In the Beta Spirit...

[Faded Glory]

The Beta spirit! Where's the beta spirit?

I think the beta's over...

On the subject of avatars, I'm quite taken with mine. Still, might be a struggle finding such a gas giant without an optional ADS - I mean you'd have to scan every single gas giant you come across.

And think how cool it would be to find a gas giant with a santa hat, and how disappointing it would be to miss it.

 

[WR3ND]

Yeah, I do wonder at all the systems I've passed over on DW2, not having the time and willpower to check them.

 

[Riverside]

Yeah, I do wonder at all the systems I've passed over on DW2, not having the time and willpower to check them.

I have previously described it as like travelling through a tunnel rather than looking out the window on the off-chance of seeing something interesting.

FDev appear to want players to actually find stuff but that chance is now reduced during fast travel.

 

[[VR] Merkir]

I didn't say anything about not agreeing with you, aside from your misrepresentation of the FSS as a "kids spaceship arcade game", which was far from a constructive comment.

Actually what Wr3nd said is not far from being factually correct. Hypothetically, if I were asked my professional opinion of the FSS (or DSS) in the context of the ED Universe, I could only characterise it as a child's toy, or at best a child's learning toy. Why? Because any electrical engineer would simply take the FSS and add basic 20th century tech to automate it. There would be no antiquated tuning dial, no zoom in/out buttons.

The FSS mechanics would fit perfectly in a 1960's Earth setting. But in ED, or any setting past 1990 Earth? Nope, it's absurd to think that thousands of explorers are out in the black manually fiddling with their... ahem... dials.

And if you ask any other electrical engineer (or related technologist), I think you'd get the same professional opinion.

 

[M00ka]

Actually what Wr3nd said is not far from being factually correct. Hypothetically, if I were asked my professional opinion of the FSS (or DSS) in the context of the ED Universe, I could only characterise it as a child's toy, or at best a child's learning toy. Why? Because any electrical engineer would simply take the FSS and add basic 20th century tech to automate it. There would be no antiquated tuning dial, no zoom in/out buttons.

The FSS mechanics would fit perfectly in a 1960's Earth setting. But in ED, or any setting past 1990 Earth? Nope, it's absurd to think that thousands of explorers are out in the black manually fiddling with their... ahem... dials.

And if you ask any other electrical engineer (or related technologist), I think you'd get the same professional opinion.

So you are saying because of your profession, you are an expert on 34th Century technology?

 

[CMDR Karrde Sun]

That’s a really good point. I never fully considered how silly manual analoge tuning is. I remember the radios in my parents first cars having the little red needle that moved up and down manually.. for close to 30 years now us real world humans have had automatic tuning.

Weve even moved on go streaming so to match today’s technology we should get a grid of squares stuck with a picture of the body type to pick and choose which body we would like to claim all the rewards for.

 

[[VR] Merkir]

So you are saying because of your profession, you are an expert on 34th Century technology?

It's not about 34th century technology. It's about the absence of basic 20th century technology, in an ED Universe that already has such technology as galaxy-wide real time telepresence, and FTL hyperdrives.

 

[Shinji Ikari]

That’s a really good point. I never fully considered how silly manual analoge tuning is. I remember the radios in my parents first cars having the little red needle that moved up and down manually.. for close to 30 years now us real world humans have had automatic tuning.

Weve even moved on go streaming so to match today’s technology we should get a grid of squares stuck with a picture of the body type to pick and choose which body we would like to claim all the rewards for.

Many modern radios just have buttons for multiple channels and let you autotune into one of your choosing, you can also manually tune them but it's no use.

 

[CMDR Karrde Sun]

Many modern radios just have buttons for multiple channels and let you autotune into one of your choosing, you can also manually tune them but it's no use.

Ahh good point wifey has those on her dashboard thing. I don’t use the radio. Maybe they chose to copy it as a novelty then.

Maybe the sounds we’re hearing are thargoid commercials for fang sharpening or an escape pod kebab restaurant.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

It's not about 34th century technology. It's about the absence of basic 20th century technology, in an ED Universe that already has such technology as galaxy-wide real time telepresence, and FTL hyperdrives.

The whole game has an absence of basic 20th century technology. If it didn't there wouldn't be much of a game to play. Most things would be automated. It's a poor analogy.

And just because it isn't automated doesn't make it a child's toy. My car isn't automated, even though you have automated cars, it doesn't make it a child's toy. Planes can be automated and don't need a pilot to land, take off or fly, but flying one isn't a child's toy. That whole reasoning is ridiculous. How fun would a plane simulator be if all you did is put it on autopilot and watched.

In fact I would say it's more like the other way round. The more automated it is, the more child friendly it gets.

We play games to play, not to let games do everything for us.

 

[CMDR Karrde Sun]

The whole game has an absence of basic 20th century technology. If it didn't there wouldn't be much of a game to play. Most things would be automated. It's a poor analogy.

And just because it isn't automated doesn't make it a child's toy. My car isn't automated, even though you have automated cars, it doesn't make it a child's toy. Planes can be automated and don't need a pilot to land, take off or fly, but flying one isn't a child's toy. That whole reasoning is ridiculous. How fun would a plane simulator be if all you did is put it on autopilot and watched.

In fact I would say it's more like the other way round. The more automated it is, the more child friendly it gets.

We play games to play, not to let games do everything for us.

About as fun as exploration is by clicking and watching.

yes I know you can do it differently.

 

[M00ka]

About as fun as exploration is by clicking and watching.

yes I know you can do it differently.

Hey better than the old system that was essentially just clicking once

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

About as fun as exploration is by clicking and watching.

yes I know you can do it differently.

You can't explore by clicking and watching in ED though.

 

[[VR] Merkir]

The whole game has an absence of basic 20th century technology. If it didn't there wouldn't be much of a game to play. Most things would be automated. It's a poor analogy.

And just because it isn't automated doesn't make it a child's toy. My car isn't automated, even though you have automated cars, it doesn't make it a child's toy. Planes can be automated and don't need a pilot to land, take off or fly, but flying one isn't a child's toy. That whole reasoning is ridiculous. How fun would a plane simulator be if all you did is put it on autopilot and watched.

In fact I would say it's more like the other way round. The more automated it is, the more child friendly it gets.

We play games to play, not to let games do everything for us.

Your whole reply seems to infer that I said the FSS should be automated. I did not. You seem to get very defensive and threatened by my post. There's no need to be. I was just pointing out the obvious, that the FSS would never be implemented as it has in any sane Universe. Plenty of other things in ED are equally as absurd. Why? It's a game.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

Your whole reply seems to infer that I said the FSS should be automated. I did not. You seem to get very defensive and threatened by my post. There's no need to be. I was just pointing out the obvious, that the FSS would never be implemented as it has in any sane Universe. Plenty of other things in ED are equally as absurd. Why? It's a game.

Lol, so pointing out the obvious is me feeling threatened and defensive. Sorry mate, can't see it.

Of course all games are absurd. So if the lack of automation is not what makes it childish, what is then, as you haven't explained that yet. What's less childish about pressing a button for five seconds to get the whole system map? What's less childish about playing pretend space ships in a pretend future setting.

Or are you just talking the UI. Well that's just a matter of taste. I don't see anything more childish about it then any other part of the game.

 

[M00ka]

Your whole reply seems to infer that I said the FSS should be automated. I did not. You seem to get very defensive and threatened by my post. There's no need to be. I was just pointing out the obvious, that the FSS would never be implemented as it has in any sane Universe. Plenty of other things in ED are equally as absurd. Why? It's a game.

Your entire premise is that if the technology exists in the 20th/21st century then it must exist in the 34th century - right!

So care to explain how so many trades and skills that were available even as little as a century ago are now lost? Skills like the correct composition of Damascus steel, how ancient civilisations performed engineering marvels like the pyramids - even now we are only guessing on how they achieved it. Long forgotten medicines and cures that we, the current pinnacle of human evolution is only just rediscovering now.

How do you know how computers will work in the 34th century, I gather you are still thinking they will be binary but they could be quantum or some system that hasn't even been thought of yet. Your inference that what is known now will be known in the future is fraught with inaccuracies. Plus your conviction that 21st Century technology will still be relevant and compatible with 34th century components. It is like assuming that you can program today's computers by using Ancient Greek because well they spoke that back then so it must still be viable.

 

[Shinji Ikari]

Your entire premise is that if the technology exists in the 20th/21st century then it must exist in the 34th century - right!

Actually, there's already a prevalence of automation in ED and AI, just look at the docking computers, that's considerably more sophisticated than signal processing and tracking. The rest of your post is a misleading analogy given information is far better preserved as it currently stands not to mention civilizations used to be quite isolated in nature, that's most certainly not the case at the moment, there are also relatively pristine samples of the not so far future in the space archs.

 

[M00ka]

Actually, there's already a prevalence of automation in ED and AI, just look at the docking computers, that's considerably more sophisticated than signal processing and tracking. The rest of your post is a misleading analogy given information is far better preserved as it currently stands not to mention civilizations used to be quite isolated in nature, that's most certainly not the case at the moment, there are also relatively pristine samples of the not so far future in the space archs.

I know you think you are well above everyone here, but you should really bone up on your Lore. There is no Artificial Intelligence in the 34th Century, it was outlawed after the AI war:
“Part of the secret history of the universe is that AI (sentient machine) has been created on a few occasions and they’ve proven to be so dangerous that they’ve basically been banned. AI is one of the few things that the Alliance, independents, Empire and Federation will actively work together against to defeat if they have to. It’s not made public knowledge, because they don’t want people to be actively working on it, but things are kept behind the scenes to make sure such technology never develops. That doesn’t mean of course that it hasn’t. It is believed that maybe one or two have escaped into deep space, but who knows, maybe we should find out.”
Now as Michael Brookes commented "It's not AI that's banned, but machine sentience. You can still have smart computers, but they're not allowed to be self-aware." So there is smart computers but no AI, hence why the DC's are so basic I guess.

As for the rest of my post, well of course you would dismiss it, you dismiss most of what is posted in these forums. But all it takes for our current information base to cease to exist is a few nuclear weapons detonated in the atmosphere, a concerted terrorism act or maybe just a simple technology revolt which is more than likely. Look at the current push to cease any technology that contributes to the carbon footprint, remove electricity and we will be back with pen and paper - if we are allowed to turn trees into paper ….

 

[[VR] Merkir]

So if the lack of automation is not what makes it childish, what is then, as you haven't explained that yet.

As an example, we have a place in our capital called Questacon. It's had over 3 million visits from school children. Many of the exhibits there are real items, tools, or technology which in effect have been broken down into parts/exhibits in such a way that kids can easily interact with them in a fun manner to learn how they work.

The FSS would be a perfect exhibit... a perfect example of what I previously described as a child's learning tool. It takes a device that would otherwise be completely automated (with basic 20th century tech) and converts it into a manually operated hand-eye coordination "fun" device.

So yes, I characterise the FSS as a child's learning tool. FDev decided that their new gameplay is the fun involved with using fine motor skills to coordinate tuning dials and zoom buttons, just as a child would use to learn how the device works to identify system bodies.

Nothing sinister. Just FDev's choice, as always.

 

[Shinji Ikari]

I know you think you are well above everyone here, but you should really bone up on your Lore. There is no Artificial Intelligence in the 34th Century, it was outlawed after the AI war.

The docking computer is already an AI lol, the quote you cited conflates AI with sentient machines. AI is far far broader term.

Now as Michael Brookes commented "It's not AI that's banned, but machine sentience. You can still have smart computers, but they're not allowed to be self-aware."

Yes, again, I said AI not setient machines.

So there is smart computers but no AI, hence why the DC's are so basic I guess.

Again, you don't seem to understand what is AI in the first place, even the quote you provided acknowledges the difference lol.

As for the rest of my post, well of course you would dismiss it, you dismiss most of what is posted in these forums. But all it takes for our current information base to cease to exist is a few nuclear weapons detonated in the atmosphere, a concerted terrorism act or maybe just a simple technology revolt which is more than likely. Look at the current push to cease any technology that contributes to the carbon footprint, remove electricity and we will be back with pen and paper - if we are allowed to turn trees into paper ….

This is based on rather preposterous and wild guesses, also, information is not only stored on physical mediums but is in the collective minds of people as skills and automation is a very widespread skill used across industries and academia.

I forgot to mention, automation must still be prevalent in ED by virtue of the techonology and products made.