Star Citizen Discussion Thread v11

[Sanya V. Juutilainen]

Man, Katawa Shoujo is eight years old? I remember testing the alpha, what a blast it was...

Also needless to say, this list is far from complete - I can find few hundreds of visual novels for PC made in 2010/12 easily, some of them really good; and there are loads more of big and small games from those years. It's all Chris Roberts lies aimed at what gamers perceive, not at what is objectively true.

 

[StuartGT]

Somewhere around the year 2010 it was actually died out though, those years were the worst generation for pc gamers where all you could play were mostly mainstream console action oriented games.

Indie games didn't exist at that time because game engines weren't truly opened up for the masses, crowd funding and early access didn't exist yet.

Why do you think the propaganda existed in the first place and why it worked to some extent?

I disagree completely.

The propaganda only existed for people who don't actually play games.

Top PC releases per year:

2010:

• Mass Effect 2
• SarCraft 2
• WoW Cataclysm
• Civilization 5
• Battlefield Bad Company 2
• Bioshock 2
• Borderlands: Secret Armory Of General Knoxx
• Amnesia Dark Descent
• Super Meat Boy
• Fallout New Vegas
• Just Cause 2
• Football Manager 2011

2011:

• Portal 2
• Skyrim
• Minecraft
• Batman Arkham City
• Deus Ex Human Revolution
• Total War Shogun 2
• Battlefield 3
• Limbo
• Witcher 2
• Frozen Synapse
• Bastion
• Binding Of Isaac
• Trine 2
• Terraria
• Star Wars The Old Republic

2012:

• Dishonored
• Guild Wars 2
• The Walking Dead Telltale
• Borderlands 2
• Xcom Enemy Unknown
• Mass Effect 3
• Far Cry 3
• Torchlight 2
• Hotline Miami
• Tribes Ascend
• Planetside 2
• FTL
• Counter Strike GO
• Sins Of Solar Empire Rebellion

PC had great games released for it, just like the other platforms did

 

[n4p0l3on]

PC games published in 2010:

Spoiler

Darksiders
VVVVVV
Vancouver 2010
Secret Files 2: Puritas Cordis
Dark Void
Mass Effect 2
Global Agenda
Star Trek Online
S.T.A.L.K.E.R.: Call of Pripyat
The Sims 3: High-End Loft Stuff
BioShock 2
World of Outlaws: Sprint Cars
Stargate Resistance
Aliens vs. Predator
Arsenal of Democracy
Napoleon: Total War
M.U.D. TV
Silent Hunter V: Battle of the Atlantic
Battlefield: Bad Company 2
Supreme Commander 2
MLB 2K10
Rise of Prussia
Warhammer 40,000: Dawn of War II - Chaos Rising
Command & Conquer 4: Tiberian Twilight
Metro 2033
Dragon Age: Origins - Awakening
The Settlers 7: Paths to a Kingdom
Just Cause 2
Flotilla
Prison Break: The Conspiracy
Lead and Gold: Gangs of the Wild West
Dark Void Zero
Grand Theft Auto: Episodes from Liberty City
Sam & Max: The Devil's Playhouse Episode 1: The Penal Zone
Tom Clancy's Splinter Cell: Conviction
Biozone
Rocket Knight
Eschalon: Book II
Heroes of Newerth
Split Second: Velocity
Runaway: A Twist of Fate
Gray Matter
Blur
The Sims 3: Ambitions
Alpha Protocol
Vectorman
FIFA Online
Prince of Persia: The Forgotten Sands
Toy Story 3: The Video Game
Dream Chronicles: The Book of Air
APB All Points Bulletin
Singularity
Sniper: Ghost Warrior
Alien Swarm
Doctor Who: The Adventure Games - City of the Daleks
Need for Speed: World
StarCraft II: Wings of Liberty
Victoria 2
Elemental: War of Magic
Mafia II
Worms Reloaded
The Next Star 3
Amnesia: The Dark Descent
Recettear: An Item Shop's Tale
Civilization V
Darksiders
F1 2010
Lost Horizon
Lara Croft and the Guardian of Light
Dead Rising 2
FIFA 11
Front Mission Evolved
Final Fantasy XIV
World of Tanks
Pro Evolution Soccer 2011
NBA 2K11
ProtoGalaxy
Lost Planet 2
Arcania: Gothic 4
Medal of Honor
Vindictus
Shaun White Skateboarding
Dragon Age: Origins - Ultimate Edition
Backyard Sports: Rookie Rush
Lego Universe
The Sims 3: Late Night
Star Wars: The Force Unleashed II
Bloody Good Time
FIFA Manager 11
James Bond 007: Blood Stone
Bit.Trip Beat
Football Manager 2011
Tom Clancy's H.A.W.X 2
Apache: Air Assault
Alien Breed 3: Descent
Tangled: The Video Game
Super Meat Boy
Tron: Evolution
World of Warcraft: Cataclysm
Greed Corp
A.R.E.S.: Extinction Agenda
Revenge of the Titans
Oddboxx
Back to the Future: The Game

Doesn't seem like it was dying out to me.

PC games published in 2012. The year CR said he would save PC gaming

Spoiler

Katawa Shoujo
Q.U.B.E.
Dustforce
Sonic the Hedgehog 4: Episode I
Sonic the Hedgehog CD
Oil Rush
SOL: Exodus
Dead Block
King Arthur II: The Role-playing Wargame
Mortal Kombat: Arcade Kollection
PixelJunk Eden
The Darkness II
Gotham City Impostors
Kingdoms of Amalur: Reckoning
Shank 2
Jagged Alliance: Back in Action
Crusader Kings II
Dear Esther
Alan Wake
Syndicate
Wargame: European Escalation
Auditorium
Microsoft Flight
Deep Black: Reloaded
Vessel
Major League Baseball 2K12
Mass Effect 3
The Sims 3: Showtime
Stacking
Warp
RPG Maker VX Ace
Ys: The Oath in Felghana
Mutant Storm Reloaded
Angry Birds Space
Total War: Shogun 2 – Fall of the Samurai
Gettysburg: Armored Warfare
Ridge Racer Unbounded
Rayman Origins
Blacklight: Retribution
Confrontation
Shoot Many Robots
Naval War: Arctic Circle
Avernum: Escape from the Pit
Legend of Grimrock
Men of War: Condemned Heroes
Tribes: Ascend
SCP: Containment Breach
Superbrothers: Sword & Sworcery EP
Insanely Twisted Shadow Planet
Super Monday Night Combat
Blades of Time
Lone Survivor
UEFA Euro 2012
The Walking Dead: Episode 1 – A New Day
Binary Domain
Risen 2: Dark Waters
TERA
Sniper Elite V2
Nexuiz
Port Royale 3: Pirates & Merchants
Tomb of the Lost Queen
Street Fighter X Tekken
Diablo III
Game of Thrones
Sonic the Hedgehog 4: Episode II
Resident Evil: Operation Raccoon City
Alan Wake's American Nightmare
Dirt: Showdown
The Binding of Isaac: Wrath of the Lamb
Ys Origin
Mad Riders
Home
Max Payne 3
Long Live the Queen
Bang Bang Racing
Sins of a Solar Empire: Rebellion
Brave
Civilization V: Gods & Kings
Lego Batman 2: DC Super Heroes
Magicka: The Other Side of the Coin
Magic: The Gathering – Duels of the Planeswalkers 2013
Quantum Conundrum
Penny Arcade Adventures - Episode 3
London 2012
Spec Ops: The Line
Tom Clancy's Ghost Recon: Future Soldier
The Walking Dead: Episode 2 – Starved for Help
The Secret World
AFL Live: Game of the Year Edition
La-Mulana
Prototype 2
Inversion
Warsow
Orcs Must Die! 2
Babel Rising
Unmechanical
The Amazing Spider-Man
Iron Brigade
Darksiders II
Sleeping Dogs
Tales from Space: Mutant Blobs Attack
Counter-Strike: Global Offensive
The Expendables 2 Video game
Transformers: Fall of Cybertron
Dark Souls: Prepare to Die Edition
Guild Wars 2
The Walking Dead: Episode 3 – Long Road Ahead
Mutant Mudds
Snapshot
Cypher
The Sims 3: Supernatural
Trine 2: Goblin Menace
I Am Alive
Closure
Black Mesa
FTL: Faster Than Light
Borderlands 2
F1 2012
Tony Hawk's Pro Skater HD
Jet Set Radio HD
Torchlight II
FIFA 13
Pro Evolution Soccer 2013
The Testament of Sherlock Holmes
World of Warcraft: Mists of Pandaria
Castle Crashers
Ether Vapor Remaster
Half-Minute Hero
Carrier Command: Gaea Mission
NBA 2K13
War of the Roses
Hell Yeah! Wrath of the Dead Rabbit
Dishonored
XCOM: Enemy Unknown
The Walking Dead: Episode 4 – Around Every Corner
Of Orcs and Men
The Lord of the Rings Online: Riders of Rohan
Rocketbirds: Hardboiled Chicken
Chivalry: Medieval Warfare
Mark of the Ninja
Rocksmith
Fairy Bloom Freesia
Viking: Battle for Asgard
Euro Truck Simulator 2
A Game of Dwarves
Elemental: Fallen Enchantress
Giana Sisters: Twisted Dreams
Hotline Miami
Medal of Honor: Warfighter
Deadlight
The Fool and His Money
Guns of Icarus Online
Primal Carnage
Need for Speed: Most Wanted
Natural Selection 2
Painkiller: Hell & Damnation
Pid
007 Legends
Football Manager 2013
Postal 2: Complete
Angry Birds Star Wars
Cherry Tree High Comedy Club
Puddle
Sine Mora
Thomas Was Alone
Call of Duty: Black Ops II
F1 Race Stars
Lego The Lord of the Rings: The Video Game
Rift: Storm Legion
Little Inferno
Scribblenauts Unlimited
Sonic Adventure 2
Assassin's Creed III
Family Guy: Back to the Multiverse
Hitman: Absolution
PlanetSide 2
Scribblenauts Unlimited
The Walking Dead: Episode 5 - No Time Left
Super Hexagon
Baldur's Gate: Enhanced Edition
Miner Wars 2081
Stealth Deluxe
Eve Online: Retribution [4]
Far Cry 3
Test Drive: Ferrari Racing Legends
Nights into Dreams HD
Street Fighter X Mega Man
The War Z
Hatoful Boyfriend: Holiday Star

PC gaming never needed saving, but CR gave a stirring speech and said it convincingly so many people believed him. Like most things he says though, he just made it up in order to get money. That's the thing he is really good at.

Here we are eight years later, countless more PC games released and not one of them by CR

pretty horrific list of games compared to what's around today for pc IMO, no space sims (I thought X3 TC/AP were released around those two years), microsoft flight as the only notable flight sim was abysmal (pretty sure DCS A10C and Xplane 10 came out in 2011 though), lacking in strategy oriented games, lacking in isometric oriented games, lacking in cRPGs (isometric RPGs), lacking in vehicle/racing oriented games, etc just compare the list to what came out after SC/ED the golden age of crowdfunded games era and you should see.

another example, Firaxis XCOM was the only XCOM like game on that era, now after the success of Firaxis XCOM series we have way more games in the similar vein with Phoenix Point, Xenonauts series, Phantom Doctrine, the upcoming Terra Invicta.

my point is never about the CR claims for saving pc gaming, it's also not about that it "need saving" like CR claimed, however I can't deny how dreadful the era that was at the time when that propaganda came to be. And it was eventually "saved" or reinvigorated by the existence of cheap and easy to use game engines, and crowdfunding and early access platforms.

 

[Sanya V. Juutilainen]

pretty horrific list of games compared to what's around today for pc IMO, no space sims (I thought X3 TC/AP were released around those two years), microsoft flight as the only notable flight sim was abysmal (pretty sure DCS A10C and Xplane 10 came out in 2011 though), lacking in strategy oriented games, lacking in isometric oriented games, lacking in cRPGs (isometric RPGs), lacking in vehicle/racing oriented games, etc just compare the list to what came out after SC/ED the golden age of crowdfunded games era and you should see.

another example, Firaxis XCOM was the only XCOM like game on that era, now after the success of Firaxis XCOM series we have way more games in the similar vein with Phoenix Point, Xenonauts series, Phantom Doctrine, the upcoming Terra Invicta.

my point is never about the CR claims for saving pc gaming, it's also not about that it "need saving" like CR claimed, however I can't deny how dreadful the era that was at the time when that propaganda came to be. And it was eventually "saved" or reinvigorated by the existence of cheap and easy to use game engines, and crowdfunding and early access platforms.

First, the list is incomplete, very incomplete and these years had all the stuff you list. Maybe not so many, but that's also caused by gaming increasing as a whole, not because of Chris Roberts (like 2010 gaming was bigger than 2000 gaming, 2020 gaming is bigger than 2010 gaming).
Second, saying "this era sucks, because I don't like the games" just means that your vision is extremely limited. There is and was always lots to offer.

To counter your point - does today's game market (as a whole) suck if you are only into classic adventure games and text MUDs? Or is your disgruntlement caused by you being unable to come out from the shell of classic adventure games and text MUDs?

The era wasn't awful, it was literally the same as today regarding most aspects.

 

[StuartGT]

no space sims (I thought X3 TC/AP were released around those two years), microsoft flight as the only notable flight sim was abysmal (pretty sure DCS A10C and Xplane 10 came out in 2011 though), lacking in strategy oriented games, lacking in isometric oriented games, lacking in cRPGs (isometric RPGs), lacking in vehicle/racing oriented games, etc

Good lord, how wrong is this comment. Simply see my previous comment for a start:

Star Citizen Discussion Thread v11

Man, Katawa Shoujo is eight years old? I remember testing the alpha, what a blast it was... Also needless to say, this list is far from complete - I can find few hundreds of visual novels for PC made in 2010/12 easily, some of them really good; and there are loads more of big and small games...

forums.frontier.co.uk

 

[Navigare Necesse Est]

I disagree completely.

The propaganda only existed for people who don't actually play games.

Top PC releases per year:

2010:

• Mass Effect 2
• SarCraft 2
• WoW Cataclysm
• Civilization 5
• Battlefield Bad Company 2
• Bioshock 2
• Borderlands: Secret Armory Of General Knoxx
• Amnesia Dark Descent
• Super Meat Boy
• Fallout New Vegas
• Just Cause 2
• Football Manager 2011

2011:

• Portal 2
• Skyrim
• Minecraft
• Batman Arkham City
• Deus Ex Human Revolution
• Total War Shogun 2
• Battlefield 3
• Limbo
• Witcher 2
• Frozen Synapse
• Bastion
• Binding Of Isaac
• Trine 2
• Terraria
• Star Wars The Old Republic

2012:

• Dishonored
• Guild Wars 2
• The Walking Dead Telltale
• Borderlands 2
• Xcom Enemy Unknown
• Mass Effect 3
• Far Cry 3
• Torchlight 2
• Hotline Miami
• Tribes Ascend
• Planetside 2
• FTL
• Counter Strike GO
• Sins Of Solar Empire Rebellion

PC had great games released for it, just like the other platforms did

Good games. I took liberties to mark real ousttanding ones. Top tier games. Apart from Civ Mobile.

 

[n4p0l3on]

To counter your point - does today's game market (as a whole) suck if you are only into classic adventure games and text MUDs? Or is your disgruntlement caused by you being unable to come out from the shell of classic adventure games and text MUDs?

oh but there are many adventure games and text MUDs today compared to that age before... and that's exactly the point.

Good lord, how wrong is this comment. Simply see my previous comment for a start:

Star Citizen Discussion Thread v11

Man, Katawa Shoujo is eight years old? I remember testing the alpha, what a blast it was... Also needless to say, this list is far from complete - I can find few hundreds of visual novels for PC made in 2010/12 easily, some of them really good; and there are loads more of big and small games...

forums.frontier.co.uk

The era wasn't awful, it was literally the same as today regarding most aspects.

oh yeah? what's exactly wrong with it? the fact that today there are so many games on the genres that I mentioned before compared to the previous era proved my point, not yours, it clearly wasn't the same in that era as with today.

 

[StuartGT]

Good games. I took liberties to mark real ousttanding ones. Top tier games. Apart from Civ Mobile.

I think all the games I listed are outstanding

 

[Sanya V. Juutilainen]

oh but there are many adventure games and text MUDs today compared to that age before... and that's exactly the point.

So the people I see on gaming forums crying about how the modern gaming killed classic adventures and MUDs are wrong? Good, I'll refer them to you the next time, I am sure you will point them to the current masterpieces.

 

[n4p0l3on]

So the people I see on gaming forums crying about how the modern gaming killed classic adventures and MUDs are wrong? Good, I'll refer them to you the next time, I am sure you will point them to the current masterpieces.

Text-Based

Steam Store Hub

store.steampowered.com

dude...

you people who insist that gaming and especially pc gaming today isn't much better than in around 2010 clearly are the one who don't know what games are available today compared to that dreadful era.

 

[dayrth]

...you people who insist that gaming and especially pc gaming today isn't much better than in around 2010 clearly are the one who don't know what games are available today compared to that dreadful era.

That's not what was being discussed. Of course there are more games available today, because there are the ones released this year plus all the ones that came before. But the number and relative quality of games released this year is not much different to the number and relative quality of those release in 2010. I say relative quality because obviously technology has advanced and graphics, engines, processing power, memory availability etc are advancing all the time. Comparing a 2010 game to a 2020 game will always favour the 2020 game, but that doesn't mean that 2010 was a 'dreadful era' or that PC gaming was in need of saving.

 

[Mole HD]

I didn't care back in 2010 or even 2012...I was an Xbox gamer

I didn't come back to PC gaming until the end of 2015....it was Elite Dangerous that brought me back too, although I had played since Xbox GPP....that and a lack of flight sims on the Xbox.

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

dude...

you people who insist that gaming and especially pc gaming today isn't much better than in around 2010 clearly are the one who don't know what games are available today compared to that dreadful era.

You have to compare like with like........

lighting, resolution, detail levels are all better now.

but now many games are littered with loot boxes, micro transactions, unfinished titles which never come out of Early Access, and not to mention expansion passes which actively hold back finished content to sell as an extra.

Add to that the erosion of the story based campaign of many historically single player game and instead going all in on cut and paste multiplayer content....
Its not all bad, there are some great games out now, VR is a huge shining light for gaming, it is what i dreamed of when playing Virtuality games in the 1990s..... and even on a monitor there are some corkers.....

but I too have to say that for me over all the Quality to dross ratio of games these days is worse than a decade ago.

 

[StuartGT]

dude...

you people who insist that gaming and especially pc gaming today isn't much better than in around 2010 clearly are the one who don't know what games are available today compared to that dreadful era.

You're entitled to think that ~2010 was a dreadful era for gaming. You'd be comically wrong, but you do you

 

[Navigare Necesse Est]

I think all the games I listed are outstanding

I marked the ones that get extra gilded. Like when you just don't have enough time and need to select. Did you put Kerbal Space Program on? That is one gem, too.

 

[Navigare Necesse Est]

You have to compare like with like........

lighting, resolution, detail levels are all better now.

but now many games are littered with loot boxes, micro transactions, unfinished titles which never come out of Early Access, and not to mention expansion passes which actively hold back finished content to sell as an extra.

Add to that the erosion of the story based campaign of many historically single player game and instead going all in on cut and paste multiplayer content....
Its not all bad, there are some great games out now, VR is a huge shining light for gaming, it is what i dreamed of when playing Virtuality games in the 1990s..... and even on a monitor there are some corkers.....

but I too have to say that for me over all the Quality to dross ratio of games these days is worse than a decade ago.

Yes, there is all that. The hard part is finding the gems. And then someone might like Final Fantasy which I consider utter dross, but that's taste for you. Fact is, last decade has produced a number of titles worthy of Hall of Fame entries. I do think however, that indie games have been particularly good. Minecraft, FTL, Kerbal Space Program, Rimworld just to name a few.

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

Yes, there is all that. The hard part is finding the gems. And then someone might like Final Fantasy which I consider utter dross, but that's taste for you. Fact is, last decade has produced a number of titles worthy of Hall of Fame entries. I do think however, that indie games have been particularly good. Minecraft, FTL, Kerbal Space Program, Rimworld just to name a few.

This is very true...
Whilst imo the "AAA" industry is imploding up its own backside, the indie scene is actually in a really nice place.... The problem as you correctly state is digging out the gems from the crap.... something made harder due to how valve let anyone peddle any guff they please on their store.

Dare I say it but the Switch - a console I dont own - has a really good "duffers to gems" ratio. Like I said, I dont have one, BUT i have found some corkers by playing on my mates switch which, knowing what to look for I have picked up the games on PC.

Again tho, its mostly indie stuff..... the AAA franchises today are imo as often as not plagued with all sorts of problems not in the earlier games.

 

[Sanya V. Juutilainen]

Text-Based

Steam Store Hub

store.steampowered.com

dude...

you people who insist that gaming and especially pc gaming today isn't much better than in around 2010 clearly are the one who don't know what games are available today compared to that dreadful era.

I have never heard of any of that games, compared to MUD, Lost Souls or heck, even RuneScape, if we don't limit ourselves to text-only MUDs.
As well as going to https://store.steampowered.com/tags/en/Adventure/#p=0&tab=TopSellers doesn't really show you anything that is similar to, while being similarly successful, classic adventures like Secret of Monkey Island, King's Quest, Broken Sword or Indiana Jones and Last Crusade. There were recent tries, sure, but they are either unsuccessful or vastly different (the former even hard to find, the latter being stuff like Last of Us or Witness).

These two genres are basically dead and people who like them mostly run the old software. Does it mean gaming as a whole is dead? I don't think so.

 

[StuartGT]

https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/f6afpu

Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/f6afpu/gib_hype/

 

[Mole HD]