Don't make it personal. Attack the opinion, but don't attack the person.
ANNOUNCEMENT January Update - Beta Announcement
- Thread starter Stephen Benedetti
- Start date
Burke did attack the opinion, because it is an incomplete description of the old process. Which part did you take personally?
Since January I have remained in explored space (apart from a couple of passenger missions) where the pre- and post-3.3 discovery processes work just fine together, there are no issues with this and players can use either the system map & proximity or the FSS Scanner Screen or both as they see fit.
There simply was no need to remove the old discovery modules, and as Burke implies the only thing removing them seems to have achieved is to annoy existing customers who were not complaining that exploration was boring or shallow. Now (imo) it is boring and shallow, but I accept that others enjoy or at least prefer it, or would if it worked properly, which is part of what this topic is about.
But the part that is broken is related to mapping, not discovery. It would have been an issue regardless of whether the old modules had remained or not.
When he says my posts are unhelpful. No need to go that route. And "but dont smear the ADS if you dont understand what people used to use it for. " I do know how the ADS was used for, and personally, I wanted it to stay as an option. I wasn't in the camp that wanted FSS to replace the ADS. But there's a difference between discussing the opinions I have and the issue of me having opinions or arguing what I understand (personally) or not. That's not opinions discussed to argue a person's knowledge or understanding.
I feel the current system is okay, but it's not good and if it worked properly I'd like it better. The poke at the "ADS" I did wasn't to downgrade the ADS at all. I just don't want the FSS to become another ADS where you get all information. There's no need to get to know the number of locations in the FSS. You only need to know that there's something to find using the DSS. Right now, the FSS counts the number of shoes in a crowd, but it can't tell you where those shoes are located on the floor. You have to use the DSS to find the shoes that you already counted. It's messed up. Either make the FSS do everything or fix the weird half-way concept.
I wanted the old ADS to be an option, just an FYI. I wasn't against having the ADS as a module that you could use instead of the FSS.
And what's broken for me is that the FSS has to count the POI locations... the more the longer it takes. 30+ locations equals 20 seconds of wait time. I just was in a system that had 4 planets like that. So 2 minutes about was just in total wait time... I wasn't playing the game while waiting for it to finish.
But if we have to keep the location counter in the FSS and have to accept the wait time, why not go all the way and remove the DSS. Just give us the locations for free in the FSS. Give us all when we scan. The DSS doesn't do anything besides what the FSS already have done.
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It wasnt meant to be. What you said was put forward as one of the reasons the ADS had to be taken away. Now it is true explorers often did other things at the same time but that doesnt actually mean anything. I watch tv while i play railway empire, it doesnt take anything away from the game. Plenty of other games aswell. To try and put that forward as an argument as to why the ADS should never come back is dishonest. Not sayng you are
That wasn't my intention. Sorry if it was taken that way. Personally, I wanted the ADS to stay as an option. I found it useful for certain types of discovery and exploration, but it could've been as a separate option to the FSS. Choose ADS or FSS, but not both.
I just find it annoying that somehow the FSS became another ADS of planets. The DSS doesn't do anything besides finding locations for the POIs the FSS already have found. The FSS can find all the houses and count them on the street, but then you have to use the DSS to actually find the houses on the street? It's not a consistent design.
The FSS can report "Geo sites found" but doesn't have to take 20 seconds to find each location.
Oh, I wasn't putting it forward as an argument that the ADS should never come back. My point is that either the FSS should become another ADS, just click and it does it all for you and find all locations (since it does it already while counting), or make the FSS and DSS be a bit of a chore where you get partial information at each level. Right now, the DSS is pretty much useless. It gives you locations for what the FSS already counted and extra credit, but that's it.Now it is true explorers often did other things at the same time but that doesnt actually mean anything. I watch tv while i play railway empire, it doesnt take anything away from the game. Plenty of other games aswell. To try and put that forward as an argument as to why the ADS should never come back is dishonest. Not sayng you are
With that said, I should leave this discussion. I don't want the developers get any ideas that could have a negative influence on the design. After all, I don't play as much as I used to and I can accept whatever direction they take it now. I'm a bit of "whatever".
I struggled with this at first and then discovered that instead of Outfitting, if you go via Station Services to Advanced Maintenance and then Restock you should be able to purchase a new SRV without needing to sell and rebuy the Hangar module. Seems a little counter intuitive and I'd prefer the option in both places.
You can 'target' one within the FSS, but only one. Multiple "mark for DSS" flags would be handy.
For me, this would be useful when isolating 'rogue' human signals unknown to the Nav Beacon.
When you still have to fly over and DSS the planet before it will show you where they're located anyway.
Which doesn't make sense to me. If the FSS can count them (even the ones on the back of the planets), it can find them all for me, so the DSS shouldn't be necessary. It just doesn't make sense. Hasty design in my opinion.
we all make suggestions based on incomplete information :
FDev said the detection of GEO depends on the rendering of the whole planet,
but
we don't know which operation is the longest : the mandatory rendering of the entire planet or the search of a suitable position for each GEO ?
could the rendering be interrupted as soon as the first GEO is located ?
the process should be shorter without the exact count of GEO, but maybe not much shorter...
So as it stands now the beta won't even last a full week and only the endgame players can test as they have access to the appropiate equipment.
Failed beta before it even started?
How are we supposed to test thargoid combat if some players don't even have access to guaedian weaponry?
Besides the highlighted issues, players will also test known bugs that haven't been highlighted, of which some required endgame equipment that is time consuming to unlock. I doubt they will have the time in the beta for doing so as it is too short for the gribd AND fir the testing period.
Developer tools for betas such as teleporting tools and spawning are required in order for all players to test. Sure I do have the luxury to have unlocked almost everything but even jumping to crystalline clusters or to some Thargoid system is an unecessary effort I am not willing to do.
The result will be that players will just test what they can right away in the state from the 18th november. Now imagine you are at beagle point and that time.
Sure, self destruct but did you unlock the gauss cannons yet? Have fun transferring your ships and do the grind, effectively wasting a day or two in the 5 day long beta.
Failed beta before it even started?
How are we supposed to test thargoid combat if some players don't even have access to guaedian weaponry?
Besides the highlighted issues, players will also test known bugs that haven't been highlighted, of which some required endgame equipment that is time consuming to unlock. I doubt they will have the time in the beta for doing so as it is too short for the gribd AND fir the testing period.
Developer tools for betas such as teleporting tools and spawning are required in order for all players to test. Sure I do have the luxury to have unlocked almost everything but even jumping to crystalline clusters or to some Thargoid system is an unecessary effort I am not willing to do.
The result will be that players will just test what they can right away in the state from the 18th november. Now imagine you are at beagle point and that time.
Sure, self destruct but did you unlock the gauss cannons yet? Have fun transferring your ships and do the grind, effectively wasting a day or two in the 5 day long beta.
Is there an endgame? I never noticed
As the beta runs with a snapshot of one's CMDR from 18th November (in the notes) buying, in your example, AX weaponry is still possible - even unlocking Guardian modules can be done in a couple of hours, where is the issue, apart from using some playtime to do something to check out another thing that one may not even had been considering?
Fine, the beta is likely to be a 'waste of time' as nothing is being done to allow 'painless upgrades' with all modules/ships being available for perhaps fish... but is opt-in... regardless of the 'limitations' not being relaxed, I, for one, will jump in and play - both my CMDRS on 18th were low on credits and not necessarily in the best of positions, but at least joining in will see just 'what' may have been 'fixed'.
Expend the effort you are happy with, should you join the beta, I will
If the bugs only affected commanders with fleets of every ship in the game you would have a point, but the truth is they can affect anyone no matter what equipment they have and surely the point is to test as realistically as possible the way the live game is used.
Human nature being what it is if we had easy access to all ships modules and so on a minimum of half of us would spend most of the time playing with stuff they don’t normally have access to rather than bothering about the bugs and fixes.
Betas aren't for everyone. My approach is simple - I'll be testing for bugs that "bug" me, including the FSS. Why would I test game mechanics (hunting Thargoids) that I don't normally use?
I'm sure between the collective community, all the changes will be thoroughly tested.
Ofcourse I will join but this is due to got the luxury to do so. I am more so concerned about the CMDRs that can not test some things like thargoid combat.Is there an endgame? I never noticed
As the beta runs with a snapshot of one's CMDR from 18th November (in the notes) buying, in your example, AX weaponry is still possible - even unlocking Guardian modules can be done in a couple of hours, where is the issue, apart from using some playtime to do something to check out another thing that one may not even had been considering?
Fine, the beta is likely to be a 'waste of time' as nothing is being done to allow 'painless upgrades' with all modules/ships being available for perhaps fish... but is opt-in... regardless of the 'limitations' not being relaxed, I, for one, will jump in and play - both my CMDRS on 18th were low on credits and not necessarily in the best of positions, but at least joining in will see just 'what' may have been 'fixed'.
Expend the effort you are happy with, should you join the beta, I will
Also what is this ridiculous argument then we should only test what we usually play? For this reason, for exactly this reason, bugs happen because only the intended use cases get tested but not the other 90% possible ways.
The result will be that for intended uses the tested procedure is working fine but perhaps the hidden exploits remain undetected and the occasional, difficult to reproduce bugs too.
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Great response
I'd prefer that everything be unlocked for 'pennies' for the beta just to allow some luxury in choice to doing things I'd normally work my around to... The 3.3 beta last year, while removing 'restrictions' e.g. rank, still had everything 'full price' which was a disadvantage for 'poorer' players.
Both my CMDRs are low credits at the time of the snapshot (not improved much since, but do have Prismatics
) so it will be an 'interesting' beta for me 
https://issues.frontierstore.net/
We'll be updating the Issue Tracker with a January Update (Update 3.6) Beta section, and we encourage all those who are taking part in this beta to report any encountered bugs or issues through it. In addition, we will also be adding links from inside the game that will take you directly to the Issue Tracker site.
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