Issue 6 - "Automated Accounts Influencing BGS and Powerplay": Omission from the Top 20 Issues Report

Vernon

Vernon
I've seen people talk about working as a 5th column to actively open bugs for bugs that aren't theirs so it dilutes the vote for other bugs making theirs more of a priority. The entire voting process is flawed from top to bottom.

So too is the expiration of bugs. It'd be such a nice feature to have "Is this report still valid?" and simply by saying yes, it extends the expiry date. Would be far less onerous than having to re-enter the bug over and over again.

Finally, where a bug has multiple people confirming it, these to me should count towards "confirmation" far more than the votes reaching a particular threshold. Independent reports of the same bug where people have gone to the trouble to search for and report the bug against an existing bug is a waste otherwise IMO.
 

LeoBartlet

LeoBartlet
Vernon said:
I've seen people talk about working as a 5th column to actively open bugs for bugs that aren't theirs so it dilutes the vote for other bugs making theirs more of a priority. The entire voting process is flawed from top to bottom.
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I'd be more surprised if that weren't happening.

You can be there are entire discords dedicated to the task of upvoting particular issues that grind the gears of particular groups. How else can you explain No11 in this months issue tracker?
 

Darth Ender

D
LeoBartlet said:
The thought of you bursting out a mirror with a Kumo burger in one hand and a list of PP proposals in the other is surely enough impetus for Frontier to do something proactive on the PP front.
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It's easier to install noise cancelling speakers in all of the halls and rooms in the fdev building specifically calibrated to respond to anyone saying powerplay and instantly nullifying it. Thereby avoiding the summoning of the demon.

Yea it's expensive. But it'll be a rain-free year in england before any effort to complete powerplay is made. And nobody wants to deal with exorcising rubbernuke again.
 

Florenus

Florenus
Agony_Aunt said:
Hmm.. maybe that could somehow be communicated more clearly then. (sorry, you probably hear this sort of thing a lot).

But then, i can also see people getting salty they their issue was highly voted for but then didn't get worked on, while something with less votes did get worked on.

Really, i see nothing good coming from a visible voting system at least.
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People are doing something and it gives them illusion of being in control.
Issue tracker is a way to make bug reporting customer controlled, freeing Fdev from having to bother with it. I'm sure it gives them some indication of what problems are most noticeable to players, but otherwise in my opinion it's a decoy.
 

antoca

A
Agony_Aunt said:
How about stop treating issues like a popularity contest and instead evaluate reported issues yourselves based on impact/priority/severity?

Never, ever, let users determine in what order things get fixed, and certainly don't make it a popularity contest.
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Now lets talk about democracy and autocracy.
 

Hydrino

Hydrino
Agony_Aunt said:
Welcome news about the botting, but I'm sure you've heard this before. How about stop treating issues like a popularity contest and instead evaluate reported issues yourselves based on impact/priority/severity?

I've never heard of a company before ever leaving it up to the users to decide in what order things get fixed. I spent many years in various IT support roles from helldesk to second and third line support.

The only times where the users could influence our assessments were negative. This was usually something like one of the big bosses, having left his laptop in the sun all day causing it to melt, insists on a priority 1, all hands on deck, drop everything else until its fixed, level of support, and who cares if there were other issues actually affecting the productivity of many people?!

Never, ever, let users determine in what order things get fixed, and certainly don't make it a popularity contest.
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See, this is how FD should treat a future feature subset... i.e. have the suggestions forum moderated fully and treated to bug tracker type rank voting and then having focused feedback forum on the top 1-5 and then coming back to the community with Dev feedback and producer/ David Braben feedback.

Why is this for bugs? I agree it makes no sense except as an indication of maybe how many players are affected.

But for involving the community in the long-term dev of the game, and making the Suggestions Forum actually mean something, yes.

MAKE THE SUGGESTIONS FORUM MATTER.
 

Factabulous

Factabulous
antoca said:
Now lets talk about democracy and autocracy.
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Nurse! Politics!

red card.gif
 

Old Duck

Old Duck
How does one separate a bot account from a CMDR stuck inside all day due to COVID or a snowstorm, doing repetitive things like delivering cargo? Heck, I'd say everyone who gets top 10 in a trade CG are human bots, because that's basically what you need to do (deliver cargo like a bot) in order to win that prized position.

In other words, what precautions will be put in place to not ban actual humans who do repetitive things for long periods of time?

Oh, and I sure hope this doesn't include installing malicious anti-cheat mal software into the Windows subsystem like some companies do, because I actively avoid games that do this, unless that system is really well vetted and only active while the game is running.
 

Agony_Aunt

Agony_Aunt
Darth Ender said:
What would the point be? The game is going to end in just about 2 years from now.

Hashtag Dooooooooooooooooommmmmmm
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LOL.

Nah, ED is going to go for a good while yet, i'm sure. I expect at least one more major DLC will be released. Just hoping it will be full atmospheric planets.
 

Darth Ender

D
Old Duck said:
How does one separate a bot account from a CMDR stuck inside all day due to COVID or a snowstorm, doing repetitive things like delivering cargo? Heck, I'd say everyone who gets top 10 in a trade CG are human bots, because that's basically what you need to do (deliver cargo like a bot) in order to win that prized position.

In other words, what precautions will be put in place to not ban actual humans who do repetitive things for long periods of time?

Oh, and I sure hope this doesn't include installing malicious anti-cheat mal software into the Windows subsystem like some companies do, because I actively avoid games that do this, unless that system is really well vetted and only active while the game is running.
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you make those repetitive grind loops worth very little ...like most open world games do.

Then you layer more complicated mechanics on top that require too much user skill to easily fake with bots.

You may not get 100% of the automated activity out of the game, but you curtail it enough so that it doesn't matter.

But that involves putting thought, creativity and effort into a mechanic and how it fits with the rest of the game, rather than doing whatever requires the least amount of effort to implement or copying and pasting the existing mechanics and swapping out the location. And potentially upsetting players who lack any skill but still want all of the rewards at the same rate as though that have them.
Regardless of which you think actually impacts why we dont see that in this game, it's pretty clear we wont be seeing skill factor into higher level mechanics to mitigate the effectiveness of grind loops. And as long as those are the main (only) ways to play, automation software will be too effective to go away.
 
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