What is it with these thread about PVP.

[Robert Maynard]

I can assure you that I am well aware of the fact that I can choose whether I want to play this game or not. I thought that would be clear.

Crystal. However the ironic aspect of this discussion is that while you feel put upon regarding the "pseudo-mmog" nature of the game (in your opinion), there seems to be a need for others to be put upon by requiring them to be available for PvP (i.e. by removing the group switching feature)....

 

[Spectre Alpha]

Ok I know what PVP is, but I see a lot of whining threads about solo mode and how it will reduce PVP, or how stats should be kept different for solo as they are not really playing the game.
What is it about PVP, is it the fact you are up against a human player, does that mean the AI is weak and does not give a real challenge.
Or is it the fact that some people just like the thought of killing other people in game, they get some sort of buzz from feeling that is pees of the other person.

Me, I've played PVP games and enjoyed them (eVe, BF2, BF3 etc), but it would not matter to me if the people on the receiving end where good AI or real players.
What is it with PVP that makes people demand it and want to identify it above AI kills, if AI skills where the same or better than a human player, would they still want to know.

Are most PVP players who get joy from killing other players repeatedly secret psychopaths acting out in the game world what would get them locked up in the real one.

Solo mode WILL decrease PvP, and PvP as it is now will definitely increase the number of players choosing solo or private mode. If they want to see more players in open there need to be a PvP by choice mode with a PvP flag that can be toggled on and off.

To answer your last question, yes and no, they are people that in real life feel powerless to control their own lives, for the most part.

 

[Han Yolo]

Absolutely. I wouldn't have bought this game if PvP had been compulsory.

Phos.

I am not blaming anyone - I admit that I made a mistake buying this game. I am not accusing, I am merely trying to discuss this weird solo/open play solution FD came up with. why? Because I still fail to see the benefits and the reason why people should play on open-mode other than for PvP or showing off their fancy gear. Maybe if I would see the benefit I would not feel so bad about spending 60bucks for a game that doesn't seem to meet my expectations.

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Crystal. However the ironic aspect of this discussion is that while you feel put upon regarding the "pseudo-mmog" nature of the game (in your opinion), there seems to be a need for others to be put upon by requiring them to be available for PvP (i.e. by removing the group switching feature)....

The even more ironic aspect is that I've already payed the 60bucks

 

[psykokow]

[mod hat off]
It allows people to play the way they want to play. Its quite straight forward, if NOONE wanted Solo, they wouldn't have put it in.

Some people want that feel like the original elite, where they can imagine the npc's and their backstories and play for hours and hours without any real player upsetting their play.
Others desire the solo play, but want to be part of the online world, to contribute to player actions and events without being ganked, or having their games ruined by other players being unsocial or particularly unforgiving.

Others are desperate to team up and get that fun cooperative gameplay going, flying through the cosmos with a group of friends.

Other people genuinely want to hunt out players to steal and kill them in game, some want epic battles.

These modes allow people to play the way they want to play, with players who share that desire.

I say... Lets try it and see how it works out, the brilliant thing about it.... it can adapt.

[/mod hat off]

 

[Toxic_Waster]

Solo mode WILL decrease PvP, and PvP as it is now will definitely increase the number of players choosing solo or private mode. If they want to see more players in open there need to be a PvP by choice mode with a PvP flag that can be toggled on and off.

To answer your last question, yes and no, they are people that in real life feel powerless to control their own lives, for the most part.

Why would you need the PVP flag when you're already provided with the solo mode?

 

[Han Yolo]

*trying super hard now*

 

[Draggin]

Solo mode WILL decrease PvP, and PvP as it is now will definitely increase the number of players choosing solo or private mode. If they want to see more players in open there need to be a PvP by choice mode with a PvP flag that can be toggled on and off.

To answer your last question, yes and no, they are people that in real life feel powerless to control their own lives, for the most part.

SALUTE! Folks!

I beg to question you sir, but where do YOU get the gall to say that solo mode WILL decrease pvp? Unless of course you ARE admitting that most people do not WANT pvp, so they will not be targets sitting there for your EVE mind? I am an EX Eve player, WWII online, WoW, Ultima Online, pretty much you name it pc pvper for 30 years. THIS game is different. You don't like it, get out... that is it. I can go play what type of play when I want where I want. But this is not the place for folks to make this into EVE. YOU will never know how many people are playing solo, and you will never know how many people are playing open. AND you have NO CLUE as to how the population will INCREASE or DECREASE due to YOUR perceived opinions of pvp vs pve will pan out.. Good Luck young one.

SALUTE! and cya in the stars!

CMDR Draggin

Edit: Psykokow sorry you about half ninjad my post. And I hope did not step on any toes here, GJ sir.

 

[Zplintz]

[mod hat off]
It allows people to play the way they want to play. Its quite straight forward, if NOONE wanted Solo, they wouldn't have put it in.

Some people want that feel like the original elite, where they can imagine the npc's and their backstories and play for hours and hours without any real player upsetting their play.
Others desire the solo play, but want to be part of the online world, to contribute to player actions and events without being ganked, or having their games ruined by other players being unsocial or particularly unforgiving.

Others are desperate to team up and get that fun cooperative gameplay going, flying through the cosmos with a group of friends.

Other people genuinely want to hunt out players to steal and kill them in game, some want epic battles.

These modes allow people to play the way they want to play, with players who share that desire.

I say... Lets try it and see how it works out, the brilliant thing about it.... it can adapt.

[/mod hat off]

Top post.

Don't get why people feel they need to force anyone to play solo or mp. Just play the way you want to play.

 

[Han Yolo]

Top post.

Don't get why people feel they need to force anyone to play solo or mp. Just play the way you want to play.

well, having the choice between solo and open is not actually forcing anyone. It just shouldn't transfer the stats in-between imo. That about was my whole point.

 

[Zplintz]

well, having the choice between solo and open is not actually forcing anyone. It just shouldn't transfer the stats in-between imo. That about was my whole point.

Really? What difference do the stats or any perceived unfairness actually make (absolutely none IMO)?

There are people who will play 20 hours + a week and those that will only manage 2-4 if they are lucky - that will (as with most online persistent games) make far more difference then someone switching between solo and MP.

 

[Captain Howdy]

well, having the choice between solo and open is not actually forcing anyone. It just shouldn't transfer the stats in-between imo. That about was my whole point.

This will be abused. The question is to what extent and will this mechanic allow unfair manipulation of the dynamic universe.

 

[Han Yolo]

Really? What difference do the stats or any perceived unfairness actually make (absolutely none IMO)?

There are people who will play 20 hours + a week and those that will only manage 2-4 if they are lucky - that will (as with most online persistent games) make far more difference then someone switching between solo and MP.

Just saying that in an open multiplayer universe, where players have to compete with NPCs AND real players its harder to succeed than in a solo universe where you only have to succeed against NPCs. Imo it's pretty obvious. Getting both mixed up makes the open universe kind of pointless when it comes to competition. And I am not only talking about the occasional PvP fights but merely about the 'succeed in a open world' approach.

 

[psykokow]

This will be abused. The question is to what extent and will this mechanic allow unfair manipulation of the dynamic universe.

[mod hat off]

This absolutely was a very difficult thing for me to get my head around, I was in the DDF giving it 'its not fair if people can jump mode mid battle, or when they are on a mission into an anarchy'
It took listening to Lave Radio to hear them debate it from differing points to help me get my head around it.

The KEY is Play the game your way at your own pace... so 30 mins a day is fine, play in online mode when your friends are about OR you want to tackle a big mission or just for the fun, then jump to solo to play and build your rep. etc etc. How does that impact anyone else in the game.

The answer is simple... It doesn't. You trading up to 300 million credits in offline mode then jumping onto the all group to cause mayhem, means nothing when people can ignore you, or jump to solo to avoid you too.

In the end, all that happens is people get to play happily... happy in their own way, not racing to be elite first (someone will earn that honour). not getting griefed out of playing, not quitting... not putting up with negative experiences..

WIll they never lose a ship? Of course they will, they may even join the all group for big events, and lose ships then, but when they want to, in the way they want.

So the only position that is affected negatively is the group that wants unwilling targets, the group that wants willing fighters will find them in the all group. If people are on a mission and want to bypass the risk of other players... drop to solo online. Or private group...

See all it does is let people play more, longer and happier...

So the PVPers who want PVP... guess what... people in that all group accept the risk and will either evade you Or jump to solo mode to evade you.. either way its fine... you BOTH get to play on... NPC's will make it dangerous for you both, and so on. I don't accept the argument though I understand a 50% full universe is not as rich and exciting as a 90% full (players I mean), however.............. you still get to play. Why should anyone demand people play in online JUST to make them targets? That doesn't sound fun for them or fair.

See how I got totally converted to this accepting way of thinking... and it took me some time.. Ultimately it won't affect your enjoyment, just slightly more NPC than players.

So I now see this issue as quite a good solution to the posibility of greifing...

And I will be in the ALL group, because I relish the chance for a run in, an epic battle... one that leaves you laughing even when dead, that one that has you sweating and swearing with excitement... OH YES PLEASE!!! and also the 'GOD NO I GOTTA GET AWAY' cowardice moments too...

I RELISH That... does that mean EVERYONE should have to play that way... well I AM so happy to say.. NO... NO they don't they can play with me if they want. or not.

[mod hat on]

 

[Seonid]

Don't get why people feel they need to force anyone to play solo or mp. Just play the way you want to play.

Especially as there are already two very large groups that cater to both sides of the PVE and PVP debate, lots of people playing the game as they want to play. Win win.

 

[silverod]

I absolutly hate pvp and its players.always ready to pounce on a new bee,thats why i bought ed so i can play solo.every other pvp game ive bought in the past i have played 3 or 4 times and became to dead to many times by these so called hot shots

 

[bassman]

Really? What difference do the stats or any perceived unfairness actually make (absolutely none IMO)?

There are people who will play 20 hours + a week and those that will only manage 2-4 if they are lucky - that will (as with most online persistent games) make far more difference then someone switching between solo and MP.

I think what most of us pro-open players find a bit hard to swallow is that mode switching can be used to cherry pick encounters. Lets imagine that one of DB's oft quoted idea of opposing escort/assassinate VIP missions is implemented, now imagine that the assassin successfully tracks down the VIP escort, but the escort decides to evade the assassin by logging out and then logging in solo.

I dont have a problem so much with someone "levelling up" solo and then switching to open but I think that some mechanic is needed where a switch to open involves some sort of commitment at least until say you get to the next station.

 

[Spectre Alpha]

SALUTE! Folks!

I beg to question you sir, but where do YOU get the gall to say that solo mode WILL decrease pvp? Unless of course you ARE admitting that most people do not WANT pvp, so they will not be targets sitting there for your EVE mind? I am an EX Eve player, WWII online, WoW, Ultima Online, pretty much you name it pc pvper for 30 years. THIS game is different. You don't like it, get out... that is it. I can go play what type of play when I want where I want. But this is not the place for folks to make this into EVE. YOU will never know how many people are playing solo, and you will never know how many people are playing open. AND you have NO CLUE as to how the population will INCREASE or DECREASE due to YOUR perceived opinions of pvp vs pve will pan out.. Good Luck young one.

SALUTE! and cya in the stars!

CMDR Draggin

Edit: Psykokow sorry you about half ninjad my post. And I hope did not step on any toes here, GJ sir.

wow that is soo wrong it's funny. Any time you give people a choice some will take that option, it's simple really. I don't play pvp, I play co-op. so whatever you are thinking, think again.

 

[Xenith]

I think what most of us pro-open players find a bit hard to swallow is that mode switching can be used to cherry pick encounters.

Well, you will just have to interdict and/or kill them before they can switch. Shouldn't be too hard for a pro.

 

[Seonid]

but I think that some mechanic is needed where a switch to open involves some sort of commitment at least until say you get to the next station.

There was talk (somewhere, sorry can't cite atm) that a mode switch would require you to be docked. Also, we don't know yet what the final answer is on combat disconnects which will play a part.

 

[Unfluffydave]

I think what most of us pro-open players find a bit hard to swallow is that mode switching can be used to cherry pick encounters. Lets imagine that one of DB's oft quoted idea of opposing escort/assassinate VIP missions is implemented, now imagine that the assassin successfully tracks down the VIP escort, but the escort decides to evade the assassin by logging out and then logging in solo.

I dont have a problem so much with someone "levelling up" solo and then switching to open but I think that some mechanic is needed where a switch to open involves some sort of commitment at least until say you get to the next station.

you are making an assumption here that an assassin would be a player character, it could quite easily be an NPC encounter.