And as you seem so passionate about PP my suggestion might not be for you, but it wouldn't be the first time the game changes for the better, as you've indicated yourself PP is broken.
Tired of the Open vs. Private Debacle
- Thread starter Hans_Oktane
- Start date
E|D already has open. E|D already has PP. Problem solved.
I've come late to the discussion of night vision but I'll just note that IMO it was never meant to be a combat feature. I think the need for it came about because of Guardian sites. Before night vision it was a matter of luck whether you found the site in daylight when you turned up, or in impenetrable darkness. It wasn't fun in the dark!
As for PP modules, I agree with the suggestions that PP might be made into a good Open feature and the modules could be unlocked in some other way. Since they're all combat modules and I don't do much combat I haven't been very interested in them so far, although I wouldn't mind a chance to try out packhound missiles; they look like fun.
As for PP modules, I agree with the suggestions that PP might be made into a good Open feature and the modules could be unlocked in some other way. Since they're all combat modules and I don't do much combat I haven't been very interested in them so far, although I wouldn't mind a chance to try out packhound missiles; they look like fun.
Hehe... They are (some PvP afficiondos hate them, which is fine...) I have 5 High Capacity Packs on my Beluga... 3 rapid volleys and both the ship and GPU fries... Awesome!
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
Packhounds, you say....Hehe... They are (some PvP afficiondos hate them, which is fine...) I have 5 High Capacity Packs on my Beluga... 3 rapid volleys and both the ship and GPU fries... Awesome!
I may need to acquire some of those.
They are hilarious, honestly! They don't really do much damage unless the target has no shields, but once the shields are down can remove external 'modules' quite efficiently.
And if the Powerplay proponents had their way, youd be able to unlock Packhounds from a techbroker or suchlike. So no arbitrary weeks of waiting, while pledged to a Power you may have no interest in supporting. That is something even you Robert, would be getting out of Rubbernuke's (& Sandro's) Powerplay proposals.
You dont want to engage with the feature? There'd be absolutely no need or reason to pledge, & nothing to get out of it apart from the team gameplay itself.
We've seen over the last few years how twisting people's arms behind their backs to join Powerplay for PP modules, only creates resentment and confusion for the game feature itself. People can't see the wood, for the trees.
Also essentially removing the need for PvE players to have to join PP in order to get modules they want to use in PvE, while making PP a PvP component that gives actual meaning to PvP instead of the current system where PvP is just about making someone miserable by blowing them up for no good reason.
I like this. PP could be expanded to actually matter, in some form or fashion, and would finally give FDev a tool with which to make this Sandbox a proper sandbox.
And like oil and water, modes and Powerplay don't currently mix. Some players want more PvP focussed gameplay, why not give it to them? And, at the same time give proper, focussed Solo gameplay too?
oooookay.
You mean people play Powerplay for the....gulps down vomit fun of it?
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
Arguably ungating Powerplay modules is a proposal that stands by itself - as unlocking more than one of them requires defection from a Power.
I was surprised that Powerplay specific modules and weapons were able to be kept on defection (even more so that they get replaced on insurance when a ship is destroyed even when the player had left the Power).
Ya know, in some ways this thread kind of makes me sad. I'm a solo/PG PvE player. I don't PvP, I don't play in Open. Maybe one day, but not now. Despite that, and despite some of the suggestions being hot garbage (removing Solo/PG... come on now), I have also seen some really amazing suggestions coming out of the pro PvP side that I think would actually have at least a neutral impact on my gameplay, but in some cases a positive impact, while increasing the viability of their gameplay style immensely. I see 2 benefits to that: A) It would bring in new players who like that gameplay style B) It might entice me to try it one day.
But so far, the majority of the responses that I see to any of these suggestions usually comes down to "FDev has always done it x way, and so that's way FDev will always do it as they've shown no interest in changing their mind on this". If you've ever worked in a corporate environment and seen how insanely averse to change that management folks can be, you likely can hear the loud rings of truth in those statements.
I hate seeing so many good suggestions and knowing it'll never happen because an aversion to change, even positive change or simply change that doesn't affect you, is the most likely stance to win.
I may not like y'alls playstyle, or agree with most of you in your desire to drag me kicking and screaming into open to die for no reason, but I just want to let you know from the other side that some of your suggestions are really great, and I really do think the game would be better for trying em. For all the good that does ya lol.
But so far, the majority of the responses that I see to any of these suggestions usually comes down to "FDev has always done it x way, and so that's way FDev will always do it as they've shown no interest in changing their mind on this". If you've ever worked in a corporate environment and seen how insanely averse to change that management folks can be, you likely can hear the loud rings of truth in those statements.
I hate seeing so many good suggestions and knowing it'll never happen because an aversion to change, even positive change or simply change that doesn't affect you, is the most likely stance to win.
I may not like y'alls playstyle, or agree with most of you in your desire to drag me kicking and screaming into open to die for no reason, but I just want to let you know from the other side that some of your suggestions are really great, and I really do think the game would be better for trying em. For all the good that does ya lol.
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
Whether the proposals constitute an improvement to the features and depth of the game is subjective. The proponents of change are as guilty of saying "but what about PvPeeeeeeeee".
.... can be read as "lets 'improve' Powerplay (for a subset of the player-base) by removing merit movement in Solo and Private Groups".
It may also "encourage" disgruntled Solo and Private Group players to engage in disruptive behaviour in Open - as I don't expect that there'll be any way to decide which players in Open are permitted to move cargo - or lose it deliberately....
I see it for what it is - an attempt to gate bits of the game to Open. YMMV.
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Make PevePelite Gank Again! 
On a serious note, it would be awesome if PP was updated into something that made it more co-play, PvE, and PvP all simultaneous, and even made Open more interesting on all levels. I've supported Open Only PP in the past, but if a all-modes solution that still make Open a more interesting mode, it'd be great. I want Elite to continue to evolve and grow in player base, because it's still on the top 5 for me. So much that could be done.
On a serious note, it would be awesome if PP was updated into something that made it more co-play, PvE, and PvP all simultaneous, and even made Open more interesting on all levels. I've supported Open Only PP in the past, but if a all-modes solution that still make Open a more interesting mode, it'd be great. I want Elite to continue to evolve and grow in player base, because it's still on the top 5 for me. So much that could be done.
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What value does movement of merits in solo pg provide to pp, a direct competitive feature, with designs around bottlenecking players into the same systems and live updates around activity?
The idea is designed to relegate bits of the game, a specific aspect of pp in this case, to open. Why? Because the design of the feature would be better served if it were entirely in open because it's a directly competitive mode, but as a compromise, you're seeing the suggestion to apply single aspect.
We all get it. You think open should not provide additional advantage under any circumstance. And any change to that, you oppose. Cool, your position is noted. The change is still necessary to make the feature of pp actually more than just a convoluted module store. Repeating the sentence I've seen you type at least 50 times is working from the premise that everything in the game is working to its best potential, which is demonstrably false.
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
The fact that Powerplay is implemented in all three game modes puts paid to the contention that it's "a direct competitive feature" - while direct Powerplay competition is optional (i.e. playing in Open), Powerplay is asynchronous and indirect from Solo and Private Groups.
The Solo/PG aspect is a sop - as any Open player can also engage in them.
Every player has an idea as to the potential of this game. Some have opined that it could be a subset of EvE, with cockpits! Some don't want anything EvE-like.
Like others, I eagerly await Frontier's determination on which of the subset of the Powerplay Flash Topic proposals may be implemented.
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Ok I am a casual player, with only a hadnful of ships, it took me half a decade to get them , fit them for a particular role, engineer them and a cowboy comes and asks for my cargo (which I don't have any cause I don't do cargo runs any more - see I am Elite in trading) so now with your last proposal he can ask for money, which took me half a decade to get to a billion and they can get any amount they ask for or/and blow my ship to pieces with their super armed & maxed combat-engineered ship (cause remember they don't have to hold any cargo - they ask for money only) and I loose everything and they risk nothing cause my ships are unarmed basically since I don't do combat since I suck in combat since I don't like it. So basically you suggest players like me to be the butter on their bread. NO SIR THANK YOU VERY MUCH...
Also the title of your thread contradicts the content of your OP. I'll give you and advice. Read your post before posting..
As for your middle proposal that has some point, it has been extensively discussed in the past so no need to decompose it any further.
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I think it mixes fine. I've regularly suggested ways to integrate PvP into the BGS and PP. The ideas are rejected simply because it doesn't force people into open nor PvP. I have every sympathy, but it wears thin with all the misrepresentations and tantrums taken by the open Only Crowd. The game and the players owe nothing to PvP. If you're into it, you know where to find it. As far as I'm concerned, problem solved.
Such shining reasonability, so encouraging of well intentioned discussion. My God they need to promote you to CM, you beacon of positivity