VR support 'not at launch' for Odyssey
- Thread starter Lordxenu
- Start date
Hopefully
It seems obvious to me that the split should be whenever the avatar gets out of the pilot or SRV Seat. It's when you start walking around that things get tricky.
BTW, as I've said in other threads. Just to give you an idea of how much work it is to put in a good FPS VR experience. According to Wikipedia, it took a team of 80 almost 4 years to put together Half Life:Alyx. That's a year longer than the same size team (guestimate) who've done Odyssey.
BTW, as I've said in other threads. Just to give you an idea of how much work it is to put in a good FPS VR experience. According to Wikipedia, it took a team of 80 almost 4 years to put together Half Life:Alyx. That's a year longer than the same size team (guestimate) who've done Odyssey.
And as I said in another thread, all the time wasn't spent on implementing the VR, they had to do all the other things that a game requires and Odyssey, as an expansion, has a head start on that account.
Is it a head start though? There'll be technical debt (stuff from the current build that clashes with the design intentions for Odyssey). And FDev are also making 'a whole new game' essentially. (Both in terms of adding Legs generally, and in terms of working up the VR tech & design to go with it).
I think we can agree that FDev wouldn't be going for anything like the VR FPS experience that Alyx delivered, and we don't know how much of the Alyx staffing was on aspects that would be 'dual use' here (location assets / AI etc etc). But it's still a pointer to the type of dev that a full fat VR FPS entails. And that's just for an offline, VR-alone, campaign title. (All-be-it a great one
)
I think the truth is that when they started the New Era, nobody gave a damn about VR support anymore, and the decision has been made long before today, may it be in 2018 when they decided on the refresh/rewrite. So consequently, in early 2019 they removed all traces of VR support from the ED website plus the Oculus Store as a marketplace. Well, this did not go unnoticed, so I started a thread about it. Apart from documenting the change of heading the game took slowly but surely, all I got was a well...statement from Paige that FDs commitment to the game was unchanged and the logos were removed for sake of cleaning up. No word on VR, though. In hindsight, it was an attempt at appeasement and I was considered a lunatic or whatever title deemed appropriate since then.
This is the thread in question: https://forums.frontier.co.uk/threads/bad-news-ahead.478321/
Mind the screenshots from the former ED site I took from the Wayback Machine in particular, they're there somewhere inside spoilers. What a difference.
And looking at things from today's perspective, I feel entitled to make the following assumptions:
1. VR support has never been planned for the New Era. The feature was dropped or phased out.
2. There will be no split whatsoever. New Era is more or less a complete rewrite. It may be the Cobra engine still does support VR, but the content does not. Remember the various issues that riddled the Q4 Beyond update. When asked about VR in the livestream in IIRC November, it was clear nobody had ever tested it. When it came out, VR was severely bugged, FSS was completely unusable initially, Neutron stars were only rendered on one eye, an so on, you name it.
3. Horizons and the base game will use the old content and most likely the old Cobra engine unless the improved engine can also run that content. Otherwise, they are installed in parallel and the launcher just boots up different modules (old or new). FCS will be the last additions the Old Era will see, and VR goes away with them. End of story for VR in ED.
The decision to drop/discontinue VR has been made and it is ultimately final. There is nothing we can do, and in particular, all technical arguments or what may be bearable in VR and so on are completely in vain. We can still protest and write negative reviews on Steam and so on, but that's about it. When the DLC comes out, it will all be forgotten anyway. The only thing FD have to do right now is to soften the waves, leaving a tiny spot of false hope on the horizon, but nothing will change ofc.
I really would be surprised if things turn out otherwise, but I really doubt that. Let's face it.
O7,
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The implementation of VR in HL:A in terms of controls and such is not hugely more advanced than it is in much smaller, cheaper indie games. In some ways it was actually a step backwards compared to what VR gamers have gotten used to thinking as the standard in games like these. Valve almost didn't even implement smooth locomotion until people started pressuring them about it.
It was a mind-blowing experience because of the presentational triple-A values and engine optimisation unlike anything else seen in VR before. I believe that's where most of their development budget went to.
It was a mind-blowing experience because of the presentational triple-A values and engine optimisation unlike anything else seen in VR before. I believe that's where most of their development budget went to.
I don't deny that VR is no small requirement to add to Odyssey, but then I expect a great deal of issues have arisen that needed (need to be) dealt with. The question is, why is the issue so peculiar to VR, or is VR a convenient sacrificial lamb to get Odyssey out 'on time'?Is it a head start though? There'll be technical debt (stuff from the current build that clashes with the design intentions for Odyssey). And FDev are also making 'a whole new game' essentially. (Both in terms of adding Legs generally, and in terms of working up the VR tech & design to go with it).
I think we can agree that FDev wouldn't be going for anything like the VR FPS experience that Alyx delivered, and we don't know how much of the Alyx staffing was on aspects that would be 'dual use' here (location assets / AI etc etc). But it's still a pointer to the type of dev that a full fat VR FPS entails. And that's just for an offline, VR-alone, campaign title. (All-be-it a great one
Here's an interesting post in that thread: https://forums.frontier.co.uk/threads/bad-news-ahead.478321/post-7436664
I owe you an apology, as I dismissed your concern as a nothing burger and especially when I saw Frontier's response.
The aspect that's peculiar to VR is the return on investment. The market is tiny. Why focus on VR work when they get the same money back from standard players, and can attract far more of them. Every dev man hour spent on VR isn't being spent on the classic version, maximising that game's quality and potential sales. (There's a much bigger market out there to reach).
It's not to say they won't make a passion play there, or find a way to make it a big feature addition to the game etc. But this is what VR dev is up against. Standard dev pays a lot better, in terms of units sold.
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Money back from Sales ?
I believe that VR users buy a lot more in the shop than other users, bobble heads spring to mind, they do look very good in VR.
I have spent £100's in the store, dont get me wrong i am not saying other users dont buy in the shop as well, but i belive VR users get more out of it when actually in the ship.
Is x many lost sales woth more than xx many shop purchases ?
war
Yeah sorry I just added at bit at the end there about 'in terms of units sold'
We know that in prior years cosmetics are not the main income. Unit sales are where the money is at.
EDIT: In FY18 cosmetics brought in £4mil. The majority of their revenue came from new units sold. The overall revenue for ED in FY18 was £22m.
So even if VR players spent well-above average in the cosmetics store, they'd still never match the sheer numbers + cash involved from core game + DLC purchases.
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Having features like VR in ED also give the title a certain amount of intangible benefit (goodwill if you like the accounting term). It becomes a "halo" product, much like say the Roadster (or soon to be Roadster 2) is to Tesla...
Or the Bugatti Veyron to the VAG
Or the Bugatti Veyron to the VAG
![[VR] Mad Mike](https://forums-cdn.zaonce.net/data/avatars/m/27/27910.jpg?1553527108){kind=avatar}
Whilst I would give my left nut for HLA levels of VR.love in ED I suspect payday 2 or serious Sam 3.or NMS would be more realistic.bars to set for VR.
Then why support VR in the first place? Why not head for the mobile market where I assume costs are lower and potential markets higher if it's all just about the money?
WHAT, my 32" screen is hard for me to see in these olden days what and i going to see on a mobile screen ?
ROFL
I know, that thread was locked before I could reply. However, I dispute that. The way I see it, VR is possible even in Odyssey, until the moment the avatar gets out of the seat. It wouldn't surprise me if we can fly over the new planets, and such like, in VR just like we do in Horizons. They would still have to work the mechanics is to handle the FPS movement and the same kind of work to make interactions work within the environment. That is still a huge job and one that's being vastly oversimplified by some people who are demanding VR at launch.
There's no way the development team of fdev's Size would be able to put in Odyssey and VR to the FPS experiance.
It's kind of odd though, just as a AAA VR game hits the shelves, with VR headsets out of stock because people want to play Alyx. Frontier decide to go cold on VR.
When they have had enough of Alyx these players are going to be looking for something else to play.
Presumably you held this opinion before Frontier's announcement, or it's a recent conversion?