VR support 'not at launch' for Odyssey

[VR Golgot]

1.9% of steam users is not a majority it's less than one in fifty so your attempt to force FDEV to give you what you want by threatening a boycott simply won't work. You just don't have significant numbers.

We don't have the data to assess significance. There's some fun fuzzy data out there, like the reddit poll which suggests surprisingly high VR usage rates amongst the hardcore, for example. But ultimately we can't know the overall picture. So you stating a boycott would be pointless is based on assumptions, just as much as the other end of the scale is (IE stating that VR ownership is a major strand of ED's playerbase).

Could VR Cmdrs not buying EDO or Arx affect FDev's revenue stream? It doesn't seem so improbable that it can be ruled out concretely.

But I also don't think it's the point. Most of the Cmdrs who are planning not to buy EDO (or spend more on Arx), are doing so simply because they don't want to play a non-VR version of ED (and they don't want to reward a company that's not providing a game that they want). There's nothing abnormal about those acts. Not buying a game that you don't want is perfectly normal . It doesn't have to be done with the overarching aim of affecting change. It's just an expression of personal preference.

Even if you did have the numbers most VR users would simply buy in anyway and hope VR would be implemented fairly quickly since the whole boycotting thing to force change is absolutely an edge case scenario.

That's an assumption. Certainly the reddit poll suggested a spread of usage styles (with those who play primarily in VR being just under a quarter of polled Cmdrs, but others more willing to play both flatscreen & VR). You can't possibly know how that former subset will react though, for a start. Not buying the expansion would be a perfectly rational response for them.

As a VR-alone player, that would certainly be my response, but as I've got an LEP it's somewhat moot. (The sentiment of "can't go back to flat" is far from an unusual one amongst VR-heads though, and would quite possibly prevail amongst the above subset of players).

Its an expansion for a video game, its not that big a deal.

It is to those who like the game in VR. You can't gatekeep people's tastes young Stig

 

[Stigbob]

I can’t believe that vr was not part of the original odyssey vision. I truly believe that fdev accumulated delays and they had to choose what to drop. This time it was vr probably for the reason you said. Problem is what will they drop next? As I said earlier I suppose it’s ship interiors. What’s worrying is that they always have to drop features to deliver in time and we already saw this in beyond with FCs and ice planets.

VR hasn't really taken off yet because the gear just isn't good enough, it needs another five years or so probably. Once VR has mass appeal then it'll have wider gaming support. However as it gets more advanced it'll also have far more compatibility straight from the box so the whole concept of games having to "support VR" will be replaced with simple plug and play. The current situation where games have to be specifically altered to have VR compatibility across multiple different incompatible headsets isn't viable.

In the meantime it'll remain a niche thing, which means developers wont prioritize it.

It is to those who like the game in VR. You can't gatekeep people's tastes young Stig

If you don't like the idea of the expansion without VR you shouldn't buy it. But as it's less than two percent of gamers nobody really needs to pay attention .

 

[Darkeyed]

Seeing as you don’t seem to fancy answering my earlier questions regarding VR, how about these: have you ever played a first-person game that had crouch? Or prone? Or the ability to lean?

Source: https://youtu.be/3LTNwwA8csQ?t=448

Im done with you, you keep trying to equate things that are not the same here's a video from pavlov and at the time stamp the guy does something. please tell me how thats would be fair to a non vr player having to face someone pulling that stunt ... go on I will wait.

 

[epoch5]

We don't have the data to assess significance. There's some fun fuzzy data out there, like the reddit poll which suggests surprisingly high VR usage rates amongst the hardcore, for example. But ultimately we can't know the overall picture. So you stating a boycott would be pointless is based on assumptions, just as much as the other end of the scale is (IE stating that VR ownership is a major strand of ED's playerbase).

Could VR Cmdrs not buying EDO or Arx affect FDev's revenue stream? It doesn't seem so improbable that it can be ruled out concretely.

But I also don't think it's the point. Most of the Cmdrs who are planning not to buy EDO (or spend more on Arx), are doing so simply because they don't want to play a non-VR version of ED (and they don't want to reward a company that's not providing a game that they want). There's nothing abnormal about those acts. Not buying a game that you don't want is perfectly normal . It doesn't have to be done with the overarching aim of affecting change. It's just an expression of personal preference.




That's an assumption. Certainly the reddit poll suggested a spread of usage styles (with those who play primarily in VR being just under a quarter of polled Cmdrs, but others more willing to play both flatscreen & VR). You can't possibly know how that former subset will react though, for a start. Not buying the expansion would be a perfectly rational response for them.

As a VR-alone player, that would certainly be my response, but as I've got an LEP it's somewhat moot. (The sentiment of "can't go back to flat" is far from an unusual one amongst VR-heads though, and would quite possibly prevail amongst the above subset of players).





It is to those who like the game in VR. You can't gatekeep people's tastes young Stig

Ya got links to back any of this up?

 

[Viajero]

For example.. why still no news about ships interiors? Is that still a variable too at this point?

Well, the interesting thing about that one is that unlike VR FDEV has not explicitely stated "not at launch" for it. Not yet at any rate. FDEV has not stated it will be for launch either and it is not present in the product description. From which I speculate there could be a teenie tiny possibility there may be a very limited and partial implementation of "some kind of" interior(s). But I do not think for a moment there will be fully mapped interiors for ships or stations etc.

 

[VR Golgot]

Ya got links to back any of this up?

Yep. They’re right there... (I’ve got more if you want though )

Don’t get your pants in a twist just because you’ve been asked for proof of your declarative statements and you can’t provide them. It’s fine to be mistaken. Chill.

 

[VR Golgot]

If you don't like the idea of the expansion without VR you shouldn't buy it. But as it's less than two percent of gamers nobody really needs to pay attention .

That would include you then. Off you pop

 

[Stigbob]

Yep. They’re right there... (I’ve got more if you want though )

Don’t get your pants in a twist just because you’ve been asked for proof of your declarative statements and you can’t provide them. It’s fine to be mistaken. Chill.

There's a 98% chance he's right.

That would include you then. Off you pop

 

[Arioch]

Im done with you, you keep trying to equate things that are not the same here's a video from pavlov and at the time stamp the guy does something. please tell me how thats would be fair to a non vr player having to face someone pulling that stunt ... go on I will wait.

Would you like a reply, or are you done with me? In case of the former, read on:

If I’m equating things that are not the same, how is leaning out or peeking above cover different in VR than doing so in non-VR games? The first example I can remember of such movements in flatscreen would probably System Shock in 1994, and the last mainstream shooter I played would probably be CoD: Infinite Warfare (which had context sensitive peep out/over controls, as well as prone). ARMA 3, as I’ve mentioned before, is a very good example.

You’ve time stamped a video of a point-blank shooting around a corner, coincidently the exact same situation I described in an earlier post. If a flatscreen player wants to run towards that corner in the same manner as that VR player did, right into those poking out weapons...well, perhaps they might want to try that “git gudder” advice that I see PvP types bandy about I’m sure in a pure flatscreen game they would’ve survived an extra half second until they reached the corner

So...have you played much PavlovVR? I’ve got 44 hours in it so far, and if you’ll care to peruse my previous posts in this thread you’ll find out how often blind-fire-around-corner has proved effective. Go on, I shall also wait

 

[epoch5]

Yep. They’re right there... (I’ve got more if you want though )

Don’t get your pants in a twist just because you’ve been asked for proof of your declarative statements and you can’t provide them. It’s fine to be mistaken. Chill.

I do not take orders from you.

 

[kilvenny]

VR converts have a smaller fraction of games to play in VR, so games they like they will put more time into, that is likely to mean they will indulge in micro transactions which means more commitment to the game fueling the hours they spend in game. The stat I would most like to see is the proportion of VR players amongst active players six months after a release. My guess is this is not 2 per cent, but a much higher figure.

Where this might hit ED is that three to six months after EDO releases, the casual FPS players will move on to the next FPS experience and with VR gone the pool of users who kept the game going over the last six years will be much smaller. Whilst they will no doubt pick up a lot of new licence sales, what has kept ED going is the recurring revenue stream and active player base. In maximising short term revenue, what we may see is a fall in recurring revenue, which will raise the question of ED as an ongoing product.

It should also be factored in that I have 4 accounts, one I use in VR, the other accounts I have kept in sync and only two have LEP, so having stopped playing, it's not just the VR account that dies, its the none VR ones as well. How many of the VR players are sitting on multiple accounts?

 

[CDOTS]

Well done you. Please hang around complaining about it constantly, the last comedy Horizons boycotter gave up years ago.

You still don't get it, let me put it into child terms so you may understand where I coming from. Imagine your playing call of duty on xbox and an update comes out for 50 bucks and that update is farmville. Would you buy it ?

Since 2015 I've owned 4 headsets and have only seen Elite in Vr so don't expect me to buy something I'm not interested in. Go back to your 2d screen and enjoy your game that Vr users have supported since launch. And yes that's right Vr users support 2d and all of Elite unlike a huge bunch of 2d selfish players. Have a wonderful day 07

 

[Stigbob]

VR converts have a smaller fraction of games to play in VR, so games they like they will put more time into, that is likely to mean they will indulge in micro transactions which means more commitment to the game fueling the hours they spend in game. The stat I would most like to see is the proportion of VR players amongst active players six months after a release. My guess is this is not 2 per cent, but a much higher figure.

Where this might hit ED is that three to six months after EDO releases, the casual FPS players will move on to the next FPS experience and with VR gone the pool of users who kept the game going over the last six years will be much smaller. Whilst they will no doubt pick up a lot of new licence sales, what has kept ED going is the recurring revenue stream and active player base. In maximising short term revenue, what we may see is a fall in recurring revenue, which will raise the question of ED as an ongoing product.

It should also be factored in that I have 4 accounts, one I use in VR, the other accounts I have kept in sync and only two have LEP, so having stopped playing, it's not just the VR account that dies, its the none VR ones as well. How many of the VR players are sitting on multiple accounts?

With microtransactions the majority spend nothing or a small amount whereas the whales just buy everything anyway making up the majority of all microtransaction revenue, 10% of players buying 70% of the cosmetics or whatever they are flogging.

So no VR won't really touch that, the big spenders will always spend big. Thar she blows.

You still don't get it, let me put it into child terms so you may understand where I coming from. Imagine your playing call of duty on xbox and an update comes out for 50 bucks and that update is farmville. Would you buy it ?

Since 2015 I've owned 4 headsets and have only seen Elite in Vr so don't expect me to buy something I'm not interested in. Go back to your 2d screen and enjoy your game that Vr users have supported since launch. And yes that's right Vr users support 2d and all of Elite unlike a huge bunch of 2d selfish players. Have a wonderful day 07

Lol.

 

[Rat Catcher]

Yep. They’re right there... (I’ve got more if you want though )

Don’t get your pants in a twist just because you’ve been asked for proof of your declarative statements and you can’t provide them. It’s fine to be mistaken. Chill.

Well... The only thing I can find on Xbox VR is linked below. it was posted in June though (It is not on the roadmap)

No VR on new Xbox planned

Xbox head Phil Spencer elaborated further on the 1000th episode of GamerTag Radio (which is awesome by the way), offering some more details on the reasons why Microsoft isn't jumping head-first into VR for Xbox Series X.

"We're not going to do that. I understand certain people would want that. We have to focus our efforts on the things we're doing right now. And the most precious resource that we have is the team and their ability. And I just have to focus on the things we're doing right now. [...] VR is not as simple as plugging your headset. You have to redo the dash[board]. There's a bunch of work that goes into it. And the teams at Valve, the teams at Sony, the teams at Oculus that are doing that work. They know the completeness and what it means to support the platform."

 

[Stigbob]

Well... The only thing I can find on Xbox VR is linked below. it was posted in June though (It is not on the roadmap)

No VR on new Xbox planned

Xbox head Phil Spencer elaborated further on the 1000th episode of GamerTag Radio (which is awesome by the way), offering some more details on the reasons why Microsoft isn't jumping head-first into VR for Xbox Series X.

I think VR may become a bit like 3D TV/movies in that it becomes the next big thing every ten years or so without ever going mainstream.

 

[Rat Catcher]

I think VR may become a bit like 3D TV/movies in that it becomes the next big thing every ten years or so without ever going mainstream.

I am really not sure, it may grow as plenty of new hardware is coming out, but until MS & the bigger games studios throw their weight into the arena (unlikely in the current economic climate) take-up is likely to remain low.

I'm happy enough with the Rift S and am planning to get the Valve Index next year (probably just in time for Odyssey to release without VR ) just because I have a reasonable library and a few more ttitles are due out 'real soon' that I'm interested in.

 

[Stigbob]

I am really not sure, it may grow as plenty of new hardware is coming out, but until MS & the bigger games studios throw their weight into the arena (unlikely in the current economic climate) take-up is likely to remain low.

I'm happy enough with the Rift S and am planning to get the Valve Index next year (probably just in time for Odyssey to release without VR ) just because I have a reasonable library and a few more ttitles are due out 'real soon' that I'm interested in.

They may be waiting for the next gen of VR that doesn't actually require specific software tinkering for all the different headsets for the sake of a maximum of less than 2% of sales. It would make financial sense not to support it at all now if that's the case as it'll probably be irrelevant soon(ish).

That's the thing that would give it mass appeal, to the big studios and joe public.

 

[Darkeyed]

You’ve time stamped a video of a point-blank shooting around a corner, coincidently the exact same situation I described in an earlier post. If a flatscreen player wants to run towards that corner in the same manner as that VR player did, right into those poking out weapons...well, perhaps they might want to try that “git gudder” advice that I see PvP types bandy about I’m sure in a pure flatscreen game they would’ve survived an extra half second until they reached the corner

because for those in non vr that feat could not be achived to be able to shoot around the corner like that the player would have to step out from behind the corner and open fire thus showing himself and giving the player stuck in the hallway a split second chance to return fire and put down the attacking player. in the timestamped video the player in the hallway had no chance to return fire because the only thing that came out around the corner was the bloody gun ie the player could not kill the attacking player if he had a better twitch reaction. in vr vs vr this kind of situation is ok because tec the other player could choose to do the same thing as well. but if you tried to say put vr vs monitor, the guess what the monitor player cannot repeat this action they have to step out of cover they have to reveal themselves.

 

[rhiz]

Could VR Cmdrs not buying EDO or Arx affect FDev's revenue stream? It doesn't seem so improbable that it can be ruled out concretely.

This is conjecture, but given the nature of the game, it's more mature playerbase and its status in the VR ecosystem to date, I’d wager that the numbers in Elite are higher than the general steam stat. I’d also expect VR players to be among the more dedicated and long-standing (although still a distinct minority next to veteran 2D players), so it’s not something that FD would have done lightly I don’t think. The question is, how do these numbers measure against the possible benefits of making developmentally efficient inroads into a broader (and rather pedestrian) FPS market, of presenting a less niche looking product and so on? If they have made a conscious decision to drop VR, no doubt they've factored all of this in.

I'd be surprised if the majority of VR users migrate to a 2D Odyssey though (I may be wrong) - with 2000+ hours logged and not a solitary second of that on a monitor, I'd simply have no interest in it. As I said before, I bought The Witcher 3 and Control recently, played a few of hours in each and then uninstalled them in favour of doing nothing much in Elite Dangerous VR.

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

head tracker.... are you honeslty trying to say vr having an unfair advantage is ok because cheats exist ? what the heck is wrong with you.

What the hell wind your neck in who said anything about cheaters.

1 screen Vs 3 screen
Pad Vs kB/m
Static screen Vs ed tracker or track ir

No cheats in sight but massively unbalanced (and that is acceptable imo).

All I was saying drawing the line at be being unfair is crud.