll have a clearer picture of how much they can get done within a certain amount of time with the second alpha phase. So I'm gonna wait until then to make a better assessment about that.

 

[Dubbie]

I don't really think it'll come out this year either, but I feel like we'll have a clearer picture of how much they can get done within a certain amount of time with the second alpha phase. So I'm gonna wait until then to make a better assessment about that.

I think we all need to wait until the next phase, so we can see what Frontier can achieve in 2 months. And they haven't really talked since the release of phase 1.

 

[The Stig]

So, we're just expected to sit in the dark for two months every release? We're all paying customers and deserve to know about the product we've bought.

 

[Zerobyte]

For me its ok I want news if they got news 24-05 start Alpha 2 and in the time being I play the game.
Between updates there is always a bit silence and we get news when they have news, and in 2/3 weeks we got the news.

#InFrontierITrust

 

[Harbinger]

Seems to be a lot of people adding 1 + 1 and coming up with 3.

The community management team don't just have to look after the community of this game, they also have to look after the community for Elite: Dangerous and with the 2.1/1.6 patch for that game going into beta next week surely it's understandable that they are overstretched right now?

With regards to the eventual release, nothing has changed. As recently as today Frontier have reaffirmed that the game is on target to release by the end of this year in a press release to the LSE.

 

[BigDaddy1]

We're reading threads. Infact, seven of us here at Frontier excluding myself have read this thread. Overall, there has been 536 logged in members that who have read this thread

Here is a tip then. Pop in, post quick little snippets such as " Hey thats a neat idea, thanks for the feedback" , or just post funny quips, or just "LOL" after funny thread comments. This is the thing. Just show us that you are present and reading the forums.
It doesnt take much to keep people engaged and happy to help you test your game. You just have to stop in and say " Hi, Im here and listening" not in those exact words,but you get the idea.

I'm a very busy software dev for gov clients and if I can pop in here 5 to 10 minute a day to post, so can your team, it doesnt take much