Game Discussions Star Citizen Discussion Thread v12

[Skizomeuh]

CIG delusional gamedesigns are as ridiculous as Quantic Dreams vainglory.

"Our mundane micro-activities like taking a dump will be such an epic adventure that the sum of them will make the greatest game experience ever made before. And we will have AAA actors journeying the uncanny valley playing on an inept script, redefining the history of cinematography"

So much similarities between the two studios and their wonky egomaniac.

At least with QD we don't get killed by dropping an object on the floor.

 

[LittleAnt]

What I said is it looks like a yawn-fest. It appears my innocuous post (which was just my throwaway opinion) dropped a bomb in the thread, so I'll explain a little more...

When I look at the SC refueling UI, I see things like "Estimated Time: 3M 31S". I see "Nozzle Controls". I see "flow OUT of pipes". I see other controls and buttons.

Sorry, but the last thing I want in a space game is to micromanage rubbish like this, especially for 3+ minutes. ED gets it right for my gaming preferences (YMMV) - dock at a station and one click to refuel. I'm fully capable of imagining autobots or station staff refueling my ship while I decide my next adventure in the missions screen. Perhaps the SC UI also takes care of ship to ship refueling. I don't know and I don't care. It's not the type of gameplay that excites me, and I believe CIG uses this type of over engineered UI "gameplay" as a crutch to hide their slow development in actual space gameplay.

All I can do is repeat what I said originally... each to their own.

As a trader/fighter/hauler/miner/other, having not to worrying about refueling is a good thing.

But what you look at are the screens from the starfarer side. It's only for the ships dedicated to the refueling profession = fuel rats in ED.

So its another case of someone saying "'it's crap" while not even knowing what he looks at.

 

[LittleAnt]

I see the difference here and where the disagreement is. One game and player is looking at refueling as a "game play loop" in itself.
...
Refueling, in itself, should never be regarded as a "game play loop" because it isn't! Unless of course it's forced on you as the only way to travel around the galaxy, which would be silly!
...
The player to player refueling in Elite is of course an emergency function, you should never need to use it, it's something that's done as a last resort. The game play loop here of course is a long and involved process that requires the services of the fuel rats, the refueling in that process isn't the game play loop, the rescue is the game play loop, and making a long and involved process out of refueling, that could potentially destroy both ships if done wrong, would be silly. The difference is, one is being looked on as a "game play loop", the other process is part of much larger "game play loop".

Wrong and wrong again. You are talking about what I post with no clue what we talk about.

Refueling in SC is a profession with dedicated ship. You buy your fuel to a Starfarer while doing your business, he comes where you are, refuel you and you don't need to go back to the station. It's the same that what you see in the pictures below. Yes he can save you, but that's not its main goal. His main goal is to refuel fighters ships.

The screen you look at are also representative of a gameplay because, for example, you manage the rate of the flow. If you mismanage the flow:
you and the customer loose time
OR
you loose gaz. And the gaz lost is not paid by the customer.

Please, please, do your homework and at least look at the main source of information before analysing.

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=agCAx2l38PQ

 

[varonica]

Wrong and wrong again. You are talking about what I post with no clue what we talk about.

Refueling in SC is a profession with dedicated ship. You buy your fuel to a Starfarer while doing your business, he comes where you are, refuel you and you don't need to go back to the station. It's the same that what you see in the pictures below. Yes he can save you, but that's not its main goal. His main goal is to refuel fighters ships.

View attachment 298186View attachment 298187

The screen you look at are also representative if a gameplay because, for example, you manage the rate of the flow. If you mismanage the flow:
A : you and the customer loose time
B : you loose gaz. And the gaz lost is not paid by the customer.*

Please, please, do your homework and at least look at the main source of information before analysing.

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=agCAx2l38PQ

What are you one about? Refueling in flight in the real world never happens, your example is entirely composed of specialist military equipment. No-one, commercial airlines, private planes, ships at sea, none of them do it. It's not a profession in the real world by any meaning of that word, it's something that's done in an emergency. I've watched the video, it's certainly not a game play loop by any meaning of that term, as for doing my home work, wasn't there a certain person here in this thread who claimed that fuel limpets were magic and passed through anything in the way?

In flight refueling is something that's only done in extreme cases, military and only where there are no aircraft that can do the job in one trip, no commercial planes are equipped to do it, no commercial ships are equipped to do it. Removing fuel from stranded ships is a risky business, these aren't good examples to use to argue the case!

 

[[VR] Merkir]

As a trader/fighter/hauler/miner/other, having not to worrying about refueling is a good thing.

But what you look at are the screens from the starfarer side. It's only for the ships dedicated to the refueling profession = fuel rats in ED.

So its another case of someone saying "'it's crap" while not even knowing what he looks at.

But I didn't say it's crap. I said it's a yawn-fest. That's twice I've had to correct you for doing this. I also mentioned ship to ship refueling. Did you miss it? Here it is again:
"Perhaps the SC UI also takes care of ship to ship refueling. I don't know and I don't care. It's not the type of gameplay that excites me, and I believe CIG uses this type of over engineered UI "gameplay" as a crutch to hide their slow development in actual space gameplay."

But I'll go on... Now that you mention ED, the fuel rats in ED are legendary not because of the ED game mechanics and UI, but because of the vast distances they must sometimes traverse - across the galaxy. I find it ridiculous that ship-to-ship refueling is even a thing in SC given the maximum ~100 systems. Perhaps CIG is giving you a pretty busy-work UI to pretend SC "fuel rats" are in some way special?

Again, just my opinion, YMMV.

 

[metatheurgist]

"Our mundane micro-activities like taking a dump will be such an epic adventure that the sum of them will make the greatest game experience ever made before. And we will have AAA actors journeying the uncanny valley playing on an inept script, redefining the history of cinematography"

Can't wait to see the in-depth behind the scenes of that mocap session.

 

[LittleAnt]

What are you one about? Refueling in flight in the real world never happens, your example is entirely composed of specialist military equipment.

You are perfectly corret. Have you noticed the number of fighters and military ships in SC ?

wasn't there a certain person here in this thread who claimed that fuel limpets were magic and passed through anything in the way?

Have you noticed it was a genuine question and not a statment ?

military and only where there are no aircraft that can do the job in one trip

Every fighters (and perhaps miners) in a lot of places Pyro.

I find it ridiculous that ship-to-ship refueling is even a thing in SC given the maximum ~100 systems

Because in SC, you will be able to run out of fuel just navigating inside the huge+less populated systems. Stanton is small and you need 20 minutes to go from one side of the system to the other. Some guess that it will be at least 40 to 60 min for Pyro.
The duration of travels inside one system in SC is similar to the duration of travel through several systems in ED. The rate of fuel consumption is also not the same in the 2 games. And fuel scoping will be only on the explorer ships and some specific ones. In ED, your manage your fuel on the galaxy scale, in SC your manage your fuel on the system scale.

 

[Viajero]

Please, please, do your homework and at least look at the main source of information before analysing.

That is rich especially coming from someone who constantly compares SC avec ED about which you have demonstrated in multiple occasions that you don’t really do much homework about. We are as frustrated as you.

May I suggest you either do your homework first or stop lecturing other posters to do so?

Alternative you could just discuss SC in the SC thread and try to support it based on its own merits alone. Crazy I know!

 

[LittleAnt]

I think I need to point some important differences between Pyro and Stanton for you to understand what it means for refueling ships.
In a nutshell : Pyro is 3x larger than Stanton and have 24 x less refueling points and this point is pirate owned.

Pyro system	Stanton system
Size : 17 AU	Size : 5 AU
Planets : 6 - planets with refueling option uknown but should be 0	Planets : 4 - planets with refueling option : 4
Space Stations with refueling option : 1 (pirate owned)	Space Stations with refueling option : 20 (1 pirate owned)
Politic : civilized	Politic : pirates

The Pyro system is a desolate, lifeless star system crippled by a prolonged nova phase. It is the home of pirate outpost Ruin Station. The system was first visited in 2493, forty-four years after the first traveller suspected something was there. Original Systems' Arena Commander Dying Star-map is located between Pyro I and Pyro II.[1] Pyro's sun went into a prolonged nova phase long before mankind reached for the stars and little is known of the original makeup of the system. Six burned-out planets remain, none of which are capable of supporting life. Every planet in the system is at some level of decay. Any improperly shielded spacecraft will sustain residual damage from Pyro's star while making transit through the system

That is rich especially coming from someone who constantly compares avec ED about which you have demonstrated in multiple occasions that you don’t really do much homework about.

I do my homework, it was a genuine question because I haven't found the answer on the web...

 

[Viajero]

I do my homework, it was a genuine question because I haven't found the answer on the web...

Playing the game would largely suffice to know one of its most used features.

If you don’t I would suggest you refrain from discussing and comparing ED in game features here. You will not see me often discussing the details of specific SC features for example, for the same reason. It is just fair.

You could even just discuss SC in the SC thread and try to support it based on its own merits alone. Crazy I know!

 

[VR Golgot]

Holy christ, still going…

"Why won’t you agree that this thing that nobody has ever tried, designed for a game space that doesn’t even exist, is the best executed gameplay of its kind?"

It’s genuinely mad.

 

[LittleAnt]

Playing the game would largely suffice to know one of its most used features.
If you don’t I would suggest you refrain from discussing and comparing ED in game features here.

Ho boy, if you want to apply this rule you remove 50% of the posts in this thread as a lot of posts about SC are from guys with no clue how SC works in reality.

 

[LittleAnt]

Holy christ, still going…

"Why won’t you agree that this thing that nobody has ever tried, designed for a game space that doesn’t even exist, is best the executed gameplay of its kind?"

It’s genuinely mad.

Because we are in the SC forum and talking about future features is a valid subject in any gaming forum ?
I explain why I think it will be good and you explain me why I'm completly wrong.

 

[VR Golgot]

If only that were actually how the last ten pages had gone…

I think the more interesting question at this point is: Does SC inspire this level of 'dreamcrafting as fact' proselytising in some backers, or just attract those who are already that way inclined?

 

[LittleAnt]

If only that were actually how the last ten pages had gone…

I think the more interesting question at this point is: Does SC inspire this level of 'dreamcrafting as fact' proselytising in some backers, or just attract those who already that way inclined?

The fact is when I present the future gameplay loop of refueling of SC here, nobody is interested to know how it works. It's not dreamcrafting, it's already in EVO, detailed and showed in ISC and we will test it in the PTU in 2 or 3 weeks.
When I posted the screens of the refueling API, not one reaction like "what this numbers mean ?". Nobody want to know how it works, you and I know why. Because this thread is not about discussing SC but about demolishing SC.

 

[Navigare Necesse Est]

The fact is when I present the future gameplay loop of refueling of SC here, nobody is interested to know how it works. It's not dreamcrafting, it's already in EVO, detailed and showed in ISC and we will test it in the PTU in 2 or 3 weeks.
When I posted the screens of the refueling API, not one reaction like "what this numbers mean ?". Nobody want to know how it works, you and I know why. Because this thread is not about discussing SC but about demolishing SC.

No, it's because we're done listening to your fantasies.

 

[KillaALF]

Because this thread is not about discussing SC but about demolishing SC.

CIG is doing a bang up job of that all by themselves, no outside help needed. 10 years in and they haven't even managed to build the foundation for their "game". By now this is beyond a joke, really.

 

[[VR] Merkir]

Because in SC, you will be able to run out of fuel just navigating inside the huge+less populated systems. Stanton is small and you need 20 minutes to go from one side of the system to the other. Some guess that it will be at least 40 to 60 min for Pyro.
The duration of travels inside one system in SC is similar to the duration of travel through several systems in ED. The rate of fuel consumption is also not the same in the 2 games. And fuel scoping will be only on the explorer ships and some specific ones. In ED, your manage your fuel on the galaxy scale, in SC your manage your fuel on the system scale.

Yes I'm fully aware of that. Again, if ship-to-ship refueling within the (presumably mostly populated) systems of SC is what you like, go right ahead. Use those nozzle controls to level up to Nozzle Master. Come to think of it, they could probably use a similar UI in the ship's toilet.
(I'll see myself out)

 

[VR Golgot]

The fact is when I present the future gameplay loop of refueling of SC here, nobody is interested to know how it works. It's not dreamcrafting, it's already in EVO, detailed and showed in ISC and we will test it in the PTU in 2 or 3 weeks.
When I posted the screens of the refueling API, not one reaction like "what this numbers mean ?". Nobody want to know how it works, you and I know why. Because this thread is not about discussing SC but about demolishing SC.

Plenty of us already know how it’s supposed to work. I skimmed the ISC when it came out.

The reason we haven’t ended up discussing the details with you is:

A) You came into the thread armed for a tribal war about Elite that no one here cares about. You’re like the guy at the school reunion dressed in his Territorial Army fatigues. It’s back away slowly time…

B) Everyone here is bored senseless of CIG’s near decade of hype-over-substance. When it’s in the game, let’s talk in detail…

And on a personal note:

C) I don’t find that particular gameplay mechanic exciting ¯\(ツ)/¯. Totally fine with others liking it, but it ain’t my thing. (But if someone starts arguing that it’s 'objectively' great, not just a thing that they like, that’s a game that I will get involved with )

 

[Viajero]

Ho boy, if you want to apply this rule you remove 50% of the posts in this thread as a lot of posts about SC are from guys with no clue how SC works in reality.

Heh, those are in topic at least. Thing is most of the offtopic and gratuitous comparisons (often ED) brought in this thread comes from you or other Star Citizen supporters. Would be great if you just stop the gratuitous offtopic, but if you don’t and decide to discuss specific off topic in game features at least have the decency to do proper homework before pointing your finger to others?