200 credits bounty, 250M credits punishment

[war4peace]

I am a returning player... and I have encountered the most ridiculous game mechanic ever seen in any game so far.
A couple days ago, upon attempting a planetary scan mission, I accidentally clicked instead of right-clicking and I launched a single SRV shot on a building from the outpost I was sent to. The automated defenses started shooting me, so I tailed outta there and abandoned the mission. I saw a fine/bounty of 200 credits on my head so i figured I would go to some station and pay it.
Yesterday I loggerd in again, attempted to finish a pending data delivery mission that I had taken earlier so I headed to the destination station. Upon arriving, I requested automated docking, which was granted, and an info message showed up in red: „Anonymous access”. Wondering that that meant, I alt-tabbed (I have Elite Dangerous in borderless windowed mode) and googled for that. While that happened, in the space of 30 seconds, my ship entered the station, being in the process of docking and suddenly was shot from all sides, me alt-tabbing back just in time to get the death pop-up message.

I lost 23 Hutton Mugs that I had in my cargo hold (no, I am not going to go get them again. EVER.), the ship itself (easily replaced through insurance), 3 Modular Terminals (and we all know how difficult it is to gather 25 for Marco Qwent)... and 250M worth of exploration data from my previous trip to Eta Carinae, Statue of Liberty and their surroundings.

That's a bit harsh, isn't it? /sarcasm

Seriously, it's like walking on the street, pulling out your phone and a piece of paper falls to the ground unnoticed. You keep walking and upon entering any public building you are beheaded and all your wealth destroyed.

I lost 5 or 6 days of exploration, hundreds of solar systems worth, and I am a bit upset. So what gives? Is this something that would remain in the game, unchanged? It makes no sense to inflict such a disproportionate punishment for such a small mistake, when there are countless methods to properly punish a mistake according to its gravity.

 

[Juanxlink]

Looks like you need to pay your fines?

Modular terminals are very very easy to get...

It will remain in the game, why would it be removed?

 

[Factabulous]

So you AFKed while docking with a lot of explo data. Huh.

Eh, Actually - 5-6 days, so not much - phew!

Anonymous access won't get you killed, but it sounds like you had a bounty - someone scanned you so your cover was blown, your crimes made clear for all to see, and they took you out. Now you're safely ded I guess it's time to read up on C&P

 

[Deleted member 38366]

Well..... yeah, that's the current C&P System for ya

Any accident that's Weapon-related - even if creating only a 100Cr fine - will make you a Wanted Murder Hobo that'll get killed if positively scanned.

However, it's ultra easy to circumvent, you just need to know what to do (and what to avoid).

To solve it, you can (i.e. after such an accident) :
- fly to the local Station (Anonymous Access) and pay up with local Authorities. This however will have you also deported to the nearest Detention Center!
(and if you're scanned by Authority before landing, you'll be attacked and destroyed unless you're super-quick to react, so it carries some risk and needs careful flying to avoid scans)

- fly to the nearest Low Security System and pay it via Interstellar Factors. The least hassle and by far the safest solution.

Once you understood that concept and the do's and don'ts , it becomes a mere minor annoyance - you just have to be careful and shouldn't forget your Wanted Status. It should be taken care of as soon as possible.

 

[war4peace]

I was on my way to pay the bloody fine, it was the first station I entered!
5-6 days is not to be trifled with, maybe we value our time differently, but I totally dislike spending time in vain.
And I did not AFK, I alt-tabbed to look up the mysterious „Anonymous Access” message which by itself tells nothing of the dangers it implies.

 

[zipline]

Yes OP, C&P is a nonsense. I was rescuing passengers from a burning station last weekend with stacked missions to pick up occupied escape pods. I had to jettison a few limpets to free up space for the pods and got fined, and when I was taking too long got threatened with death from station security, go figure.☺

 

[Screemonster]

did you not see the big red "you are wanted in this system" pop up when you were jumping there

 

[Factabulous]

OP does have a point in that C&P is not at all explained in the game - if you weren't paying attention to livestreams when it was introduced and haven't been playing then the first you know is that you get wanted / anonymous access and neither are explained, so I can understand how it causes issues. As with many parts of the game - google is your friend (certainly more of a friend than the Pilot's Handbook!)

 

[PaxtonNewt]

I am a returning player... and I have encountered the most ridiculous game mechanic ever seen in any game so far.
A couple days ago, upon attempting a planetary scan mission, I accidentally clicked instead of right-clicking and I launched a single SRV shot on a building from the outpost I was sent to. The automated defenses started shooting me, so I tailed outta there and abandoned the mission. I saw a fine/bounty of 200 credits on my head so i figured I would go to some station and pay it.
Yesterday I loggerd in again, attempted to finish a pending data delivery mission that I had taken earlier so I headed to the destination station. Upon arriving, I requested automated docking, which was granted, and an info message showed up in red: „Anonymous access”. Wondering that that meant, I alt-tabbed (I have Elite Dangerous in borderless windowed mode) and googled for that. While that happened, in the space of 30 seconds, my ship entered the station, being in the process of docking and suddenly was shot from all sides, me alt-tabbing back just in time to get the death pop-up message.

I lost 23 Hutton Mugs that I had in my cargo hold (no, I am not going to go get them again. EVER.), the ship itself (easily replaced through insurance), 3 Modular Terminals (and we all know how g difficult it is to gather 25 for Marco Qwent)... and 250M worth of exploration data from my previous trip to Eta Carinae, Statue of Liberty and their surroundings.

That's a bit harsh, isn't it? /sarcasm

Seriously, it's like walking on the street, pulling out your phone and a piece of paper falls to the ground unnoticed. You keep walking and upon entering any public building you are beheaded and all your wealth destroyed.

I lost 5 or 6 days of exploration, hundreds of solar systems worth, and I am a bit upset. So what gives? Is this something that would remain in the game, unchanged? It makes no sense to inflict such a disproportionate punishment for such a small mistake, when there are countless methods to properly punish a mistake according to its gravity.

Sorry to urinate on your chips but you took your eye off the ball..

 

[MickyG1982]

Well, there was more than one mistake, unfortunately on your part OP.

Starting with the gaining of the bounty, heading through going to a station managed by the same faction then alt tabbing away at what is possibly the worst time to do it, when docking.

The bounty mechanic itself has been around in one form or another since game release with only minor tweaks, i.e the bounty is now only tied to your ship and not to you. In future, it's already been mentioned, head to a low security system (not managed by the faction that holds a bounty against you) and pay off your bounty at an interstellar factors.

Once done, resume your business as if nothing happened. Lesson learned.

 

[Jmanis]

Why on earth were you towing around 250m in explo data for seemingly days after getting back to the bubble?!?

 

[war4peace]

So you went AFK to look the info up.
Why do you lie when you are going to be caught?

Erm, what was I supposed to do? Guess? Read into the ol' Crystal Ball? Cast a spell?

did you not see the big red "you are wanted in this system" pop up when you were jumping there

I admit I did not, the first thing I did was press 1 and look up destination stations.

Sorry to urinate on your chips but you took your eye off the ball..

That's an overly simplistic (and puerile) excuse for a game mechanic that does not differentiate between a small mistake and a huge crime.

@Jmanis I used partial explo data selling to boost my status among various factions. I want(ed) to obtain permits for locked solar systems and using Unoversal Cartographics is a fast metod to achieve that goal.

 

[Northpin]

Why on earth were you towing around 250m in explo data for seemingly days after getting back to the bubble?!?

Good question.
I get twitches when having 20 millions of explo data

 

[MickyG1982]

(1) Erm, what was I supposed to do? Guess? Read into the ol' Crystal Ball? Cast a spell?



(2)I admit I did not, the first thing I did was press 1 and look up destination stations.



(3)That's an overly simplistic (and puerile) excuse for a game mechanic that does not differentiate between a small mistake and a huge crime.

@Jmanis I used partial explo data selling to boost my status among various factions. I want(ed) to obtain permits for locked solar systems and using Unoversal Cartographics is a fast metod to achieve that goal.

(1) I think the point is not to do it at a critical moment when surrounded by security an a station with rather massive lasers...

(2) The game can't be held accountable for that.

(3) a bounty, is a bounty, is a bounty no matter what size it is, you are still a wanted criminal in game. But I'll give you that a 200 credit bounty is rediculus, it should be at least 100 times that.

 

[Jmanis]

Good question.
I get twitches when having 20 millions of explo data

So, I get there's BGS effects to be had if you hand it back in "pieces"... but that's the risk you take; lock yourself down to the station you intend to hand it in to day-to-day, or risk losing it all in favour of doing other things at the same time.... but still. That's crazy...

 

[Shiro Akai]

Ok, let's get the facts straight.

• I accidentally clicked instead of right-clicking and I launched a single SRV shot on a building from the outpost I was sent to.

You commited a crime of SHOOTING unprovoked. Intentional or not is irrelevant. Crime is crime.

• I saw a fine/bounty of 200 credits on my head

There's a colossal difference between fine and bounty. Fine is a parking ticket - just pay it off and be done. Bounty OTOH is more severe, making you WANTED and fair game for anyone interested.

• info message showed up in red: „Anonymous access”.

Warning sign meaning - beware. You have a crime on you and this must be treated first before concluding your usual business. Extra care is needed when interacting with stations.

• I alt-tabbed

Second major mistake. It's too late for tips&tricks but when you have uncertain situation (like described): READ first, act later. You could have done your reading before attempting to land. YOu can abort landing, withdraw, alt-tab and read all you want. With knowledge you can then make conscious decision.

Instead you went on blind.

• suddenly was shot from all sides,

AS already said, probably system police scanned you while you were alt-tabbed and confirmed your wanted status. Stations decided to claim that bounty, hence...

• me alt-tabbing back just in time to get the death pop-up message.

... you could just sit and watch fireworks.

Seriously, it's like walking on the street, pulling out your phone and a piece of paper falls to the ground unnoticed. You keep walking and upon entering any public building you are beheaded and all your wealth destroyed.

Not really.
It's more like you pulled a knife out of your pocket because you wanted to draw a heart on a tree bark and by mistake you cut another person. Then you keep walking and upon entering any public building you get arrested under assault reason because building security happened to watch public announcement about some guy running with knife and recognized you.

ED isn't forgiving game. Slight mishap and you're screwed. The fact that you had valuable to you cargo, exploration data is irrelevant. It adds to the loss but it doesn't affect the outcome. Main reason was that you commited a crime and got caught with it en-route to pay it off. Tough luck, things happen. Next time you'll be more careful.

 

[babelfisch]

I was on my way to pay the bloody fine, it was the first station I entered!
5-6 days is not to be trifled with, maybe we value our time differently, but I totally dislike spending time in vain.
And I did not AFK, I alt-tabbed to look up the mysterious „Anonymous Access” message which by itself tells nothing of the dangers it implies.

The red, bold wanted message on your screen could've given you an idea.

The 250m credits are not punishment for your crime but for doing everything wrong.

 

[war4peace]

• You commited a crime of SHOOTING unprovoked. Intentional or not is irrelevant. Crime is crime.

Agreed, but don't you think there are supposed to be degrees of severity attached to a crime?

• There's a colossal difference between fine and bounty. Fine is a parking ticket - just pay it off and be done. Bounty OTOH is more severe, making you WANTED and fair game for anyone interested.

Then 200 credit bounties shouldn't exist. The game mechanic, as envisioned by FDev, makes no difference from 200 credits bounty and 200M credits bounty, from an NPC point of view. It's a simple yes/no switch, and that's what the whole root cause is.

• Warning sign meaning - beware. You have a crime on you and this must be treated first before concluding your usual business. Extra care is needed when interacting with stations.

I was aware, as stated above I was on my way to pay it. I had no idea I should have picked station X over station Y or system A over system B to pay it. Yes, we could all blame this on lack of knowledge, but then again, 200 credits sets up some expectations. Would the bounty have been 2M credits or higher, then I would have blamed myself for ignoring a large problem. Crime and punishment are supposed to be proportional to each other. Small crime, small punishment. Large crime, large punishment. Oh and clear messages instead of cryptic ones, for that matter. Deny docking rights, clearly state "Docking attempt might result in ship destruction", you know... clear messages.

• Second major mistake. It's too late for tips&tricks but when you have uncertain situation (like described): READ first, act later. You could have done your reading before attempting to land. YOu can abort landing, withdraw, alt-tab and read all you want. With knowledge you can then make conscious decision.
  
  Instead you went on blind.

Agreed, IF the message would have been clear. "Anonymous access" - what would you make of that if you saw it for the first time? Tells you nothing, really, of what's hidden behind it. I went in blind because I was blinded still by docking request being accepted and a cryptic message. Not to mention the voice said "welcome blah-blah". Helluva welcome, wasn't it.

• AS already said, probably system police scanned you while you were alt-tabbed and confirmed your wanted status. Stations decided to claim that bounty, hence...

... you could just sit and watch fireworks.

And that is exactly what I am disputing here. No issue with the station claiming the biounty. But was this by any means a normal/expected/correct way of claiming a bounty? If someone ows you money and you see them in your neighborhood, shooting them would 1. make a mess and 2. not allow you to redeem any money... because that person is now dead.

Not really.
It's more like you pulled a knife out of your pocket because you wanted to draw a heart on a tree bark and by mistake you cut another person. Then you keep walking and upon entering any public building you get arrested under assault reason because building security happened to watch public announcement about some guy running with knife and recognized you.

Then the bounty should have been proportional to the severity of the crime. It was not. It set the wrong expectations.

ED isn't forgiving game. Slight mishap and you're screwed. The fact that you had valuable to you cargo, exploration data is irrelevant. It adds to the loss but it doesn't affect the outcome. Main reason was that you commited a crime and got caught with it en-route to pay it off. Tough luck, things happen. Next time you'll be more careful.

The problem isn't how forgiving the game is. I am okay with it being tough. But then I should have gotten clear warnings, not cryptic messages and fake station welcome notifications. At the very least, a countdown timer, say two minutes to get things resolved before coming down on me heavy-handed like that.

The red, bold wanted message on your screen could've given you an idea.

The 250m credits are not punishment for your crime but for doing everything wrong.

Yes, easy for you to say. Could be you don't remember having been a beginner...

What I am trying to say is the game did a very poor job conveying information to me, the bounty size set wrong expectations, there is no differentiation between various degrees of crime gravity. This all adds up to a game mechanic that makes no sense.

 

[d8veh]

It's a game of rules. If you follow the rules, you won't get into any trouble. If you break them, you need to do it in the right way. You broke the rules in the wrong way. You cannot expect to cruise into a station with a bounty on you. If you get scanned at the station with a bounty on you or carrying illegal goods, death will quickly follow. You have to either get in without being scanned or get rid of your bounty first.

200cr might not be much to you carrying millions of credits worth of cargo, but for the cop at the station, who only gets paid when he identifies a criminal, that might be his only money for a week.

 

[Northpin]

... the game did a very poor job conveying information to me...

Aye, ED does that.