News Community Update (01/05)

Some of those are legitimate criticisms and it sounds like Sean really did massively oversell the game at the start, but a lot of them have now been fixed. I believe whoever posted that that they were broken on release, at the time, but I played through the game recently (around 60-100 hours a few weeks ago) when I got bored of Elite after trying to come back and a lot of things that post complains about are just not true anymore.

It's a massive post so I can't respond to all of it, but planets do have significantly different elements and resources, you can play multiplayer with people, portals work, ship classes do matter in very significant ways and more ones have been added, Sentinels are hard to kill, you can live just fine going station to station if that's what you want to do (that would be... very boring, but the mechanics to do so are all there, I did it myself to grind for credits), animals do respond to things in reasonably realistic ways (e.g. being scared off by close gunfire, defending each other, attacking and eating each other), there are crashed freighters, you can scan ships, there's a lot more than two weapons, traders will land on your freighter etc etc. There's also stuff that post didn't mention like planetary Exocraft and mechsuits (much, much better than SRVs), underwater environments and play (not my cup of tea but it's there and fully featured), and biological living ships. NMS still has issues but if someone is interested in the basic premise of a survival planetary exploration/space game I would recommend the game, especially when it's on sale. Story is crap imo but the rest of the game is better. I think it can provide a good 80 hours of fun reliably, more if you get into the "endgame" of ship hunting, taking photos of very unusual fauna, and designing and building large farms and industrial facilities (that's a big "if": I'd consider it a bit more "makework" than Elite's "endgame". Yes I abuse "quotes".)

I actually find it really fascinating, the difference between Elite: Dangerous, Star Citizen, and No Man's Sky. They're all from the same rough era, they were all billed as a fundamentally similar experience (a space game where you can do "so many activities!", walk around, fight, explore etc), and they've all approached that goal in very different ways. Elite decided to pick one small part of the original promise and do it incredibly well, and it's a very polished game as a result (with, of course, many resulting limits on scope so far). Their plan for achieving the whole roadmap is to roll out new sections of it when they're ready and at a high quality (despite what internet denizens may claim, compared to their competitors Frontier rolls out high quality updates). Star Citizen raised a lot more money and decided to do literally the entire promise plus everything else they could think of all at once (I'd say immediately but that would be hilariously misleading). Predictably to anyone familiar with software development this resulted in gridlock and has yet to result in anything like an actual game, rather than just a big, pretty, choppy tech demo. No Man's Sky seems to have done sort of a compromise, where it delivered the absolute bare minimum of all of the promise (people say Elite is a mile wide and an inch deep, I imagine NMS was much worse at launch), and then fill in bits and pieces closer to completion as time goes on. This strategy seems to have resulted in by far the most fan anger at launch and a huge rejection of the game, but at this stage in the lifecycle they've almost completely won over their fanbase again (or a new fanbase, it's not clear) by consistently delivering improvements and content to get the game closer to its promise for free. As a result they seem to have the most tolerant fans now because people can see that things have gotten much better and are continuing to get much better.

I don't know which model is going to "win". SC is the best funded I think, and they seem to be noticeably making... well, any progress at all, now. NMS has momentum and a very happy fanbase now which Hello Games have turned into an asset. Elite was always a relatively contained, complete game (if a niche one as a space simulator), and if Next Era does deliver significant space legs/FPS gameplay and it's attractive Elite could become a much less niche game. I'm rooting for Elite, because while I think NMS is decent now and deserves to live up to its promise (and I LOVE their funding model), I just don't really like the aesthetic or story. SC is morally trash (charging people thousands of dollars for a microtransaction on an unreleased game is a scam regardless of any other complaints about them or whatever their plans are), so I hope they fail, go bankrupt, and their corpse is picked over for cool technology that then makes its way into decent space games that either don't have microtransactions (NMS) or at least only have cosmetic ones (Elite).
 
Well, not exactly no. In one case people actually paid for the content in pre-sales and during release based on actual statements by the developer about what the game would contain in that specific original release. On the other case the statements about that content you mentioned were clearly caveated as part of future releases and to be paid separately (except minority of LEPers) only when released at a non determined point in the future, and subject to the company views on its viability.

Yeah, but the point here was that those "promises" boosted the initial sale numbers and I think the same applies to Elite.
 

Viajero

Volunteer Moderator
Yeah, but the point here was that those "promises" boosted the initial sale numbers and I think the same applies to Elite.

Be that as it may. There is a very clear difference between 1)selling something, people paying money for it and then not delivering it; and 2) not paying for something until it is actually released. In the case of Elite what you saw is what you got (alphas, betas and gammas, almost a year of it during 2013-2014). People buying into the base game knew full well space legs and atmos would be eventually paid for separately and at a later date.
 
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Oh, also: My whole recent NMS experience started when I tried to get back into Elite because I was interested in Fleet Carriers, but when I saw how much I would have to grind to get them I was a bit disheartened. I thought about saying something, but the subreddit and the forums were chock full of people baying for Frontier's blood over a free update and I didn't want to contribute to that sort of entitled histrionics. So I just went and played NMS for a couple of weeks. It was actually really fun, I got a cool fleet carrier (freighter in NMS, they're much better than Elite implementation), set up some farms, got some good ships and a living ship... and then I realised that everything I wanted No Man's Sky to have to be better, Elite already had. I wanted a better flight model, better graphics, better sound, a greater feeling of presence, better combat, and missions that were more grounded. Playing No Man's Sky led me to realise that there were so many things about Elite that I loved but I didn't appreciate, and that what I wanted to do with my time was enjoy them, not worry about grinding credits for a fleet carrier. It was actually really freeing. Now I'm mining in Borann sometimes (actually talking to people when I do!), doing missions for the Federation other times, working on bringing my racing iCourier back up to snuff and flying it around just for the thrill of it, and playing CQC (and enjoying it! When I can find a game. Please let CQC earn ARX.) I'm having the time of my life in Elite and all I needed to achieve it was getting up close and personal with that other grass to see if it was really greener.
 
I’m not a fan of the game, but I own it. You clearly have no idea of its progression over the last few years.

As for Sean during the development of NMS, mistakes happen. It’s how you rise up from them that reveals your character. Sean has shown strong character, learned from his mistake, and came back in a way no one would have ever expected. FDev have done... well, I guess they’ve fostered this divided community.
I have about 300 hours in NMS, liked the Vulkan update pre-Beyond, but despite 'improving' the game (VR started as a stuttering mess and improved to equal the PSVR resolution!) issues enough have accompanied each patch to have the 'community' almost as toxic as this one.
The recent Living Ships addition obviously was 'inspired' for the 'grind' required to get it... (without exploits)
But true, from its release the game has been turned around and offers its users something 'different' :)
 
I thought it was quite funny that when the covid thing hit, SC immediately announced a delay and there have been a large amount of features cut from latest build. Meanwhile in FDev, the fleet carriers and their betas have come out on time and they've announced a 90 day delay to new era after quite a while of trying home working. Knowing how difficult it is to 'Dev' from home at the moment, I think a 90 day delay is quite reasonable.
 
... but planets do have significantly different elements and resources, you can play multiplayer with people, portals work, ship classes do matter in very significant ways and more ones have been added, Sentinels are hard to kill, you can live just fine going station to station if that's what you want to do (that would be... very boring, but the mechanics to do so are all there, I did it myself to grind for credits), animals do respond to things in reasonably realistic ways (e.g. being scared off by close gunfire, defending each other, attacking and eating each other), there are crashed freighters, you can scan ships, there's a lot more than two weapons, traders will land on your freighter etc etc. There's also stuff that post didn't mention like planetary Exocraft and mechsuits (much, much better than SRVs), underwater environments and play (not my cup of tea but it's there and fully featured), and biological living ships.


I would recommend the game, especially when it's on sale. Story is crap imo but the rest of the game is better....
...
I've 'cherry picked' your comments...
Despite my own opinion of recent changes to NMS being 'interesting', the points you have made are the same things that have had me spend around 300 hours playing NMS - there is plenty to do and their PG can produce some fascinating combinations.

I'm not best impressed with NMS & VR, or with some of their LoD losses, but would still suggest it is worth playing, as long as the player doesn't expect another ED, it has to stand on its own unique merits :)
 
Has the phrase 'the Next Era release date will move slightly from December 2020 to early 2021' been qualified by Frontier to 90 days somewhere?

No, but I think that its reasonable to expect that when they mention a delay into Q1 2021 that they'll be ready by 31st of March in 2021.It will be nice if it will be ready in January but when you take into account the Christmas break, the end of March is probably more likely. There might be a Beta in December or January.
 
Has the phrase 'the Next Era release date will move slightly from December 2020 to early 2021' been qualified by Frontier to 90 days somewhere?
Not that I've read, but the moment it was announced the usual cry of "Q2 more likely" was heard...
I'd have thought that they would be aiming for a minimal delay, assuming the PS5 is on time, in order to catch the interested parties from that launch, but I know nothing...
 
Q1 is just community's wishful thinking, the phrasing is "early 2021" :p
Spot on:
However, during this uncertain period, we've also had to re-examine our longer term roadmap and make some adjustments. To ensure that we can bring you an incredible new Elite Dangerous experience without compromising the team who work at Frontier, the Next Era release date will move slightly from December 2020 to early 2021.

Depends on one's interpretation or "early" doesn't it? At what point does "early" become "late"?

Of course, "slightly" could be interpreted to 5 months, if one stretches the string a little :)
 
Honestly, all this speculation is baseless, who knows what the next nine months will present us with in terms of new challenges and situations? It won't be released in 2020, and I doubt even FD can confidently say that they will release 'slightly later' in 'early 2021' no matter what. Weird times ahead, so certainty is OOO.
 
Has the phrase 'the Next Era release date will move slightly from December 2020 to early 2021' been qualified by Frontier to 90 days somewhere?
To Q1 it has
From the RNS posting earlier today:

We had originally planned for the Elite Dangerous major update to release in December 2020, but, in the context of the current Covid-19 environment, we have now set a Q1 2021 release date.​
Thanks for the news Will, and best wishes & safety to all the team :)
 
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