So while we are on the subject of rage torwards fdev, how much do posts like that contribute to it? If they take up your suggestion of perma banning angry people then they should also ban those that do nothing but stir.
Thank You FDev
- Thread starter SirMaxxx
- Start date
So while we are on the subject of rage torwards fdev, how much do posts like that contribute to it? If they take up your suggestion of perma banning angry people then they should also ban those that do nothing but stir.
LEP's are a gamble you got exactly what you paid for.
It would be quite hard to brandish crucifixes at the forum undead if they'd all been exorcised.
Just looking at Riversides post there reminds me that the big big update coming in 2020 is going to be paid content. Perhaps listening to people now, just pretending to care a little bit, might actually be in fdevs own best interests.
You can't really claim to have called it when it was you started griping about LEP's (again).
Its only a problem for people who didn't understand what they were getting.
You brought it up Stigbob
Your internal picture of me & my motivation lacks fidelity even though I literally explain my motivation regularly (and have linked to a recent summary just a few posts ago). I could link to other descriptive posts if you like, but you probably wouldn't read them either. I could link to posts of yours that describe what could easily be interpreted as ulterior motives too, because I do read what people write & try to take it on board whether I like it or not.
You are attacking other customers, seemingly for your own amusement. This is not productive.
Interesting OP. Although I am not sure if abuse to an open source developer/maintainer who does it purely voluntarily, as compared to a for-profit company that has sold millions of copies of a game really is a good comparison. Although, I also recognize that other link that was passed around on abuse to game developers.
I love this game. It's basically the only game I've been playing for 4 years. I don't check my play hours anymore, because it's more embarrassing than something to be proud of. I still play practically daily, and haven't even had a major burn out period yet. Clearly, I love this game.
But:
1. I also during these years seen a game dev break things with every patch. Or add things that they think will be fun, but actually put unnecessary obstacles in place. Just this weekend: Multiple systems with CZs that have the wrong faction in it (i.e. a faction actually in war fighting a faction not in war) limiting which CZ will actually work for you, and a new faction rep degradation that can lock you out of stations quickly. Navlock that still? again? doesn't work and drops you several Mms from your wingmates. Interdictions that don't end and require quitting the game.
2. A long running experience with logging bugs that did not get resolved
3. a long interaction with Frontier on botting that never progressed beyond "if you tell us who the bot account is, we'll look into it" (which we have no ability to do)
4. Both publicly, and more privately, a community management team that does one-way communication only, doesn't consult with the community, and doesn't meet commitments they make.
5. A company that seems incapable (anymore?) to anticipate how changes will get received. That happens, and you can't please everyone. But Frontier seems surprised by many of the reactions, when it seems to me, a quick pulse check would have prevented some recent failures (drag munitions, CZ rep degradation, forum poll for Interstellar Initiatives)
I could go on. I will likely keep playing daily, as the game provides me a canvas to operate in and I love flying space ships. But there are development practices and decision making processes within Frontier that are mystifying. I've been in (enterprise) software development for years, and while I recognize game development is different, has different audiences and does not operate in the same way, my company wouldn't survive long if with each patch stuff breaks. Or if bugs wouldn't get fixed for years. Or if support couldn't address pro-actively significant issues. Or get surprised by customer feedback...
Frontier is not common in the software industry, in my experience.
I love this game. It's basically the only game I've been playing for 4 years. I don't check my play hours anymore, because it's more embarrassing than something to be proud of.
I still play practically daily, and haven't even had a major burn out period yet. Clearly, I love this game.But:
1. I also during these years seen a game dev break things with every patch. Or add things that they think will be fun, but actually put unnecessary obstacles in place. Just this weekend: Multiple systems with CZs that have the wrong faction in it (i.e. a faction actually in war fighting a faction not in war) limiting which CZ will actually work for you, and a new faction rep degradation that can lock you out of stations quickly. Navlock that still? again? doesn't work and drops you several Mms from your wingmates. Interdictions that don't end and require quitting the game.
2. A long running experience with logging bugs that did not get resolved
3. a long interaction with Frontier on botting that never progressed beyond "if you tell us who the bot account is, we'll look into it" (which we have no ability to do)
4. Both publicly, and more privately, a community management team that does one-way communication only, doesn't consult with the community, and doesn't meet commitments they make.
5. A company that seems incapable (anymore?) to anticipate how changes will get received. That happens, and you can't please everyone. But Frontier seems surprised by many of the reactions, when it seems to me, a quick pulse check would have prevented some recent failures (drag munitions, CZ rep degradation, forum poll for Interstellar Initiatives)
I could go on. I will likely keep playing daily, as the game provides me a canvas to operate in and I love flying space ships. But there are development practices and decision making processes within Frontier that are mystifying. I've been in (enterprise) software development for years, and while I recognize game development is different, has different audiences and does not operate in the same way, my company wouldn't survive long if with each patch stuff breaks. Or if bugs wouldn't get fixed for years. Or if support couldn't address pro-actively significant issues. Or get surprised by customer feedback...
Frontier is not common in the software industry, in my experience.
You brought it up Stigbob
Your internal picture of me & my motivation lacks fidelity even though I literally explain my motivation regularly (and have linked to a recent summary just a few posts ago). I could link to other descriptive posts if you like, but you probably wouldn't read them either. I could link to posts of yours that describe what could easily be interpreted as ulterior motives too, because I do read what people write & try to take it on board whether I like it or not.
You are attacking other customers, seemingly for your own amusement. This is not productive.
Yet as with the LEP you are the one who went down the address the poster not the post route with me (again). If you take the conversation in a certain direction you can't then complain about that direction without me pointing out your hypocrisy and laughing at you.
Don't let that stop you though
.Yet as with the LEP you are the one who went down the address the poster not the post route with me (again). If you take the conversation in a certain direction you can't then complain about that direction without me pointing out your hypocrisy and laughing at you.
Don't let that stop you though
Laugh it up, fuzzball
You are a pushover Stigbob, you are afraid to draw a line in the sand because someone might step over it & then your lack of assertion would become clear to all. So instead you just try to pick faults in the lines others draw.You make a good devils advocate to test ideas against though, I appreciate that.
Laugh it up, fuzzball
You make a good devils advocate to test ideas against though, I appreciate that.
I'm a happy customer why would I feel the need to draw a line the sand ?.
I would like to join the OP.
Aside from all the features and questionable management both in terms of game development and community i must admit openly that Elite : Dangerous is the game of my life and i love it wholeheartedly.
Thank You FD. I might seem a bit pessimistic about ED's future but i still love it.
Best wishes to You, FDev.
Aside from all the features and questionable management both in terms of game development and community i must admit openly that Elite : Dangerous is the game of my life and i love it wholeheartedly.
Thank You FD. I might seem a bit pessimistic about ED's future but i still love it.
Best wishes to You, FDev.
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Ok, let me give you a few examples to elaborate my statements.
No Man's Sky (i know sooner or later this would come up in the thread)
Sean Murray came up with a great idea and he was in high hopes he could deliver on his promises,
but things quickly took a turn for the worse, but he was the face of No Man's Sky, no barrier inbetween
(with barrier i mean a Support team structure that deflects most feedback and who filter out only the most important feedback or bug issues)
So he had to take quite the beating. Took him a while to get back on his feet. (and i absolutely did not find it fair what he had to endure)
Battlefield Franchise
DICE has for a long time maintained a certain distance to their communities, as a "faceless" company that's quite easy to do,
most telecommunication companies use that same strategy to not be drawn into a endless Feedback loop.
They employ outsourced Callcenters to deflect away the client's needs .
(and we all know the more complicated it is to be able to voice a concern or to get someone from support, the less people can be bothered with)
But with DICE you see how that made their downfall spiral further, because they catered games to an audience that doesn't exist.
BF ain't COD or Battle Royale. What always made BF stand out was the strategic element, whereas COD is plain shoot to kill.
They didn't listen and instead had EA tell them what's the best way to move forward. This resulted in two terrible games that will ultimately kill the franchise.
I am a big fan of BF3 and BF4 but i wouldn't touch BF1 and BFV as that ain't Battlefield. It's just a husk bearing the name.
So, i think it is actually vital to a game's development, when concerns are openly voiced, and of course one can also make an effort to point out the positives.
But i think the bigger a company is and the higher that wall becomes between corporate and human ressource, the higher the risk becomes of how development takes a wrong path. Therefore i think the whole "negativity" thing is overexaggerated, at least with AAA ventures.
And trust me, i myself had to take a lot of criticism over my lifetime for my own achievements and decisions, i know how demotivating it can be,
but any independent developer will be in that same stormfront right in the first row.
There is no barrier that filters the critical voices, and there i see the big difference between the two.
And don't forget, most people don't voice their concerns, if they don't like something, or if they can't find a certain game entertaining anymore because of bugs, glitches or other annoyances, they will simply stop playing.
PlanCo, as another example. PlanCo's steep learning curve is what put a lot of casual players off, my girlfriend included, they just feel no desire to play any more, whereas that is no fault on FDev's side per se, but to be made aware of that takes a fair amount of listening and to find solutions. (and if you look at PlanCo's statistics it's actually visible)
This can't happen without people having a place where they can voice their concerns.
Hope that clears up a few things.
edit:typo
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Actually the old exploration gameplay was the thing that the exploration community continuously complained about. And lots of the people who did complain are now very happy with the changes. I do realise that not everyone likes it, but making it sound like everyone enjoyed the old gameplay and nobody does like it now is simply wrong.
You can't compare FDEV to EA or Activision though. Frontier is still an independent developer.
I think the underlying premise that happy people aren't as vocal stands up though.
Which is true for both arguments.
Ok, this time, without any sarcasm or cynicism involved, thank you FDev for making the effort to reach out to us and for fixing the TMTK!
forums.frontier.co.uk
That's the kind of commitment i was hoping for. Thank you!
Help with error messages
Hm... mods? I know the devs are super busy, but if we could maybe get word on what's going on and if/when there might be a fix, it'd be really helpful.
That's the kind of commitment i was hoping for. Thank you!
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