After to reveal what are your thoughts

[CMDR Karrde Sun]

I'm glad they're optional.
They're useless as they are.
They've created a new opportunity for gold sellers at least.
Id like universal cartographics.
Id like a dynamic mission board set by the player in the bubble and by logic limited to salvage out of the bubble (or new content).
To make the commodities market useful, npc's should be able to take the trades depending on if you're competitive in the bgs, and increase the commodities only capacity to practically infinite like stations. You would have to populate it all yourself though, no starter set.
Im done with dreaming about "what this game could be" because thats all we've ever done and will ever do up to the closing days of this era.
If i didn't sound jaded could this stuff be added in anyway?

I must admit that the prospect of FDs has seriously shattered my confidence in FDev. I am not gone yet, but the anticipation of the new era was yesterday. It seems that I have to adjust my relationship with the game, and that's a pretty bitter pill to swallow...

Its sad how you understand now. You were better than me only yesterday.

 

[[VR] Enexemander]

Before the reveal, I thought they probably weren't worth the money. Now I'm sure of it (at least for me!)

 

[myothershipisacobraiv]

It would appear proper pirate stations have arrived

In-lore me is happy.

But I also playerbase will probably make it miserable for playerbase somehow

still, proper pirate stations have arrived. I think that cosmetic livery options will debut to added effect

 

[photomankc]

My thought is, if everyone moaning about not getting one really doesn’t then it might be simpler to actually make money with one.

 

[Dommarraa]

First Thoughts:
Its clear where all the delay came from, lots of new things that probably were not worth the effort
New Outfitting UI - That better come into the main game as well or they really have wasted a vast amount of dev resource. Would be a real gun to the mouth move.
Selling Ships and Modules - A lot of work that seems utterly useless. Cant imagine many wanting to use these features, and nobody at all needing them. 99% CMDRs will find Transfer more than ample.
Market - Some niche group may be able to use it, but thats niche of niche. Cant see regular players using it to a level that pays its maintenance costs. A regaular market of chosen econimc type with really low Demand and Supply would have done the job without all the micro managing and dev resource. A lot of work that IMHO was a waste of time.

Pity there is:
No Cartographics - Kicks Explorers in the danglies. Little to no Dev Cost, with no exploit that I can see to omit it.
No Mission Board for local Factions - Kicks BGS in the danglies. . Little to no Dev Cost, with no exploit that I can see to omit it.
No way for visitors to deposit credits - FC are not all about profit, but ATM how is a Squad supposed to support the costs of their FC, a LTD Buy Order for 1Cr and a Sell Order for 5Mcr ?

Maint Costs are not bad. At 20Mcr per week you can dump enough for a whole years with a couple of hours of LTD mining.
Jump speeds seem fine as long as you accept that 500ly jumps dont mess with the size of the galaxy.

 

[Red Rocket]

First Thoughts:
Its clear where all the delay came from, lots of new things that probably were not worth the effort
New Outfitting UI - That better come into the main game as well or they really have wasted a vast amount of dev resource. Would be a real gun to the mouth move.
Selling Ships and Modules - A lot of work that seems utterly useless. Cant imagine many wanting to use these features, and nobody at all needing them. 99% CMDRs will find Transfer more than ample.
Market - Some niche group may be able to use it, but thats niche of niche. Cant see regular players using it to a level that pays its maintenance costs. A regaular market of chosen econimc type with really low Demand and Supply would have done the job without all the micro managing and dev resource. A lot of work that IMHO was a waste of time.

Pity there is:
No Cartographics - Kicks Explorers in the danglies. Little to no Dev Cost, with no exploit that I can see to omit it.
No Mission Board for local Factions - Kicks BGS in the danglies. . Little to no Dev Cost, with no exploit that I can see to omit it.
No way for visitors to deposit credits - FC are not all about profit, but ATM how is a Squad supposed to support the costs of their FC, a LTD Buy Order for 1Cr and a Sell Order for 5Mcr ?

Maint Costs are not bad. At 20Mcr per week you can dump enough for a whole years with a couple of hours of LTD mining.
Jump speeds seem fine as long as you accept that 500ly jumps dont mess with the size of the galaxy.

Dommarraa You make some good points I can't see buying or selling a Ship off a FC even if I took my FC to Beagle Point to sell ships you still have to store the old one.

With 50,000 plus stations in the bubble I just can't see how a FC can complete when you add a tariff.
No Cartographics makes it impossible for explores to pay for operating cost, I don't understand why they won't give us this option with only .5 % of the Galaxy mapped

 

[Cosmo]

Couple of things I don't like:

1. They should not charge Arx for all FC cosmetics. Make basic cosmetics free. People want superpower themed FCs such as Alliance, Empire, Federation and Independent.
2. The lack of PVE and PVP combat. There must be some PVE and PVP features for players who like combat with their FC (such as defend the FC against a wave of NPCs, Thargoids or a Squadron then collect rewards).
3. 1 hour cooldown when initiating a hyperjump, this should be instantaneous. Add a 1 or 2 hour cooldown after the jump.
4. NPC managers should also show how many staff they have each. Because it's not cool to only hire 1 manager per category.
5. Need options to sell cartographics data via the FC.
6. Never auto-decommission a FC after a certain time. Lots of people cannot play every week or month.
7. Need ability to store most of your personal ships on your FC.
8. Need better options to move the FC around within a star system.

 

[sgurr]

I general they're a really interesting concept, I'm really interested to see what players do with them. (even if I can't afford one myself).

They do need to give more thought about how carriers support exploration, because currently they don't.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

My thoughts are that, whether you like the other current space games or not, a couple of them have designed much more compelling Fleet Carrier style features.
I'll go play them if/when I want this feature.

If your talking about NMS, then I've seen nothing so far. Not interested in them in NMS, not really interested in them in ED either. At least in ED, the rest of the game is much better.

 

[Winterwalker]

They do need to give more thought about how carriers support exploration, because currently they don't.

This is a bit of a philosphical question isn't it? Should carriers support exploration or need support, in order to explore? I don't have a massive issue with it being the latter, which is actually why 'd be more inclined to boost Codex Dividends (new geological site discovered, no new traits) than allow cartographics, which OP payouts make upkeep 100% trivial.

 

[JosiahD]

Firstly I'd like to express my appreciation to Frontier for the effort they've put in. There's clearly a lot of work that's been put into Fleet Carriers, likely with one eye on the coming next era update to boot. And the team are clearly enthusiastic to present what they've made. I applaud that.

BUT... I can't help feeling flat about what was revealed when I look back on the original Gamescom reveal. From the Gamescom reveal we had the potential for carriers that would be tailored to a role, with a choice that we would have to make which might have consequences as maybe it wouldn't be a one size fits all approach. I get why they've changed approach to let us tailor our carrier to our purposes, but after what we've seen today I just can't help feeling that all they've produced is yet another feature that will end up being underutilised because it will be too niche and only a fraction of the playerbase will utilise them. Now, I don't mean that to say that they should be freely available to all casual players as well, but the approach does seem to have in turn discouraged a lot of players who otherwise might have been interested.

It's times like these I really feel for the Devs though. All the effort put in, all the enthusiasm only to present what is proposed and then get a lot of us simply say....meh. I hope the beta process reveals more and changes the perspective some of us have today, and maybe a few things will change in the process. And while I know the credits aren't hard to acquire, to pay the initial 5bill purchase price, then the additional cost for upgrades, then the 10mill per week (substantially more presumably if the carrier is upgraded) just to sustain the beast and I just can't help but wonder why I would bother..... Yes, I know the answer to that is 'well don't buy one', but that's such a loss of potential when I look back on the Gamescom reveal though....

 

[Hamakua]

I stopped playing a couple months ago but am still trying to get that pill down my throat.
It's realy sad, I truly loved this game, ugh!

The more I mull over the problems with the FC's the more I'm feeling the "return to hibernation". Just came back after 2 years because of the FC announcement.
My goals on the board. Get ~16Bn liquid (I want an engineered A rated mamba - they look sexy as all hell).
Have 15Bn liquid as a personal goal so I know it wasn't credits holding me back from buying an FC.
Don't buy an FC because as it stands now it's a set of contradictory ideas, none of which actually fit into how Elite is played today. (once again, a result of Devs actually not playing the game they develop for).
Go back into another 2 year hibernation and wait for the next "FC" type happening to earn another 5-10BN as a goal.
Almost forgot, grind out a guardian FSD booster before going back to sleep. I'm sure that will take like 3 days, tops.

 

[Shaele]

The only new mechanics carriers offer is module and cargo storage, and bulk bubble taxi - and the bubble taxi is debatable.

For that you have to pay 5B up front, plus ongoing costs with a risk of losing the ship if you take a break.

For all other gameplay they offer nothing that wasnt ingame easier, faster and cheaper.

• Commodities market: Why would you sell at a carrier with tariffs? why would a carrier owner buy from players who want the most profit?
• Mining: again, why would you sell at a carrier with tariffs and less profit? why would a carrier buy for top dollar?
• Outfitting: tariffs, limited stock and no discounts
• Repairs / Rearm: at most a quick jump away when in the bubble, if not in the bubble then you dont need it or can synth it
• Bubble taxi: Fly to destination in way under an hour, get your fleet shipped, profit in time and money. if its over 500ly distance save even more.
• Exploration: No selling of data, still have to fly all the way back to human space except now you drag along a 5B paperweight that may or may not run out of fuel.
• BGS: Carrier commodities market will not impact BGS, so no BGS hacking
• Bonds and bounties: already ingame at pretty much every station and most without paying tariffs

Want a bulk taxi to Colonia for other players? Then their ships will be locked into your carrier for 80 hours. Beagle point? 240 hours. Those numbers are before having to stop and refuel - good luck with that in the middle of nowhere.

One of the most pointless screens was the "Set current activity" for the carrier. I'm guessing its a hold over from when carriers were going to have NPC ships with them but now? Its flavor text at best. It will make no difference what you set there to any features of the ship.

As for explorers, FDevs only suggestion was to set up a trading post??? trade with who exactly and for what reason?

This is what has been delayed for over 18 months? that galnet was paused for? that all CG's and new content was put on hold for?
Carriers are simply an excuse to add a punishment mechanism for players who buy one and then take a break, and to sell more cosmetics.

I am honestly embarrassed for Fdev that they think this is content worth waiting for.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

Couple of things I don't like:

They should not charge Arx for all FC cosmetics. Make basic cosmetics free. People want superpower themed FCs such as Alliance, Empire, Federation and Independent.

There maybe some free ones.

The lack of PVE and PVP combat. There must be some PVE and PVP features for players who like combat with their FC (such as defend the FC against a wave of NPCs, Thargoids or a Squadron then collect rewards).

I can't see that being achievable with the way the game works.

1 hour cooldown when initiating a hyperjump, this should be instantaneous. Add a 1 or 2 hour cooldown after the jump.

I think it's fine as is. Gives you time to cancel it, gives you time to make sure you have everything, gives time to make sure your ships on on board.

NPC managers should also show how many staff they have each. Because it's not cool to only hire 1 manager per category.

Not fussed, but I would like a bit more NPC management. Make that a bit deeper.

Need options to sell cartographics data via the FC.

Not needed.

Never auto-decommission a FC after a certain time. Lots of people cannot play every week or month.

Then don't get one.

Need ability to store most of your personal ships on your FC.

It does.

Need better options to move the FC around within a star system.

Like what?

 

[Hamakua]

I think it's fine as is. Gives you time to cancel it, gives you time to make sure you have everything, gives time to make sure your ships on on board.

A major problem I see with a 1 hour wind up is "what do I do in that hour?"
You can't really do anything but wait if you are going along with the ship, so you dock your ship and log out, no? You don't want to not dock and miss the trip (although 500LY isn't that big of a deal). You also don't want to cancel the jump because I suspect that resets the CD.

Better to have 10/15minute wind up and a 2hr CD on the other end than a 1/1. The front end wind up encourages "log out and do something else" play.
Just a CD on the back end means you can be 5minutes late and you only lose 5 minutes on the jump. For 2 hours you can quickly scout an ice ring and do some spontaneous mining inbetween jumps - theoretically. People can do stuff.

1/1 make it in a constant state of "uhhh, lets not do anything.

Although the stich point of the 1/1 can act like a 2hr CD - but then why not just make it a 2hr CD then?

1Hr windup seems excessive and I can see players just docking their main ship, setting the jump, then logging off. It's fiddly.

 

[kilvenny]

The fundamental problem with the carrier is that it is not capable of being profitable, secondly it offers nothing to none owning CMDRS. The good news is I think it's fixable.

1) Enable players to buy in bulk at a discount from a market for ships, modules and commodities, then they can undercut the main markets, making them attractive to players.
2) Add manufacturing/conversion capability to transform multiple commodities/materials into end item commodities that can then be sold into the npc stations. I think this will come with base building.

 

[Shaele]

think how streamers will show off carriers... click the jump button and twiddle their thumbs for an hour? or "heres a jump I prepared earlier" LUL

 

[Deareim]

Decent BGS potential for pmfs who become hostile to a minor faction maybe?

good potential for piracy smuggling

powerplay potential is limited by powerplay’s own issues.

Because commodities aren’t used to craft anything, like ships or modules, and can’t be produced like agriculture products to offset maintenance costs, the commodities market, outfitting and shipyard seem underwhelming.

no universal cartographics is bad as the asp instagram fans are testifying currently.

thargoid fob maybe?

no BGS impact.

 

[Winterwalker]

1) Enable players to buy in bulk at a discount from a market for ships, modules and commodities, then they can undercut the main markets, making them attractive to players.

You'd be able to do this I think by putting a higher demand on your commodity than offered by the local station. Demand affects/manipulates price paid as per recent mining reveals. Trading off carrier with somewhere where the demand is higher = profit.

2) Add manufacturing/conversion capability to transform multiple commodities/materials into end item commodities that can then be sold into the npc stations. I think this will come with base building.

Interesting.

 

[xaisis]

My thoughts: based on my own playstyle and what i enjoy in other games.

Upkeep while offline. = major design failure.
No NPC interaction. = major design failure.


fundamental design failure.
It behaves as a station.
I cant fly it.
No helm view.
It cant be used as a carrier:

• it cant: Enter a battle, order NPCs to lift off and engage.
• it cant: Enter an astroidfield, order NPCs to lift off and start mining, order a small NPC wing to do security patrol.
• it cant: Enter into a station zone, order NPCs to start moving cargo.
• it cant: Enter into an unknown system, order scouts to start exploring nearby systems while carrier does mining operations etc, maybe long distance exploration scanning.

But that is just my view of things.