Also another rail gun tutorial. This is mostly for long range. What is great about long range is the sniping out of modules. This is almost guaranteed when you see the rail "snap" into place. With short range blaster rail guns, it's more difficult.
Ships Advice on engineering my Chieftain
- Thread starter CmdrLordValcar
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Also another rail gun tutorial. This is mostly for long range. What is great about long range is the sniping out of modules. This is almost guaranteed when you see the rail "snap" into place. With short range blaster rail guns, it's more difficult.
A Plasma Accelerator tutorial by Dezpe of Ronin of Amarak
Now I am going to get atop of my Soap Box:
Many Commanders are Not Fond of Ganking and associate PvPers Purely with Ganking. I am sure you are not one of them.
Yes, many PvPers do gank, but PvPers do other things like theory craft, teach and test weapons out the wazzoo. Just like PvEers, PvPers are multi-faceted and will get bored doing the same things over and over again. If you want to be the best combat pilot you can be, PvE or PvP, I strongly urge you to look at "ganker" videos. Most of them are videos against Commanders of similar skill. Many videos are tutorials like the ones I posted above. Some notorious gankers are the best teachers I have ever had and happily taught me even though they know I am lawful.
PvPers recognize the level of dedication and patience(!) it takes to fly the meta and to fly FA off. The greatest pilot in the game has 7 billion in rebuys. Please give them a listen. Thank you.
xoxo
slange
It's not specific modules, but the targeted module or the closest to the reticle. You can test that by aiming at a stationary ship from close range and moving the rail reticle around, you see it snapping to different modules without them being targeted.
Long range does not enhance the micro gimbal effect. But as you stated above the further the target is away the more distance the same micro gimbal can cover. Trying to snip modules from close range (<1km) with LR rails is the same difficulty as with SRB rails.
Surely not. But I do like to draw the line between PVP and blowing up harmless nubs for the sh*ts and giggles. ;-)Many Commanders are Not Fond of Ganking and associate PvPers Purely with Ganking. I am sure you are not one of them.
How did we end up at the ganking topic now anyway?
BTT: I have now test-flown my freshly built Chieftain, and so far am not overly amazed by the performance of the small rails. Maybe a little spoilt by the mediums on the FDL, which definitely pack a significantly stronger bit of OOMPH.
Surely not. But I do like to draw the line between PVP and blowing up harmless nubs for the sh*ts and giggles. ;-)
How did we end up at the ganking topic now anyway?
BTT: I have now test-flown my freshly built Chieftain, and so far am not overly amazed by the performance of the small rails. Maybe a little spoilt by the mediums on the FDL, which definitely pack a significantly stronger bit of OOMPH.
I was on my Soapbox trying to give a broader picture of the PvPer. It is my dream, that despite ganking, PvPers and PvEers can work together sometimes.
With Odyssey coming later this year, maybe there will be new game mechanics which will incentivize Bgsers and other PvEers to work with PvPers towards more fun goals. PvPers have warts, but we also have cookies.Yes, I completely agree with you about being lukewarm about the Chieftain as compared to the FDL. The FDL is my favorite ship, I have five fully engineered PvP fdls.
Nevertheless, I also have two fully engineered PvP Chieftains (named Froggy I and Froggy II) because of a hulltank tournament. At first I was screaming bloody murder, but after awhile I got used to the Froggies:
1. Having to adapt to different rotational sensitivities is very good for your brain. Habitual muscle memory does not work anymore, so new ones are built.
2. Differences in weapon convergence force you to fly differently which may help inform overall efficiency and range control in other ships.
3. The size 6 bi-weave Shield Generator regen is remarkable. Most PvP Chieftains fly bi-weaves. Most PvP FDLs are prismatic. Although I use the same pip distributions, my use of them is different between the two ships. I like learning about how different experimentals and engineering affect the capacitor.
This cause of yours is very noble indeed, I only fear that you might represent a minority.I was on my Soapbox trying to give a broader picture of the PvPer. It is my dream, that despite ganking, PvPers and PvEers can work together sometimes.
Think the problem is that there is this easy 'opt out' option always just a click away. Without Solo Play and with an enhanced C&P mechanic the dynamics of PVE and PVP would be completely different. Then we would still have the badies and gankers on the one side, but the incentive to hunt them down would ideally be so high, that a strong counterforce (professional bounty hunting PVP'ers) would form organically. Which in turn would regulate the risk for the PVE players.Yes its is a mixed bag indeed, I like it's flight behaviour much more then the FDL's. So smooth in comparison!Yes, I completely agree with you about being lukewarm about the Chieftain as compared to the FDL. The FDL is my favorite ship, I have five fully engineered PvP fdls.
Nevertheless, I also have two fully engineered PvP Chieftains (named Froggy I and Froggy II) because of a hulltank tournament. At first I was screaming bloody murder, but after awhile I got used to the Froggies:
1. Having to adapt to different rotational sensitivities is very good for your brain. Habitual muscle memory does not work anymore, so new ones are built.
2. Differences in weapon convergence force you to fly differently which may help inform overall efficiency and range control in other ships.
3. The size 6 bi-weave Shield Generator regen is remarkable. Most PvP Chieftains fly bi-weaves. Most PvP FDLs are prismatic. Although I use the same pip distributions, my use of them is different between the two ships. I like learning about how different experimentals and engineering affect the capacitor.
But so far it feels a litte undergunned. Looks like I have to tweak my weapon loadout a bit. I guess my 'classical' setup thinking didn't translate well, as I have MC's equipped vs hull, and use the rails for the shields, and that just doesn't seem to be the right idea, takes way too long to bring them down. I can see now why so often PA's are used in conjunction with rails. Might just have to give it a try. If it was not for those slow projectiles...
I also have a bi-weave installed, recharges in 1.27 min. Feel it rewards active pip management much more. In my FDL with a-rated shields they seem to keep getting drained no matter what I do until they are down and then I have to leave, as they take forever to reacharge. Feels uncomfortable somehow.
I also have a bi-weave installed, recharges in 1.27 min. Feel it rewards active pip management much more. In my FDL with a-rated shields they seem to keep getting drained no matter what I do until they are down and then I have to leave, as they take forever to reacharge. Feels uncomfortable somehow.
I use a size 6 bi weave Reinforced shield with Lo Draw on my Chief because I get plasma rammed and like ramming. I used to use Fast Charge, but found out today during practice that lo draw doesn't handicap the sys capacitor as much when your shields are down.
You might try a size 5 bi weave on your FDL if you do not yet have prismatics. The usual engineering is either Thermal or Reinforced with Fast Charge. I used a bi-weave before I got my prismatics. PvPers often turn off their shield boosters when their shield generator breaks. The shields will regen faster. However, when you are "safe", dont forget to turn your boosters back on. Also, since the FDL is a shield tank, 2 4A Shield Cell banks will help if you use a non-biweave shield generator. Usual engineering for scbs are rapid recycling.
If you ever decide to PvP, you should pledge to Aisling Duval for prismatic shields. Its easy, but boring. Just pledge. Then do nothing. Then, when the fourth week has passed, on the Tuesday or Wednesday of that week you transport 750 fliers to another system. Be sure to also have credits with which to purchase the prismatics. You will want several size 5 and 6s and perhaps one of each of the other sizes. They are expensive, the size 7 and 8s are over 100 milliion credits each.
How much does it cost to put the proper modules in the FDL?
This cause of yours is very noble indeed, I only fear that you might represent a minority.
Yes its is a mixed bag indeed, I like it's flight behaviour much more then the FDL's. So smooth in comparison!
But so far it feels a litte undergunned. Looks like I have to tweak my weapon loadout a bit. I guess my 'classical' setup thinking didn't translate well, as I have MC's equipped vs hull, and use the rails for the shields, and that just doesn't seem to be the right idea, takes way too long to bring them down. I can see now why so often PA's are used in conjunction with rails. Might just have to give it a try. If it was not for those slow projectiles...
I also have a bi-weave installed, recharges in 1.27 min. Feel it rewards active pip management much more. In my FDL with a-rated shields they seem to keep getting drained no matter what I do until they are down and then I have to leave, as they take forever to reacharge. Feels uncomfortable somehow.
Try this build, https://s.orbis.zone/cbcS.
I'm actually prefer this than the Chieftain meta build. Turns and boost a little faster and 4 rails are pretty handy during shields recovering , like 43 secs with 4 SYS pip.
Here is one of my organized FDL PvP builds. It is not for organic because of the smaller fuel tank and 2D FSD. In organized, we fight to the death and if we live, we just hobble to the nearest station or fleet carrier in system.
Coriolis EDCD Edition
A ship builder, outfitting and comparison tool for Elite Dangerous
s.orbis.zone
On the Coriolis page towards the bottom, it gives you the cost of the ship. My mirrored surface build is around 198 million credits. If I were to use a military grade hull instead, it would be 134 million credits. And even cheaper for lightweight alloys. Most of the damage my ships take is absolute or thermal, hence the mirrored surface.
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130 mil isn't so bad. I was thinking it was gonna cost way more because I believe you said above that shields were 100 milHere is one of my organized FDL PvP builds. It is not for organic because of the smaller fuel tank and 2D FSD. In organized, we fight to the death and if we live, we just hobble to the nearest station or fleet carrier in system.
Coriolis EDCD Edition
A ship builder, outfitting and comparison tool for Elite Dangerous
On the Coriolis page towards the bottom, it gives you the cost of the ship. My mirrored surface build is around 198 million credits. If I were to use a military grade hull instead, it would be 134 million credits. And even cheaper for lightweight alloys. Most of the damage my ships take is absolute or thermal, hence the mirrored surface.
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Damn, all these options in setting up your ships are really disheartening at times... feels like whenever I am done engineering a ship i recieve new input that makes me want to change everything again....
This is my current FDL build, which is basically a prismatic build, which I plan to upgrade eventually when I have unlocked them. Might take your advice and try how it works out with some SCB's. But that's just another thing I have to get used to, as I have not used any so far.
Also, thanks for all the other useful tips!
If this isn't, what is a 'meta' Chieftain then, if I may ask?
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Should I go full thermal resist on my shield gen and boosters for my Chieftain? Here's what it's looking like as of right now.
coriolis.io
Coriolis EDCD Edition
A ship builder, outfitting and comparison tool for Elite Dangerous
coriolis.io
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I'd say yes for the shield gen, resistance augment/force block on the boosters.
Consider swapping one (only one though) of your hull reinforcements to Thermal Resistant as well.
I'd also say Armoured is generally a better plant option than Overcharged.
Consider swapping one (only one though) of your hull reinforcements to Thermal Resistant as well.
I'd also say Armoured is generally a better plant option than Overcharged.
Don't be disheartened! The endless possibilities are precisely what keeps most of us in game. There are some of us with 2 billion credits worth of T-10s... Just to Store Engineered Modules.Damn, all these options in setting up your ships are really disheartening at times... feels like whenever I am done engineering a ship i recieve new input that makes me want to change everything again....
This is my current FDL build, which is basically a prismatic build, which I plan to upgrade eventually when I have unlocked them. Might take your advice and try how it works out with some SCB's. But that's just another thing I have to get used to, as I have not used any so far.
Also, thanks for all the other useful tips!
If this isn't, what is a 'meta' Chieftain then, if I may ask?
Since the game is an evolving entity, what is meta one year can be useless the next and vice versa. And new ships come along now and then which may be suited perfectly for a stored module. If you gradually and sanely gather engineering mats throughout your travels, you should have enough to engineer without going on too many material grind fests. This game has no real conclusion.
As for your FDL. We need to know its primary purpose. You have an interdictor. Are you going to interdict NPCs or humans? If a human sees an interdictor on you, they may try to interdict you themselves. Sir Ganksalot has a Surviving a Gank event now and then. You might want to attend one of those if Open is or will be your mode of choice. That event will give you a feel of how much more interesting and challenging fighting humans can be.
Your weapons are two mcs and three rails... I would go three mcs and two rails or 4 mcs and 1 rail. Long range rails shine when you are more than 2km away. Unless you do something called "reverski", an opponent will always be trying to get closer to you so that you would not be able to keep your distance. Reverski is when you joust past an opponent and flip to gain distance and then fire whilst going backwards, usually in fa off. Although some PvPers do it, reverski is frowned upon by the pvp community because it is very boring to fight against. Reverski is great for thargoid Interceptors though. With three mcs and two rails, you can do damage both at near and far distances.
When I first started PvPing I used an all gimballed Overcharged MC build. Since I only had one fire group, I could concentrate also on maneuvering. I didn't want to further fry my already over taxed brain.
Then I added a feedback cascade rail because cancelling banks is crucial. But if you are happy with 2 mcs and three rails, go for it.Damn, all these options in setting up your ships are really disheartening at times... feels like whenever I am done engineering a ship i recieve new input that makes me want to change everything again....
This is my current FDL build, which is basically a prismatic build, which I plan to upgrade eventually when I have unlocked them. Might take your advice and try how it works out with some SCB's. But that's just another thing I have to get used to, as I have not used any so far.
Also, thanks for all the other useful tips!
If this isn't, what is a 'meta' Chieftain then, if I may ask?
Perhaps this,
.
I am doing some casual PP opposition every now and then, thought it might come in handy if I accidentally run into a hauler. But the only one I saw so far, a T10, vanished in front of me... maybe logged off.Don't be disheartened! The endless possibilities are precisely what keeps most of us in game. There are some of us with 2 billion credits worth of T-10s... Just to Store Engineered Modules.
As for your FDL. We need to know its primary purpose. You have an interdictor. Are you going to interdict NPCs or humans? If a human sees an interdictor on you, they may try to interdict you themselves. Sir Ganksalot has a Surviving a Gank event now and then. You might want to attend one of those if Open is or will be your mode of choice. That event will give you a feel of how much more interesting and challenging fighting humans can be.
Your weapons are two mcs and three rails... I would go three mcs and two rails or 4 mcs and 1 rail. Long range rails shine when you are more than 2km away. Unless you do something called "reverski", an opponent will always be trying to get closer to you so that you would not be able to keep your distance. Reverski is when you joust past an opponent and flip to gain distance and then fire whilst going backwards, usually in fa off. Although some PvPers do it, reverski is frowned upon by the pvp community because it is very boring to fight against. Reverski is great for thargoid Interceptors though. With three mcs and two rails, you can do damage both at near and far distances.
When I first started PvPing I used an all gimballed Overcharged MC build. Since I only had one fire group, I could concentrate also on maneuvering. I didn't want to further fry my already over taxed brain.
Also in the recent community goal I did NPC interdictions, because there was nothing else to hunt for the bounties.
Funny side note, I was cruising in the CG system with my Vulture and had a Corvette and moments later a FDL line up behind me for interdiction. Not sure what they where checking for, but both lost interest/ chickened out. Maybe not all gankers are created equal?
I am not too worried about getting ganked anymore, most of my ships should be capable to either run, or fight back at least to some extent. After all, what is a rebuy these days.
I do like the weapons loadout on the FDL, that huge multicannon is just pure carnage.
Overall this combination seems to be the strongest I've used so far, my only gripes with the ship are its stalling behaviour in turns and the shield setup.I am thinking to change one of the super penetrator experimentals to feedback cascade, to be more efficient at cancelling those banks.
Oh wow. I just watched the "meta chieftain" vid, and the build is so very different from mine, if I wanted to replicate it I'd better get a second Chieftain. XD The only thing that's identical is the Dirty Drag Drives.
Since my Chief is "optimized" (if that) for PvE / Bounty Hunting, I put more emphasis on Shields, less on armour and have an actually usable jump drive, for starters.
Downside is that I had to OC my PP bc Armored doesn't give me enough power.
FWIW my shield setup is:
Bi-Weave / Thermal / Fast Charge
Class 5 Guardian SB
Class 4 SCB
4 Shield Boosters (1 Heavy Duty, 3 Res Augment)
For Armour I use Lightweight Military with 1 Hull and 2 Module RPs. But basically if my shields drop in a RES/CZ, something has already gone wrong.
Still this "meta" build looks attractive for the Long and Short range options and the punch it packs. 200 theoretical DPS, that's more than twice of mine.
A theoretical build I put together gets beyond 300dps but only at very short range (600m) with no LR option.
Since my Chief is "optimized" (if that) for PvE / Bounty Hunting, I put more emphasis on Shields, less on armour and have an actually usable jump drive, for starters.
Downside is that I had to OC my PP bc Armored doesn't give me enough power.
FWIW my shield setup is:
Bi-Weave / Thermal / Fast Charge
Class 5 Guardian SB
Class 4 SCB
4 Shield Boosters (1 Heavy Duty, 3 Res Augment)
For Armour I use Lightweight Military with 1 Hull and 2 Module RPs. But basically if my shields drop in a RES/CZ, something has already gone wrong.
Still this "meta" build looks attractive for the Long and Short range options and the punch it packs. 200 theoretical DPS, that's more than twice of mine.
A theoretical build I put together gets beyond 300dps but only at very short range (600m) with no LR option.
Update:
Meh. I'm really rubbish at fighting with "advanced" loadouts. When I fit most slots with fixed weapons - even fixed Beams which should be easiest to use - I have real trouble hitting small ships at all, let alone landing enough shots to kill them.
Also, using Small Fixed Beams and Large PAs opens the new circumstance that I can only use one set at a time, bc one is hitscan and the other slow projectiles requiring a lot of lead. So, it is generally a dumb idea to outfit both fire groups as Fixed, and it would be better to use Gimballed lasers in conjunction with PAs?
Meh. I'm really rubbish at fighting with "advanced" loadouts. When I fit most slots with fixed weapons - even fixed Beams which should be easiest to use - I have real trouble hitting small ships at all, let alone landing enough shots to kill them.
Also, using Small Fixed Beams and Large PAs opens the new circumstance that I can only use one set at a time, bc one is hitscan and the other slow projectiles requiring a lot of lead. So, it is generally a dumb idea to outfit both fire groups as Fixed, and it would be better to use Gimballed lasers in conjunction with PAs?
Id say yes in this case. Also no shame in using gimballs. While they do less damage, they offer more time on target while bein able to fly evasive.