Game Discussions Star Citizen Discussion Thread v12

In regard of ED I think that it still would be essentially the same ED we know. Braben wanted to recreate the initial Elite, and he did exactly that. This is actually the reason ED looks repetitive and boring: it was created around the gameplay of 1984 era, not something we are accustomed to in 2014.
With 300 millions ED would be better than it is, but nothing like Crobber's dream.

Anyone remember when £500K & $2M were MASSIVE amounts to raise on KS and to start a game?

ED has a 10 year development timeline. Release in 2014/5 and patch and upgrade until 2024/25 with a 10 year 'story' to match. This way the players get a game to play that hopefully gets better and better. Issues have been with time taken for some people who didnt understand this and LEP holders who miss the L bit and think they should get their money back in 2 years. And opinions on what the next big patch should be.

I still prefer this way than wait until 2024/25 to get the 'full' game (personally I think ED will just go on and on being updated and upgraded)
 

Viajero

Volunteer Moderator
I think (again) if Christopher didn't get drowned in money, he might actually start producing the game, and eventually get a free pass on that initial lie.

But after Christopher got money raining down on him, he realized that he doesn't need the game per se. Which leads us to now, 9 years later, 300_ millions, dreams.txt and no game done.

This is a very convenient rationalization that allows Chris to save some face. I would actually argue that Chris was probably incapable to even deliver the original simpler pitch planned for 2014. If you dig into those times you will find out all the original issues with networking and many, many others. He barely managed to deliver Arena Commander, and in a horrendous state to boot without even 6DoF, by 2014.

The fact money continued pouring in just gave him a very convenient way out and the perfect excuse to justify delays by adding more scope. In Spanish we have a phrase to describe this kind of behavior, roughly translates to "fleeing forward".
 
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Medical stuff again in the news.
View attachment 189377
(Read recent medical assets + recent medical gun + recent dev talking about medical stuff = upgrade to medical gameplay incoming)

Oh LA, I can't help but like you, but lets go through this. Im going to use simple words that translate easily, I am not judging individuals or dismissing their efforts and certainly not their talent, its just for translation and understanding.

1. The ratio of 'artists' to devs is 4-1. For every 5 people, 1 is a dev and 4 are artists.
2. Artists can draw a picture, its what they do and are very good at.
3. Adding a picture into the game is proving harder than it should be. Adding a moving picture is a nightmare.
4. The pictures are very rarely actually finished as they get signed off and cancelled and back to the drawing board.....make that pixel blue
5. 4 Artists can produce 4x as much work as 1 dev...
6. 1 dev needs to do everything else to make the game actually work.
7. The game was paid for at the end of KS, with all the stretch goals met. All the funding for the game was in the bank....where has that money gone?
8. 4x as much has gone to Artists as Devs, to produce 4x as much Art as Game, which is then sold again for cash, but its already been paid for? So what exactly is the new money buying? More Art? To sell for more cash? For how long?
9. Contracted Devs are brought in to try and fill the gap but they are secondary to the ongoing issue of Cashflow. Where is the Cashflow if there is no Art to sell and not enough Devs to finish the game?
10. At what point should the focus switch from Art to Development? 4x as much development as Art?

A picture is not a game, or a mechanic, or a gameplay loop. It is a picture, a very good picture done by talented people, they can do another picture next week, and the week after that. They can draw anything as they have a blank canvas and their imagination. But when its drawn it is complete, it is a picture. Its not a sign of things to come, its a sign of 4x as much Art as Development but it keeps the Cashflow going.

CIG are now trapped. They cant spend the money on 4x Devs as they need to produce 4x Art to sell or a guaranteed funding source for what 12-24 months to get SQ42 released in initial format?. However long you think it will take they will need funding for that long. Where is that funding coming from if not promises of what is to come, and what better way to sell that concept than Art? The moment they stop producing Art the funding slows and stops until release.....and they dont have the Operating Costs to continue for more than a few months. (This isnt unusual in business, but most companies expect to sell a product to get the money in, CIG expects to sell Art)

Normally people browse a brochure and pick something out they like, then they order it and within a given timeline it arrives.
With SC people pick the game they want and order a product (a game + access to ABC ship at launch) and they get a JPEG and no product. and excuses about how difficult it is. It wasnt difficult during KS or the initial 2M, or the stretch goals, its not difficult to produce new Art. It is difficult because there arent enough people working on the proper project, producing the working game and not Art and CIG cant change it around, they are stuck. And now they kind of have to lie about how they are stuck as the truth would cause outrage.

They still need $X money and Y time to release anything. If they say what X & Y really are, well what do you think would happen?
 
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Its so unfair when all you need is a shiny picture and a load of verbal dung paired with zero respect for people to become successful. Its unfair and cruel and totally the world we are living in. Why am I still surprised when I m almost 50 and have seen so much misery? I guess the joke is on me in the end sadsmile

Well if it wouldn't be so majority of our politicians would be unemployed :D
 
Medical stuff again in the news.
…and still no actual progress.

(Read recent medical assets + recent medical gun + recent dev talking about medical stuff = upgrade to medical gameplay incoming)
No. Assets are assets. Gameplay is gameplay. The two are very different and separate thing, and neither needs the other to exist. In addition, CI¬G has amply demonstrated that one does not lead to the other and that “talk” is cheap since they never commit to delivering anything they talk about.

So, more accurately: medical assets (i.e. spinning their wheels, and you only need to mention it once) + dev talk (i.e. worthless and non-indicative PR) =/= medical gameplay (which don't exist and thus can't be “upgraded” until any progress and actual implementation is made, and there is very little evidence of that happening).

If you want to show off progress on the medical gameplay front, wait until there is medical gameplay. Then wait a little longer until it is being iterated on. Don't just be a CI¬G PR mouthpiece spamming worthless jpegs in lieu of real information.
 
By the way @LittleAnt - why don't you upload your own videos like sovapid does? I mean, presumably you do more things than just sovapid's yet_another_pew-pew_against_a_player.mp4
Probably for the same reason as I don't post vids very often...at least with pew vids, there's something remotely interesting to look at. My little mining vid I posted a while back probably got looked at twice :D
 
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In regard of ED I think that it still would be essentially the same ED we know. Braben wanted to recreate the initial Elite, and he did exactly that. This is actually the reason ED looks repetitive and boring: it was created around the gameplay of 1984 era, not something we are accustomed to in 2014.
With 300 millions ED would be better than it is, but nothing like Crobber's dream.

Granted, if the Star Citizen project has demonstrated one thing its how impossible the true vision of SC is today for the industry at large. Chances are the more competent studios dont even attempt such a game because they know from the start how impossible or how much of a risk it is at which point the funding wouldnt come together. We have seen some promising glimpses since SC started its development...mostly from other games mind you that such advances are possible in small steps but the thing SC promised to be...thats still not possible to this day.

But the SC debacle showed and is still showing that this is what people want and what they are willing to pay for so if you see a demand you are going to try to provide the supply. Now its a race to see which studio can make the best approximation to the dream and cash out on it. Star Citizen under CIG isnt going to happen. Its just a shame that the hardcore backers, so far gone with sunk cost fallacy deny upcoming studios with the potential and skillset to make it a reality the opportunity because they are blind to anything else then CIG and SC propaganda.


One thing i've noticed a lot with games that are remakes or successors is

Morning idea. In 2040 some unknown gaming studio makes a remake of Star Citizen, the best known non-game of the century and the remake will be better then then the dream :D:D:D


Oops. Sorry, I have arrogated to myself an undue right.

A cool timelapse posted today that show a full session of mining with a Rock. Timelapse start at 1:14.

Oooooorrrrr.....(dons tinfoil hat)...you are Sovapid and trolling us on TWO accounts. You just mixed up accounts and lost track of the conversation for a sec but otherwise well done Sovapid...well done :)


Well if it wouldn't be so majority of our politicians would be unemployed :D

I knooooow riiiight? My biggest flaw is probably that I believe in the good of people thats why I m such a sucker for underdog movies/stories and usually love the good guys the most. You know which my favorite character in the Dragonlance saga was? Cameron...big-hearted naive and dumb baffoon. Not very smart but loyal and good at his heart. Avengers team? Captain America for the same qualities. But I know deep down that people with such qualities in todays world would not survive or ever get rewarded...they would be put to use, dominated and controlled, corrupted and taken advantage of.
 
I was watching a recent video podcast (discussing the acquisition of Bethesda by MS) where Todd Howard of Bethesda was directly asked about Starfield...he answered with a wry smile, "Well...it's certainly getting a really good hype for a game that no-one's seen." :D

Even as yet a completely unknown entity in the space game genre...I suspect with Microsofts involvement, it could well be something else on the horizon that makes Star Citizen completely irrelevant.


Timestamp 17.00 in case it doesn't work. The whole vid is worth a watch anyway.
 
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I was watching a recent video podcast (discussing the acquisition of Bethesda by MS) where Todd Howard of Bethesda was directly asked about Starfield...he answered with a wry smile, "Well...it's certainly getting a really good hype for a game that no-one's seen." :D

Even as yet a completely unknown entity in the space game genre...I suspect with Microsofts involvement, it could well be something else on the horizon that makes Star Citizen completely irrelevant.


Timestamp 17.00 in case it doesn't work. The whole vid is worth a watch anyway.
As Starfield is unlikely to have multiplayer support I doubt it'll make Star Citizen irrelevant. There is a good chance Starfield makes Squadron 42 irrelevant though, if the latter hasn't launched by then.
 
As Starfield is unlikely to have multiplayer support I doubt it'll make Star Citizen irrelevant. There is a good chance Starfield makes Squadron 42 irrelevant though, if the latter hasn't launched by then.
I should have edited to mention Sqn42 rather than Star Citizen...but who's to say that Starfield won't have multiplayer support given what Fallout 76 presented rather badly and Zenimax/Bethesda already do quite competently with ESO? We don't know yet...maybe Starfield will be more a space mmo and successor to ESO rather than single player Skyrim in space ;)

I'm more excited, perhaps, by seeing where Bethesda goes with Starfield given the development support and financial might from Microsoft behind it...Todd Howard mentioned that part too (in relation to how Bethesda approach games development as a whole) during the podcast.

I can guarantee one thing... more people will be playing it than will ever play or buy into Star Citizen given that Starfield will be free, multi-platform and included in Gamepass Ultimate :)
 
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Sure but it also captures the "WW2 dogfighting" in space which is a star wars trademark quite well....SC doesnt do that
I thought the flight model of SC was a muppet too. At least I got that from comments.
And sure, ww2 dogfighting is a thing and it was compared to SQ42. For Elite I don't see a danger if this arcade feeling will be confirmed.
If the flight model is interesting though... oh boy as an X-Wing/Tie Fighter Veteran I love the look of it and the Star Wars setting. :)
 
Really dont see that but sure, we gonna have to see what SQ42 actually is and what ot brings to the table I guess

True therefore SQ42 first has to be released. But it has a single player campaign, full hotas support, vr, crossplay and the classic FM from the old Xwing and tie fighters. I mean that is what Cr want / has to archive with SQ42.
 
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