Make Elite an MMO again !!

[Dragsham]

We're not advocating changes to solo nor pg and using that as a counter argument seems narrow-minded in my view.
The ask is for open only with bonuses to reflect it. And a whole new regime of law n order and accountability. Along with a player run economy.
Choice....choose to partake or not. Knowone is forcing anyone to do anything.
Implemented it would grow over time as we've predicted and in my view would far outstrip its single player equivalent.

 

[aRJay]

It's not so much about pvp. It's just the sheer emptyness within the bubble.
Surely if it were one for all namely just open or something akin to it, the bubble would be alive with shipping, pirates, bounty hunters, the fuzz, bgs/runners. The place would feel alive !
Ships would organically evolve over time to accommodate the new risk aspect.
Wings would reside in deciat decimating the hobos.
The whole experience would be more realistic.
The emphasis on pvp isn't at all what l or 1000s of other cmdrs seek.
It's a more immerisive gameplay we crave.
Picture Borann under such a regime. Totally different ballgame. Killers & do gooders eternally persecuting or policing, whilst heavily armoured miners dart in grab a few 100 tons n scarper before it kicks off.
A better game. Everyone taking into account its good and bad points.
And yes I do think it would work. With law n order remake and so on.
Do think we all have our ideas of elite. And l respect everyone's opinion but us open only are not all rampant pvpers.

The reality is though that we are separated by the hardware we play on as well as the time zones we play in and the way instancing works also limits the numbers that can be in one place at the same time and even in the bubble there are so many locations that even before play modes come into things you are going to struggle to see more than a handful.

I understand the desire for there to be more people around to interact with in all the various ways but a lot of the time I don’t want that I just want to play the game without feeling I am being rude by ignoring the chatter.

I also don’t think that bribing people to play in open is going to make it a nicer place to be.

 

[Dragsham]

Let's assume cross play. It wouldn't work without it.

 

[Ian Doncaster]

The only way they can truly stop it is to come up with better ideas that organically pull people into open, or leave those in open feeling less bad about it and/or having a better chance of meeting players organically. And have it implemented by FDev. Totally doable...............

Well, FDev have already done that on numerous occasions. It makes not the slightest bit of difference to the arguments.

Over half of all player activity is in PC Open. That's been true for ages and hasn't changed. The total amount of player activity has much more than doubled since suggestions about making more attractive started coming through - the busiest systems now are about five times busier than they were in 1.0, the quieter systems are two-to-three times busier ... and that's not counting the big spike in activity from all the Epic free accounts (which has approximately doubled activity compared with six months ago).

So, if in 1.0 Frontier had only had Open, there would have been about 50% more players in Open [1]. Now, there are >200% more players in Open than back then. I see players in Open daily unless I'm poking around really obscure systems, while when I started flying around in version 1.1 I could go for weeks without seeing anyone.

Has this massive increase in the number of players in Open made any difference to these arguments over the last six years? Not in the slightest.

Would encouraging another few percent of players into Open make any difference? Well, since activity is ~30% higher at weekends compared with weekdays, and we're not at the stage where people are saying "Open is great at weekends, but we really need an incentive for people to play in Open during the week too", obviously not.

When Odyssey launches, assuming that it's not a total disaster, there'll be at least a temporary boost in player activity as everyone checks out the new stuff. Almost certainly, this will mean that the number of people in Open post-launch is greater than the total number of people in all modes right now. Will this stop threads like these? Of course not.

The only way they could actually make Open feel inhabited would be to significantly shrink the size of the bubble, to concentrate the same number of players into a much smaller number of systems - have the Thargoids set 90% of the bubble on fire and completely destroy it, then what's left would feel quite busy. But there are other good reasons not to do that.

[1] Falsely assuming here that everyone continued to play under those terms, of course, so this is a theoretical best case.

 

[TiberiusDuval]

A lot of people denying the "fear of open" argument, fear of being blown up by a powerful player ship. Actually it's what moves the majority of those who switch to solo I reckon - red faced pram toy-ejection. A bad experience (especially if early on) that characterises the mode for them. Maybe not the vets here, but the average player pootling around or newb. The same edgy feel is something that attracts others to stay in open. Balancing the "bad" experiences with smoother opportunities for positive ones would improve the game for everyone.

We can all try to do that for ourselves too (the "ED way"...). Since new year I've spontaneously given big wing shares to 4 CMDRs I randomly encountered flying in open, 2 resulted in really fun coop play sessions (and future ones) - there's your open bonus and the solo suckers can't do anything about it!

Well, when I consider my playing, usually I have some business to do, running mission or some other thing. Getting to combat with another player at best hinders such business, at worst sets me back a rebuys worth when it comes to credits. So for me equation seems to be purely negative. Okay maybe attacker is some noob with unengineered noobship and I win, chance is pretty small for that. And it nonetheless still wastes my time for whatever I'm doing. Those who get their kick from PVP stuff, well I'm somewhat not a nice person, as I deny "fun" for them, as they will need targets. But as I say equation is kind of unbalanced for me and I'm not paid to provide fun for them, in fact such fun costs me.

 

[Mormo]

Well that's a progress I guess. We didn't have 'open only' thread for a couple of weeks or so.

 

[Dragsham]

But as lan pointed out the bubble is huge... 30,000 plus systems the chances outside of the usual systems, of encountering anyone is remote. I concur. I play open always and have yet to see anyone within 100 lys of my home system in a. Years gameplay. Not one single cmdr..
So using the "oh open only means mega gank time", argument ain't valid. You'll not meet anyone except perhaps pp corridoors bgs areas etc.
And you'll likely see haulers and miners as well as a hobo.

 

[Brrokk]

Heh si, amigo. Hot, oft-repeated topics don't get seen that way here, though. If it gets talked about or suggested a lot then it's because it's a bad idea. That's just how it is here, specifically. But in this case I do think fdev made it clear this wasn't an option.

I don't personally agree with the 2x rewards thing either but I do think cgs and power play should be open only. Just because it'd improve both immeasurably as actual community functions.

CGs? I'd just stop doing them if they were Open-only. I guess many others would too; I can't see how that would improve them as community functions.

 

[Brrokk]

A lot of people denying the "fear of open" argument, fear of being blown up by a powerful player ship. Actually it's what moves the majority of those who switch to solo I reckon - red faced pram toy-ejection. A bad experience (especially if early on) that characterises the mode for them. Maybe not the vets here, but the average player pootling around or newb. The same edgy feel is something that attracts others to stay in open. Balancing the "bad" experiences with smoother opportunities for positive ones would improve the game for everyone.

We can all try to do that for ourselves too (the "ED way"...). Since new year I've spontaneously given big wing shares to 4 CMDRs I randomly encountered flying in open, 2 resulted in really fun coop play sessions (and future ones) - there's your open bonus and the solo suckers can't do anything about it!

You've got no idea why some players choose Solo or PG.

Personal disclaimer: I've never had a bad experience in Open and I don't find it to be any more dangerous than other modes. There are, though, situations where it wastes my limited gaming time. I therefore use all modes about equally.

 

[Dragsham]

They could do solo or pg we wouldn't want it any other way... keep saying it were not asking for anything that alters solo or pg.
Cgs would simply be more lucrative in open only. Devil is in the detail.

 

[khalismur]

Well that's a progress I guess. We didn't have 'open only' thread for a couple of weeks or so.

Most of the arguments are not for "open only", but rather some changes to how open works, as to have a more interesting galaxy. The fact that such threads surge on a regular basis is an indication that i) many people think there's a problem with the current system or have suggestions to make the game better in their eyes and ii) people don't use the forum search function

We're not advocating changes to solo nor pg and using that as a counter argument seems narrow-minded in my view.
The ask is for open only with bonuses to reflect it. And a whole new regime of law n order and accountability. Along with a player run economy.
Choice....choose to partake or not. Knowone is forcing anyone to do anything.
Implemented it would grow over time as we've predicted and in my view would far outstrip its single player equivalent.

Very well said. I don't get it why some think it'd be the destruction of solo/PG. Your suggestion is very interesting.

I also never suggested ending solo/PG, but rather a review of how the different modes interact with BGS. There must be a downside to being able to influence the BGS while playing in a safe mode. I didn't duggest any punishment for solo/PG players, but rather a buff to Open players, by making Inf changes count more. That's not an absurd change, that's not punishment. Just a way to make the galaxy more alive in Open and the rivalries between PMF more interesting.

Again, console players, solo/PG players would not be punished in any way.

 

[[VR] Bulbulunufus]

Some players seem quite insistent that players "fear" PvP, maybe they can't accept that it can have nothing at all to do with fear. It may be that players simply don't find PvP to be "fun", and I expect most gamers play games to have fun.

Given the design of the game, it is possible that PvP is entirely irrelevant to the gameplay of a not insignificant number of players - as there's no requirement that players ever encounter an antagonistic player, unless they choose to.

Indeed - it's back to "fun" - which each player has their own definition of.

Whether players play the game to be on edge all the time or to relax while space trucking is up to them. Not everyone plays the game for the "edgy feel".

Wing shares work in both multi-player game modes - so it's a multi-player bonus, not just an Open bonus.

Good pedantic misread of everything I said there 10/10.

 

[aRJay]

Let's assume cross play. It wouldn't work without it.

Then maybe the discussion could be shelved until after cross play is available and working properly In the game.

 

[Brrokk]

No, it's literally a new person every week that I've never seen on the forums, he makes a good point. It is a common train of thought. Futile in this echo chamber, but I can't see it going away. The usual suspects never get tired of shouting it down though.

The only way they can truly stop it is to come up with better ideas that organically pull people into open, or leave those in open feeling less bad about it and/or having a better chance of meeting players organically. And have it implemented by FDev. Totally doable...............

We'll, here's my idea which I think is better than the OP idea:-
Everyone should play in the mode which gives them the greatest enjoyment of the game, on a per-session basis. It's down to every individual to get their choice right.

/Thread.

 

[Dragsham]

Ah shelving. Isnt that what leaves bugs unattended for years? Isn't that what encourages a developer to do nowt.
We're merely discussing options to improve or do the game a disservice depending on your opinions. Discussing gameplay is what a forum is all about

 

[Ydiss]

CGs? I'd just stop doing them if they were Open-only. I guess many others would too; I can't see how that would improve them as community functions.

It's purely the competition ones that, for me, make no sense as they are. But concede that forcing them all open wouldn't improve it for some.

I'd think having some purely open cgs (that you're free to ignore) would be a good experiment. Specifically ones based around war. But that's just my opinion.

 

[aRJay]

They could do solo or pg we wouldn't want it any other way... keep saying it were not asking for anything that alters solo or pg.
Cgs would simply be more lucrative in open only. Devil is in the detail.

Paying me more to do a CG in open is functionally no different from reducing how much I get paid for doing it in any other mode. It just sounds slightly nicer.

 

[[VR] Bulbulunufus]

Well considering the whole modes debate has been around since before the game was released, I think you're wrong.

This isn't an echo chamber at all, there are always people for and against the argument. I think the main issue arises from those requesting it coming from an echo chamber where everyone agrees it's right. It won't go away though, in the same way that other arguments that have been raging since before the game was released won't go away either.

One mode shouldn't have to be made to feel "less bad about it", less bad about what? There's nothing to feel bad about. Incentivising people to play in one mode over another isn't going to improve the chances of meeting people organically because you're just forcing them to meet there in order to not be left out.

The game was designed to be accessible and so people could play it the way they want to play it at the time. The fact that some people in one of the modes don't like it, isn't a reason to change it.

The point is that it's a repeated theme, meaning a substantial number of people spontaneously come to the same view. If it's enough people then it becomes a motivation for change. There clearly is something that grates with a lot of people. The fact that you don't like that it does..., etc., etc.

Fwiw I think the OP's is a lost cause, but it doesn't make the broader underlying issues irrelevant. What would constitute a good change that FDev might implement is another matter, over which we likely have little control.

 

[[VR] Bulbulunufus]

You've got no idea why some players choose Solo or PG.

Personal disclaimer: I've never had a bad experience in Open and I don't find it to be any more dangerous than other modes. There are, though, situations where it wastes my limited gaming time. I therefore use all modes about equally.

No knowledge was asserted. I'm not going on my experiences or yours, but my personal reckoning of the reservations I've come across and what makes sense to me.

 

[[VR] Bulbulunufus]

We'll, here's my idea which I think is better than the OP idea:-
Everyone should play in the mode which gives them the greatest enjoyment of the game, on a per-session basis. It's down to every individual to get their choice right.

/Thread.

Stating truisms helps nothing here.