Star Citizen Discussion Thread v11

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Agony_Aunt

Agony_Aunt
Factabulous said:
It's classic good management technique - what do you do if you have 3 late, unfinished products? You add 2 new platforms and a new render/control set. What could go wrong? šŸ¤”
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Nothing. I mean, its not like they actually have to deliver on any of that. They just need to say they are doing it and people will throw money at them.

Jeez... i sometimes i wish i was totally unscrupulous. I'd be a billionaire by now.
 

Tippis

Tippis
Merkir said:
Unfortunately, no. They are pledges.
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Unfortunately, no. A ā€œpledgeā€ is what you hand in to the pawn store in exchange for money.

Unless CIĀ¬G is giving you money, what you're handing them is not a pledge. Obviously, the money goes in the other direction, so a ā€pledgeā€ in this transaction would have to be the collateral that CIĀ¬G is handing you for the money you're lending them, and at some point, the money will be returned (with interest) in exchange for CIĀ¬G getting their pledge back. A pledge is not subject to VAT, but to interest rates, same as with all money lending and as such, it would not increase the amount of money you give to CIĀ¬G but the amount they are required to pay back to you in order to have the pledge returned to their possession. If this pledge transaction sounds nothing like what is happening in CIĀ¬G's virtual goods store, then that means what we're dealing with here is not a pledge but a bog-standard purchase.

A ā€œpledgeā€ where you end up giving both the money and the pledge is an instance where the pledge as such does not actually have anything to do with the money transaction, but with the promise of a transaction, should some conditions apply. That's why you pledge during the kickstarter: you're promising that, if the campaign succeeds, you will chip in a certain amount. That promise is the pledge, not the cash itself. Handing over the cash is not a pledge, it's the fulfilment of one. Handing over cash in exchange for a virtual good, even if delivery is estimated some time in the future, is once again just a bog-standard purchase.
 
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[VR] Merkir

[VR] Merkir
Tippis said:
Unfortunately, no. A ā€œpledgeā€ is what you hand in to the pawn store in exchange for money.

Unless CIĀ¬G is giving you money, what you're handing them is not a pledge. Obviously, the money goes in the other direction, so a ā€pledgeā€ in this transaction would have to be the collateral that CIĀ¬G is handing you for the money you're lending them, and at some point, the money will be returned (with interest) in exchange for CIĀ¬G getting their pledge back. A pledge is not subject to VAT, but to interest rates, same as with all money lending and as such, it would not increase the amount of money you give to CIĀ¬G but the amount they are required to pay back to you in order to have the pledge returned to their possession. If this pledge transaction sounds nothing like what is happening in CIĀ¬G's virtual goods store, then that means what we're dealing with here is not a pledge but a bog-standard purchase.

A ā€œpledgeā€ where you end up giving both the money and the pledge is an instance where the pledge as such does not actually have anything to do with the money transaction, but with the promise of a transaction, should some conditions apply. That's why you pledge during the kickstarter: you're promising that, if the campaign succeeds, you will chip in a certain amount. That promise is the pledge, not the cash itself. Handing over the cash is not a pledge, it's the fulfilment of one. Handing over cash in exchange for a virtual good, even if delivery is estimated some time in the future, then that's just a bog-standard purchase.
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Exactly, which is why my answer was, I thought, portraying just the right amount of sarcasm, with a link to what they call their RSI PLEDGE STORE, its URL also highlighting "pledge".

Somebody had better tell CIG to change all their nomenclature. Good luck... somebody. :)
 

Navigare Necesse Est

Navigare Necesse Est
Tippis said:
Unfortunately, no. A ā€œpledgeā€ is what you hand in to the pawn store in exchange for money.

Unless CIĀ¬G is giving you money, what you're handing them is not a pledge. Obviously, the money goes in the other direction, so a ā€pledgeā€ in this transaction would have to be the collateral that CIĀ¬G is handing you for the money you're lending them, and at some point, the money will be returned (with interest) in exchange for CIĀ¬G getting their pledge back. A pledge is not subject to VAT, but to interest rates, same as with all money lending and as such, it would not increase the amount of money you give to CIĀ¬G but the amount they are required to pay back to you in order to have the pledge returned to their possession. If this pledge transaction sounds nothing like what is happening in CIĀ¬G's virtual goods store, then that means what we're dealing with here is not a pledge but a bog-standard purchase.

A ā€œpledgeā€ where you end up giving both the money and the pledge is an instance where the pledge as such does not actually have anything to do with the money transaction, but with the promise of a transaction, should some conditions apply. That's why you pledge during the kickstarter: you're promising that, if the campaign succeeds, you will chip in a certain amount. That promise is the pledge, not the cash itself. Handing over the cash is not a pledge, it's the fulfilment of one. Handing over cash in exchange for a virtual good, even if delivery is estimated some time in the future, is once again just a bog-standard purchase.
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Faith is restored - people still know what the words mean
 

Agony_Aunt

Agony_Aunt

amigacooke

amigacooke
Tippis said:
That's why you pledge during the kickstarter: you're promising that, if the campaign succeeds, you will chip in a certain amount.
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It's a while since I've supported a KickStarter, but my recollection is that you donate your money, whether or not the project succeeds is immaterial.

A drone project that I backed went bust, and KickStarter backers weren't even listed as creditors.
 
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StuartGT

StuartGT
Tippis said:
That's why you pledge during the kickstarter: you're promising that, if the campaign succeeds, you will chip in a certain amount.
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amigacooke said:
It's a while since I've supported a KickStarter, but my recollection is that you donate your money, whether or not the project succeeds is immaterial.

A drone project that I backed, went bust and KickStarter backers weren't even listed as creditors.
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Tippis didn't say "project", they said "campaign" as in the 30-60 day Kickstarter fund-raising campaign.

When you back a campaign on Kickstarter, your chosen payment-methoid doesn't get charged unless the campaign reaches its funding target - you pledge to make that payment if the campaign is successful.
 

Agony_Aunt

Agony_Aunt
Mole HD said:
Resetting the Db isn't the same as wiping your gear and cash...that's LTP and sometimes does remain persistent. I haven't lost anything since 3.8.
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Ah ha!

By the way, apparently someone said they paid real cash for credits and after losing them due to a bug, CIG support won't restore them. What i'm hearing is they will get them back when the game releases... but, release and SC is a tricky concept apparently.

In short, they may never see those credits again, a waste of real money.
 

Mole HD

Mole HD
Agony_Aunt said:
Ah ha!

By the way, apparently someone said they paid real cash for credits and after losing them due to a bug, CIG support won't restore them. What i'm hearing is they will get them back when the game releases... but, release and SC is a tricky concept apparently.

In short, they may never see those credits again, a waste of real money.
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Never a good idea to buy UEC 'starting' credits with cash...I mean $20 for 20k aUEC just to use in the PU isn't that fantastic a bargain in the first place, that's what you get paid for 2 or 3 box delivery runs.
However, in saying that, over the years I've bought some UEC with spare store credit here and there so I start every wipe... or former wipe... with around 350k aUEC. That doesn't include my starting 40k I have tied to game packages...that'll be released when the game is. stifles laughter.

CiĀ¬G recently changed the useage of $ bought UEC from the store and added it to the starting credits on your account instead of being readily available in the PU as it used to be...I'd like to think it wasn't done cynically but tied to the introduction of baby LTP...but I know I'd be wrong :)

It's not hard to make credits in game by any means...even starting with zero and an Aurora, but losing credits in the way that this 'someone' suggested is easily remedied by doing a character reset in your account settings instead of bleating to CiĀ¬G support...he should have asked around in the game chat, someone would have told him so...
 
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Agony_Aunt

Agony_Aunt
Mole HD said:
It's not hard to make credits in game by any means...even starting with zero and an Aurora, but losing credits in the way that this 'someone' suggested is easily remedied by doing a character reset in your account settings...
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Ah, just a shame then CIG support didn't say that to the person having the trouble.
 

Mole HD

Mole HD
Agony_Aunt said:
Ah, just a shame then CIG support didn't say that to the person having the trouble.
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They're not exactly helpful and they're usually slow at answering requests...unless you're concierge. Concierge support isn't too bad, even considering it's one of the few perks we do get apart from tacky gold plated gear that only the 890J owners wear to cover up their CR monogrammed gold budgie smugglers.

Common peasants get the chain smoking cat lady with a waiting list ;)

At the start of 3.8, I started with zero credits...did a character reset and got all my 3.7 credit total back but lost a few ship upgrades...3.9 is plagued with that at the moment...account errors which lose you bought equipment or credits or both, it's all tied to the LTP database which isn't quite working as it should. I've been lucky and not lost anything so it's a bit of a lottery as to who loses what... if anything at all. Some like me are lucky, others have been plagued with it even after resetting more than once to fix it. Even the latest PTU hotfix patch hasn't fixed it for some...I was fine once again.

The hotfix PTU was a possible fix for turning invisible on login, losing mobiglas and the like rather than account errors though which was somehow tied into the character creator...no idea how.

For errors or game bugs, it's much easier to ask around in game chat or pop onto Spectrum and rake around rather than go through support. They're more busy and a lot slower than usual as a result of the lockdown thing and often aren't aware of the workarounds that folks who regularly play are already aware of...like I mentioned before, the testing chat channel is particularly helpful in suggesting workarounds or solutions.
 
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