Guests constant needs for shops ruins the game

eulemur · Dec 23, 2019

As for guests not going through the whole zoo - make sure your most popular species are the furthest distance from the entrance. It goes a long way to encourage movement.

I agree on having vending machines/drinking fountains to help solve this issue. I don’t have a problem with it personally at the moment, but my zoo is still quite small (at least for what I have planned for it) - larger restaurants with 2 food and 2 drink shops in busier areas (to reduce queue time) and smaller snack and drink outlets dotted around in between has worked well for me.

Kiwolf · Dec 23, 2019

Moosegun said:
Hotels 100% this, I have been thinking the same thing. Not only would it give people more time but it would also give other points of entrance and exit / further income source. Themed hotels would be really cool to make as well, would love to see them in the game.

Ping me a link to thread

Zoo hotels

The guest's are not able to stay long enough to see the animals they like... why not provide them with a resort type hotel that can maybe be build room by room for guest's. i would also consider making it with an open mind because the amount of space are actually given is quite large.. half the...

forums.frontier.co.uk

Would be nice to see because it wouldn't just bring in guest's from the area either... you may actually be able to see tourism at it's best!

Kiwolf · Dec 23, 2019

eulemur said:
As for guests not going through the whole zoo - make sure your most popular species are the furthest distance from the entrance. It goes a long way to encourage movement.

Here' the problem with placing your most popular species further back.. It may encourage movement but it can also tank your zoo depending on how long the customers stay in your zoo.. There is an issues right now where guests only spend between 10 to 60 minutes in your zoo... There are screen shots of such.. So i don't think it is just placement..

Heck, I got my grizzly (which are the most popular animal in my north American zoo) right next to my main entrance (mind you there is a built building that splits up area..) and I have not really had a problem with movement and guest.. I think it is a time constraint..

P3NGU1N · Dec 23, 2019

Even the ability to add multiple guest spawners and entrance gates (only can be done in sandbox) would help out for the time crunch.

Jaggid Edje · Dec 23, 2019

P3NGU1N said:
Even the ability to add multiple guest spawners and entrance gates (only can be done in sandbox) would help out for the time crunch.

For sure. I really think they need to address this. Even if it didn't help with guest movement, it hurts our creativity in zoo design not being able to do it. Considering it can be done in Sandbox it is clearly just a decision they have made not to give us this ability in other modes, and I think they need to change that decision.

Kiwolf · Dec 23, 2019

P3NGU1N said:
Even the ability to add multiple guest spawners and entrance gates (only can be done in sandbox) would help out for the time crunch.

I agree. The option should be there.. I also think the rides being fixed would help. Currently the rides don't give you enough for the amount of people you have within the zoo.

Moosegun · Dec 23, 2019

P3NGU1N said:
Even the ability to add multiple guest spawners and entrance gates (only can be done in sandbox) would help out for the time crunch.

Hotels do just that, it is such a good solution, would help with so many things.

Imagin · Dec 23, 2019

I kinda like the idea of themed hotels, that would be fun. Have Frontier acknowledged any problems with the rides yet? Is there a fix expected?

Kiwolf · Dec 23, 2019

Imagin said:
I kinda like the idea of themed hotels, that would be fun. Have Frontier acknowledged any problems with the rides yet? Is there a fix expected?

Have not heard anything about a ride fix yet.. I hope they are working on it

Crea_TivELA · Dec 23, 2019

Moosegun said:
They are probably my favourite thing in my zoo, i have a train, monorail (building second) and a riverboat. The riverboat is quieter now, sometimes empty, the train is pretty busy, monorail is full all the time. You can actually make out the queues on that heatmap I posted. Lose leader though, wont do anything but loose money on them. I find them vital for moving people about.

Oh I didn't meant that it's not useful that way... it's bugged because people can't use it. I tried multiple times, saw threads on that too - so I'm not alone. For me people get on the train (with much luck it drives and) they stay on it forever... they never leave. Either they don't even start to drive or they just stay on it because they can't leave the train station somehow. There are a lot thirsty and hungry prople on that train for me

so the 3 times I tried, I ended up with deleting the transport ride again.
I played PlanCo a lot, so I know how to build... it's bugged... at least for me and some others too. So you are lucky you can use it, I hope it stays that way.

Gasalon · Dec 25, 2019

P3NGU1N said:
Even the ability to add multiple guest spawners and entrance gates (only can be done in sandbox) would help out for the time crunch.

You can place additional guest spawners and entrances in franchise mode:

Open an empty sandbox game and create a small blueprint containing a spawner or an entrance (e.g. a flat roof element and a spawner on top). Then go into your franchise game and bring up the my blueprints menu. The spawner blueprint will show a lock. To use it anyways you have to select the previous blueprint and then hit the key that lets you jump to the next item (which one that is depends on your key bindings). Doing so will ignore any restrictions for items in that blueprint (spawner, entrances, missing research, etc.) and you can place as many as you want.

But before you get your hopes up high I have to disappoint you, because it does not fix any of the current problems. You will still have guests leaving at 10 minutes and/or visiting every single food store in the zoo but no animals thus leaving the zoo with low happiness and without donating much. This will kill most larger zoos (>half of the map). I gave up my franchise zoo which was running perfectly fine moneywise before 1.1.0 (200 hrs and over 350 animals) and I‘ll just play sandbox from now on until they fix this mess.

marcnesiumHH · Dec 25, 2019

Gasalon said:
You can place additional guest spawners and entrances in franchise mode:

Open an empty sandbox game and create a small blueprint containing a spawner or an entrance (e.g. a flat roof element and a spawner on top). Then go into your franchise game and bring up the my blueprints menu. The spawner blueprint will show a lock. To use it anyways you have to select the previous blueprint and then hit the key that lets you jump to the next item (which one that is depends on your key bindings). Doing so will ignore any restrictions for items in that blueprint (spawner, entrances, missing research, etc.) and you can place as many as you want.

But before you get your hopes up high I have to disappoint you, because it does not fix any of the current problems.

Thanks for sharing your testing with guest spawners in franchise, though it does not help with the original problem.

Jaggid Edje · Dec 25, 2019

Gasalon said:
Open an empty sandbox game and create a small blueprint containing a spawner or an entrance (e.g. a flat roof element and a spawner on top). Then go into your franchise game and bring up the my blueprints menu. The spawner blueprint will show a lock. To use it anyways you have to select the previous blueprint and then hit the key that lets you jump to the next item (which one that is depends on your key bindings). Doing so will ignore any restrictions for items in that blueprint (spawner, entrances, missing research, etc.) and you can place as many as you want.

Thanks a ton for sharing this information!

I don't care that much about the disclaimer you had after the nugget of useful info, because I mostly make zoos with no more than 30 or so habitats, so none of that negative stuff effects me. But I've wanted to be able to have more than one zoo entrance even in some of my smaller zoos...for design and aesthetic reasons.

Andersioh · Dec 26, 2019

I absolutely agree this is a problem that is ruining a big part of the game for me. Guest come into the park with a need for food and drink and need it bad, so I had to place 3 food and 5 drink stalls near the entrance and it's not enough. 1 minute walk further and there are 4 more stalls. Still not enough. The guests treat this as a restaurant and complain about the lines. They don't seem to care about animals at all.

Nioell · Dec 27, 2019

I agree, especially the thirst need is insane. I mean I don't think I ever had a zoo where that need was in the green for a longer period of time without placing drink shops every 5-10m and that is NOT what the game should be about. And I get that the guest gotta have needs as well and of course you have to look after them just as much as the animals to make a zoo a real success, but it really needs to be balanced way better in the game. So please, either reduce the guests need for food and especially drink or at least give us drinking fountains like the others already mentioned which we can place every few meters...

This is my main franchise zoo ATM (there are two more food courts not shown with 2 drink and food stalls each) and guests just keep running from one drink shop to the next and obviously it's still far from enough. I already added more shops inbetween the food courts but it's barely making a difference and constantly playing planet thirst need manager really isn't fun anymore :/

Oh and the fact that higher temps make it even worse than it already is doesn't help either...like my zoo's set in Europe and I don't even wanna know how many drink shops you'd need in an African desert zoo where it's constantly 42°C ._.

PeppyPepp · Dec 27, 2019

@Nioell Completely agree with everything you pointed out. We shouldn't have to put food/drink shops every few meters. The needs really need some balancing. What happened to me is that guests were leaving unhappy and my refunds amount increased because they were "Unhappy with visit" and it came down to their thirst/hunger needs not being met.

Moosegun · Dec 27, 2019

Nioell said:
I agree, especially the thirst need is insane. I mean I don't think I ever had a zoo where that need was in the green for a longer period of time without placing drink shops every 5-10m and that is NOT what the game should be about. And I get that the guest gotta have needs as well and of course you have to look after them just as much as the animals to make a zoo a real success, but it really needs to be balanced way better in the game. So please, either reduce the guests need for food and especially drink or at least give us drinking fountains like the others already mentioned which we can place every few meters...

This is my main franchise zoo ATM (there are two more food courts not shown with 2 drink and food stalls each) and guests just keep running from one drink shop to the next and obviously it's still far from enough. I already added more shops inbetween the food courts but it's barely making a difference and constantly playing planet thirst need manager really isn't fun anymore :/

Oh and the fact that higher temps make it even worse than it already is doesn't help either...like my zoo's set in Europe and I don't even wanna know how many drink shops you'd need in an African desert zoo where it's constantly 42°C ._.

Do you have chillers around your zoo? It is 42c, chillers will make a massive difference to your thirst needs

Nioell · Dec 27, 2019

Yeah, I do have some chillers around, but like I said the zoo's in Europe so it's not that hot all the time and it's pretty much like that all the time no matter if it's 20°C or 42°C. Though I think I'm gonna go open a desert zoo and take a closer look at how much of a difference those coolers actually make when it comes to thirst needs...might be interesting, so thanks for bringing that up again!

Moosegun · Dec 27, 2019

Nioell said:
Yeah, I do have some chillers around, but like I said the zoo's in Europe so it's not that hot all the time and it's pretty much like that all the time no matter if it's 20°C or 42°C. Though I think I'm gonna go open a desert zoo and take a closer look at how much of a difference those coolers actually make when it comes to thirst needs...might be interesting, so thanks for bringing that up again!

My zoo is in Aus, so pretty much 30 - 45 all the time, coolers make a massive difference to thirst when it is hot.

My coolers.....

ShadowLilly · Dec 27, 2019

For me the need for drinks/food is also ruining the game. Even with coolers i need to place next to every 3 habitats a few food/drink stands, or they will complain about the long lines and demanding refunds... i hope this will get fixed because when you look at the zoos in the Netherlands, you see per so like 2 to 4 foodcourts, and that is more than enough. If there was a zoo with food/drink stands every 3/4 habitats, i wouldn't even go!