New player experience: Tutorial "Harmless" combat is rage-quit difficult.

New player here (PC, keyboard/mouse) and I gotta say the "Harmless" combat tutorial missions in the newbie Pilot's Federation District are so frustratingly difficult they make me want to just give up this game and move on.

There is so much for a new player to learn already, shouldn't the first experience of combat be rewarding and enticing instead of rage-quit inducing?

At the very least, Harmless opponents should NOT have their shields come back online after a few seconds... Talk about kicking a new player in the teeth, over and over and over.
And after 45 minutes of trying to stay on this peon's tail chipping away hull armor 1% at a time, just when it seems I might actually get him, he just high-wake frameshifts out.

Does Frontier even want new players? Great way to drive them away...
 
So you can't defeat harnless opponents and still want reward? This game isn't for a 12yo bud. What if I told you that in the real game you gotta pay 5% (which is not much) of your ship's current credit value each time you get blown up? And that you lose your ship completely if you can't afford these 5%?

This game is for a type of person that can deal with failure and doesn't expect to always be successful regardless of skill level.

Can't beat something? Hah, well yeah there are two options. First being to practice and git gud as the community likes to say (for example doing simple manouver tutorials, flying a space ship is more than just WASD and space jump, dude) and the second one is demanding to make harmless NPCs less challenging (believe me bud, that is just making them a stationary target without weapons. You can't really make it any less challenging).
Ine of these options is effective. And while you figure out which one that is, I just gonna sit here and wait.
 
Geez, he just wants to have fun.
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the "Harmless" combat tutorial missions in the newbie Pilot's Federation District
Umm, you might want to do the TRAINING session's various simulation scenarios first a few times before jumping into the game in earnest.

Note: challenge scenarios can be very challenging even to 'veteran' E: D players, if they don't do much combat. You may need to be at least decent PvP player to defeat the harder ones.
 
Welcome to the Elite Galaxy commander!

You can safely ignore combat for now. Combat is largely optional in normal play. While your combat rank is low the game will only send low-ranked NPCs after you every now and then. Simply run away and jump to another system if you feel you're going to lose a fight After you've gained some experience flying around you can engage in combat on your own terms. Go ahead and play the game the way you want.

There is a Newcomers: Questions, Guides & Tutorials subforum where you can ask any question. The players hanging around there will answer with pleasure without mocking you.

o7
 
First of all - welcome CMDR.


shouldn't the first experience of combat be rewarding and enticing instead of rage-quit inducing?

Umm... both YES and NO.

YES - because you could be hooked with how great, entertaining and rewarding combat is, wanting you more of that which would make you play for longer than a aweek a nd then dump the title.

NO - because it could make false feeling. With easy and rewarding tutorial you would face true combat where issues happen and without knowing how to cope with them would make you feel cheated as you had experience different from tutorials.

Unlike other games, ED combat is heavily imbalanced and there are many factors that impact final outcome. Your rank vs target rank, your ship vs target ship, your modules and power management. Engineering (which alone has massive impact and alters combat heavily) and target pilot rank. There is no simple equation that says "if Sidewinder/Adder/Keelback/any other small ship, then easy prey". YOu can kill easily harmless Anacondas while being killed within seconds by elite Hauler.



At the very least, Harmless opponents should NOT have their shields come back online after a few seconds... Talk about kicking a new player in the teeth, over and over and over.
And after 45 minutes (snip) he just high-wake frameshifts out.

Sadly, lack of experience shows. Nothing to be ashamed, some things come with time. We here already know that knocked off shield regenerate with time. So if target manages to avoid you for some time he will regain his shields. Same applies to you - when you loose shields wait a bit till they regenerate.

One exception, and many CMDRs fall into this, is what I call "IF-THEN" bad programming. Which, sadly, is a result of P2P instead of central server multiplayer design and lack of consistency in the world. Without going into much details - essentially process of dropping into instance (exit Supercruise at the station) means that every NPC is "created" for that instance. If you're in combat with one and he manages to wake out - for you he goes Supercruise or jumops to diferent system - continues to exist with all states (HP, shields, ammo count). For game this NPC is deleted with his states and kept as a "record" that there was NPC.

If you manage to stumble upon him (either pull out of SC or being interdicted by him), game creates new instance with NEW NPC. That's why we have documented (and ranted) stories how NPCs "magically" regenerate shields in a matter of seconds, renegerate lost armor, even change ship type and weapon loadout mid-flight. It's because game lacks consistency and creates and deletes NPC on the go. Re-creating one given NPC falls under IF-THEN rule.

IF instance with player, THEN spawn NPC
Without consistency we don't get the same NPC, with same state (hull, shield damage) but entirely new one.

Sounds like massive bug.mistake or call it as you like. ED is full of those "features".

Anyway - ED is a game for specific kind of player. It's not faast and quick for nice 30 minute evening session to wind down after busy work day. It's not a shooter where you take bigger (than oponent) ship and blast everything out of the sky. Here you work your a...ahem, bottom out for small pay off and one small mistake, miscalculation and all of your effort is lost.

Sounds awful but don't get the wrong idea -ED can be great game. Provided you approach it the proper way. What is proper way - this you must discover yourself.
 
I must admit, the mouse Keyboard combination is THE hardest control method to master. Once you do, it gives you the most accurate control (especially in flight assist off). However, it is not the most 'enjoyable' way to fly your ship. A game pad or ,even better, a HOTAS Joystick will give you a real feel of flying a ship, not playing a game.
 
Bah kids these days have it so easy, what with their super cruise assist, docking computers, their own fenced off playground and fancy new tutorials.
Back in my day we were given a used Cessna 170 with a cracked windshield and a pellet gun for protection. We'd leave Baker's Prospect and be interdicted and blowed up 42 times before ever leaving the Asellus system.

j/k OP, hang in there and be patient we've all been there
 

Deleted member 182079

D
The only tutorial I played was the one introduced in the September patch, and only because I knew it unlocked a free paintjob.

As someone who grew up with difficult/unbalanced/broken games and more often than not without even a manual, having to work out the mechanics of a game is part of the fun.

But games have become increasingly hand-holdy since, and many players appear to expect a reward for simply booting up the game now. Elite is (still) not one of those, thank god.
 
It's easy for us veterans to forget just how difficult it all is when you first start out. I feel you OP, but as others have said, compared to the skill cap, this is really not even on the scale. It took me a year to 'git gud', but the journey was decent and the reward worth it.

Joining a good squadron makes things a lot easier, mostly in terms of knowledge sharing.
 
I think the game should do a better job in telegraphic how tricky it is.

My misses had the exact same experience.

Add to the existing voice acted sections, particularly combat. With the voice giving encouragement throughout the combat stages.
"You're already doing better than me! You should have seen my first attempt at combat school. You think it took you a long time to drop those shields? You only took {t} seconds, it took me {t + 60} seconds!"
"Yeah it's hard. But you do get gud"
"Nearly got it"
"So close!" when the shield goes back up with 10% hull

This should be fairly extensive and with sufficient reactive responses that over the 30 minutes or so, the noob doesn't hear the same response twice per playthrough.
 
So you can't defeat harnless opponents and still want reward? This game isn't for a 12yo bud. What if I told you that in the real game you gotta pay 5% (which is not much) of your ship's current credit value each time you get blown up? And that you lose your ship completely if you can't afford these 5%?

This game is for a type of person that can deal with failure and doesn't expect to always be successful regardless of skill level.

Can't beat something? Hah, well yeah there are two options. First being to practice and git gud as the community likes to say (for example doing simple manouver tutorials, flying a space ship is more than just WASD and space jump, dude) and the second one is demanding to make harmless NPCs less challenging (believe me bud, that is just making them a stationary target without weapons. You can't really make it any less challenging).
Ine of these options is effective. And while you figure out which one that is, I just gonna sit here and wait.
Hey I gotta say this might be the most pathetic response I've seen. A new player is struggling with something and you're... gloating? Why did you even post this? Did you sit there thinking "this is a good idea, so many people are going to think I'm so cool!"

Hey but let's get back to the topic at hand. This new player strangely uses the term "high wake", which I wouldn't think a brand new player struggling with a tutorial would be familiar with. Curious.

Otherwise, mostly fine advice has been dispensed in this thread. Excepting quoted above, of course.
 
New player here (PC, keyboard/mouse) and I gotta say the "Harmless" combat tutorial missions in the newbie Pilot's Federation District are so frustratingly difficult they make me want to just give up this game and move on.

There is so much for a new player to learn already, shouldn't the first experience of combat be rewarding and enticing instead of rage-quit inducing?

At the very least, Harmless opponents should NOT have their shields come back online after a few seconds... Talk about kicking a new player in the teeth, over and over and over.
And after 45 minutes of trying to stay on this peon's tail chipping away hull armor 1% at a time, just when it seems I might actually get him, he just high-wake frameshifts out.

Does Frontier even want new players? Great way to drive them away...
Hey OP,

Welcome to the game (not said ironically) and the forums!

I might be wrong, but suspect there’s going to be a bit of mix up going on.

When you say ‘Tutorial’ do you mean the actual tutorials, as in the ones you can do from the main menu and don’t have to enter the game for, or have you picked a mission within the main game? I’ve not had a play around in the PF district since the September update, so may have missed or forgotten something, but prior to that update there were certainly missions which were harmless ranked but which weren’t tutorial missions (and weren’t necessarily particularly suitable for a new starter).

Regardless, if you haven’t done them have a go at the Training section in the main menu. Do the basic combat one, have a stab at the advanced one (don’t worry if you can’t do it, word on the street is that most people struggle). Then have more of a go at the live game. When you’re familiar with the controls, and basic combat, then go back and have a go at the Challenge Scenarios.

Stick with it, the combat is one of the best parts of the game! It may seem challenging now, but it’s heavily dependent on developing your skill, knowledge and experience, and as you get better, you’ll continually be able to take on and beat bigger and harder challenges!

Good luck!
 
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