Game Discussions Star Citizen Discussion Thread v12

So, you judged my arguments invalids and judged also that they can't withstand your arguments. And you conclude now that I only can be wrong and I should embrace your vision if I am a sane man...
To judge good or evil in an unequivocal and one-sided way is precisely the prerogative of priests, no ?
That's why players just better play and not go try proselytise their beliefs around. Leave the preaching to me. The lot here doesn't dare arguing back to me because they dread the day of reckoning.

I'm just not sure if Mole is a terrible Believer who should be smitten and whether sovapid is actually the Anti-Chris when I'm looking at the awful things he does to the pious pilgrims in SC. But I'm sure they have their role to play in the grand scheme of Creation.
 
So, you judged my arguments invalids and judged also that they can't withstand your arguments. And you conclude now that I only can be wrong and I should embrace your vision if I am a sane man...
To judge good or evil in an unequivocal and one-sided way is precisely the prerogative of priests, no ?
I mean not only my arguments. Others have given theirs and clearly showed you that you are „wrong“ on some points. But i don’t think you are open for facts. Not now but maybe in some years. We are still in the early days of SC development. So you have some time to think over it.
 
I mean not only my arguments. Others have given theirs and clearly showed you that you are „wrong“ on some points. But i don’t think you are open for facts. Not now but maybe in some years. We are still in the early days of SC development. So you have some time to think over it.
If I have understood well I have been deemed wrong, obtuse and a liar by the "Star Citizen Discussion Thread v12" community so I can't talk here anymore if I don't want to be called SC priest. I've missed something ?
 
I cant understand why after 6 years of failing to release some think it will still happen. If DCS or IL-2 was charging $1000 an aircraft (a lot of them not in the game) and it was falling through runways because "early days" they would be out of business. Just amazing.
Because DCS or IL-2 were charging. With SC you are funding. Not the same. You don't buy a ship $1000, you help develop a game and CIG give you a ship and an access to the alpha to thank you. You become a backer. If you don't want to fund, don't give money and wait for the release.

From the CIG official site :
A pledge is your way of showing support towards the development of RSI projects including Star Citizen and Squadron 42. You can back the game through a variety of pledge options. RSI operates entirely using player and supporter contributions!
Pledge options include:
- Game Packages of a ship, the game itself, and other items
- Standalone Ships
- Ship Upgrades to enhance ships currently owned as standalone or in a game package
- Subscriptions
- and more...
When a pledge is made for any item on the store, the money is contributed towards the development of the game. In return for helping fund RSI’s operations, you receive the items listed within the pledge.
 
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Because DCS or IL-2 were charging. With SC you are funding. Not the same. You don't buy a ship $1000, you help develop a game and CIG give you a ship and an access to the alpha to thank you. If you don't want to fund, don't give money and wait for the release.

This makes no sense, if you buy a plane in DCS the funds go towards salaries for devs to work on the game, so your purchases are paying for work that has been done or going towards work that will be done. People seem to have this terribly romanticised impression of what CIG are and how they operate and how they are not like other girls not like other companies while they are exactly like every other damn company out there.

Also, the game is not an alpha. People need to stop using that as a shield. With 3.0 the game was effectively released as an early access game. Look up Chris Roberts interview with Eurogamer if you have any doubts about the matter.
The ship and server access are not a thank you... they are a monetary transaction aka a sale.
 
From the CIG official site :
A pledge is your way of showing support towards the development of RSI projects including Star Citizen and Squadron 42. You can back the game through a variety of pledge options. RSI operates entirely using player and supporter contributions!
Pledge options include:
  • Game Packages of a ship, the game itself, and other items
  • Standalone Ships
  • Ship Upgrades to enhance ships currently owned as standalone or in a game package
  • Subscriptions
  • and more...
When a pledge is made for any item on the store, the money is contributed towards the development of the game. In return for helping fund RSI’s operations, you receive the items listed within the pledge.

Yep, they love to say these things "pledge, donate, support, contributions, helping" but it's just marketing speak, they use it to make people feel better in spending stupid amounts of money on pixel spaceships. Is that not obvious?
 
Haven't tryed the new system yet but it seems you can also select any target (front and behind) just by clicking on it on the radar.

I have faith that they will come up with a worse and much clunkier solution and remove this. (and you can do this now, probably an oversight that it wasnt removed)

RIP joystick users.
 
This makes no sense, if you buy a plane in DCS the funds go towards salaries for devs to work on the game, so your purchases are paying for work that has been done or going towards work that will be done.

There is a huge legal and goal difference. When you buy a product, the company must give you the product. If the product is not delivered, it's a scam.
When you fund a project, the "goal" (it's not a product) of the project can vary depending the evolution of multiple factors.

I will not explain it to you because I am not fluent enough to talk about legal stuff in english but just do some research.
But I can give you a practical example. I fund (really) since 10 years a french organism that helps research against cystic fibrosis. 50 € each years for a total amount of 500 €. In exchange I have some stickers and the joy to help some poor children. They made promise to find a cure to cystic fibrosis but haven't found it yet. But years after years, the life expectancy is better. So they haven't delivered but made progress. It's funding.
 
VAT is applied. It's a sale.

RSI is raising funds for the Game and other RSI Services. You may select one or more of the pledges for in-game items (“Pledge Item(s)”) offered on the Website, or through RSI’s customer service, and pay the indicated amount(s) (the “Pledge Funds”) in accordance with the following terms agreed between you and RSI.

Your Pledge Funds are a deposit to be used for the development and production cost of the Game, including the Pledge Items, and the costs of operating and hosting the Game, the Website and the other RSI Services, as well as RSI’s corporate expenses associated with the foregoing (the “Game Cost”).
The Pledge Funds will be earned by RSI at the earlier of:
when the Pledge Item becomes functional in Star Citizen’s Alpha Persistent Universe (or is delivered separately, such as the game Squadron 42), or
when your Pledge Funds have been expended for the Game Cost.
Notwithstanding anything to the contrary in these TOS, you may cancel your order of Pledge Items for any reason within 14 days of the date on which the order was made (“Cancellation Period”).
To cancel your order during the applicable Cancellation Period, you simply need to notify us in writing of your decision to cancel your order. The easiest way to do so is to complete and submit to us our support request form which can be found here. You can also cancel your order during the applicable Cancellation Period by emailing us at support@cloudimperiumgames.com. You may also use the cancellation/withdrawal form here to exercise your Right of Withdrawal (as described in Sec. XXIV below).
If you cancel your order during the applicable Cancellation Period, we will without undue delay, and in any event within fourteen (14) days from the date on which we receive notice of your decision to cancel your order, fully refund to you the respective Pledge Funds. In accordance with applicable financial control and banking rules, we reserve the right to refund you using the same means of payment as you used to make your order.
If you already have received your Virtual Goods and cancel your order within the applicable Cancellation Period, we will remove the relevant Virtual Goods you ordered from your Account once we have processed your cancellation notice and you will no longer be able to access or use those Virtual Goods.
RSI agrees to use its good faith business efforts to deliver to you the Pledge Item(s) as soon as possible. You agree that any unearned portion of your Pledge Funds shall not be refundable until and unless RSI has ceased development and failed to deliver the relevant Pledge Item(s) to you. In consideration of the promises by RSI hereunder, you agree that you irrevocably waive any claim for a refund of your Pledge Funds except as set forth in the preceding sentence.
For the avoidance of doubt, following the Cancelation Period, in consideration of RSI’s good faith efforts to develop, produce, and deliver the Game and the other RSI Services with the funds raised, you agree that all earned Pledge Funds shall be non-refundable regardless of whether or not RSI is able to complete and deliver the Pledge Item(s), the Game and/or the other RSI Services. In the unlikely event that RSI is not able to deliver the Pledge Item(s), and/or the Game, RSI agrees to refund any unearned portion of your Pledge Funds, and to post an audited cost accounting on the Website to fully explain the use of the funds raised for the Game Cost.
You acknowledge and agree that the Game and the Pledge Item(s) delivered to you may differ in certain aspects from the description of the Game and the Pledge Items on the Website at the time of your Pledge, due to the evolving design of the Pledge Items and the Game during development.
For the avoidance of doubt, all payments for items delivered immediately or soon after purchase, such as recurring website subscriptions or alpha passes, are not covered by this Section IV, but by Section VI below. Merchandize is defined and covered by Section VII below.
 
There is a huge legal and goal difference. When you buy a product, the company must give you the product. If the product is not delivered, it's a scam.
When you fund a project, the "goal" (it's not a product) of the project can vary depending the evolution of multiple factors.

I will not explain it to you because I am not fluent enough to talk about legal stuff in english but just do some research.
But I can give you a practical example. I fund (really) since 10 years a french organism that helps research against cystic fibrosis. 50 € each years for a total amount of 500 €. In exchange I have some stickers and the joy to help some poor children. They made promise to find a cure to cystic fibrosis but haven't found it yet. But years after years, the life expectancy is better. So they haven't delivered but made progress. It's funding.

Just because one thing you do has some similarities to another thing does not mean they are the same....

If a person visits CIG's website, puts an item in their virtual basket and then pays for that item, it is a sale. In legal terms it is known as a contract of sale.
 
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