THAT'S BRILLIANT! Why has no one thought of this before?! One thing though? I go to a remote station, it has a sidewinder and nothing but a few lasers in stock. But if I pay a small "transfer fee" it can generate me a Class A conda? Brilliant!
2.2's Instant Ship and Module Transport - Yay or Nay?
- Thread starter Kintch
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THAT'S BRILLIANT! Why has no one thought of this before?! One thing though? I go to a remote station, it has a sidewinder and nothing but a few lasers in stock. But if I pay a small "transfer fee" it can generate me a Class A conda? Brilliant!
One for immersion! Ok, that's understandable. Basically same as i'm saying then, its simply a preference thing, and you are not trying to claim the apocalypse will arrive if it is implemented with no delay.
This isn't true and I think you are wrong. The cost to move a ship can outweigh the savings of buying all the parts in a discount system. The cost to move a ship could outweigh the rewards for doing the activity you want the ship for. Making it take time wouldn't fix either of those problems anyway so you are just wrong about everything.
To me consistency within the game is an issue here. If you call it technological, lore or game world consistency is irrelevant.
ED is set within a game world where certain rules have been laid out. Some of these are clearly inconsistent when compared to our current knowledge and understanding of technology.
But we do have things like AI being forbidden, artificial gravity does not exist, tractor beams do not exist and much more. The issue I have (and it has to do with technology as it is laid out and described in ED) is that teleportation does not exist in the ED universe and instant ship transfers breaks that rule. In addition to this comes all the potential exploits (remains to be seen though).
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Money is not an object for some people. As someone previously stated. This is literally giving them a long range Hauler that can transform into any ship once it docks at a station.
Come on, I see you attacking this strawman over and over again. Can you please accept that that will not be the case with a proposed time delay so we can get to discussing real issues?
For me yes. Or at least a consistent universe I can believe is real. This change stretches my credulity to breaking point.
ED does that exceedingly well so far.
It's one of the most "casual friendly" games on the market, since you can split f.ex. a 20 hour "epic" journey to jaque's into small 1 hour portions. It might take 7 weeks to get there instead of my 10 days, but it's completely feasible.
You can also wing up with your vulture and your friends Anaconda and the vulture will not be a complete fail, like grouping a max level MMO character with a low level one.
You can also contribute to a CG at a very low level, still be recognized as contributer, feel some small accomplishment when it's finished, participate in the overall story arc ...
It's really a solid design.
This galaxy in lore doesn't though. Only in game. By the same token, there is no teleportation in lore, but if this goes ahead, there will be in game.
In other words, we are showing there is a disconnect between a central aspect of the game and the lore (and not the only one).
The reason being, FD think, at least so far, that instant ship transfer is a plus to gameplay. Now, ask them if they think players teleporting all over the place is a good idea, and they will probably say no.
In other words, its gameplay design decision, it has nothing to do with lore. You might disagree with their decisions, just don't try and use lore as the central point of your arguments (not sure you have done this, but some people have).
Sure, but why get picky on this one, and not on visible lasers or instant cargo loading. Some are inconsistant in their desire for consistancy, which makes their argument really weak in my eyes.
More like a justification for "I don't like it".
If your bag of tactics includes stowing weapons and making a speedy high-wake to the nearest system then yes, it offers an advantage. Not a huge one, but definitely non-zero. And in the meta all those non-zeroes quickly add up.
But the amount of time they have to wait (assuming anything even remotely sensible) is irrelevant to your argument. The "balance" is broken regardless if you have to wait 5 seconds or 5 hours, you can still transform your ship into any other ship and you still have no need to fit good FSD to those ships. So are you against the whole feature?
For exactly the same reason as that particular line in the sand went the way of gameplay. Describing (having) a battle with Newtonian physics would be ridiculous. But those same books that conveniently ignore those mechanics will try to offer a decent mechanism for moving a lump of mass from one place to another.
What if its not a case of ships being physically moved just exchanged ?
Wolf 397
I have a cobra here
Merope
I am here
I pay for my cobra to be "moved"
They keep my cobra in Wolf 397
I take their cobra from 379
Would actually make sense, its a business i would start if i had money and this was real
As explained previously this is not possible since we can use engineered custom ships
If money is no object then what does it matter? You're still wrong. What are you worried is going to happen? Oh no someone has a ship! Oh no they didn't have to fly the ship and they have the ship! Help! Help! Someone has a ship!
I see. Well in that case I'll make a distinction between the Elite lore and this game's lore. Because it breaks the latter. To be honest, I am sure it will be balanced in a way to prevent abuse. I just hope that it is really rare and does not give people the magical Hauler that it does as a concept without constraints. I will not like it either way.
I think you underestimate your ability to stretch credulity. It seems like a big issue right now, but compared to everything you're already accepting it's a fairly minor thing.
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I can't think of any of the official fiction books which mention top speeds of ships mentioned either
There again, i've only read Reclamation. However, the descriptions they have of space flight in it, certainly seem to indicate its newtonian. I don't recall anything in there that would indicate it wasn't, and even more to the point, i can't believe FD would have anything in the lore that would actually state that speeds in space were limited.
If you do know of anything like this, let me know, and i'll eat my... erm... anything that is edible.
There's three "core" issues, and they all center around the concept of ship transit as a concept, as opposed to putting any form of delay on ship transit -
First and foremost, it cuts down busywork because you no longer need lots of little ships to move big ships around, instead you press a button once you get your fastest ship where you want to be and you can now bring your most suitable ship to the party as opposed to finding out where your most suitable ship is, flying a vessel over, going to collect it and THEN flying where you want to go. For this specific purpose, InstaWarp is pure win, it wipes out a lot of needless travel grind and thus far the best defense I've seen is summed up in THIS image!
http://goo.gl/q1Nuom
Then there's the people worried about exploits, such as refitting high grade combat ships with junk FSD's and using W-asps (Warp-Asps) or Taxicondas or what have you, and minmaxing their combat ships, thus upsetting the meta and reducing the number of ships seen in combat, the answer to that is "Eh, not really", at the high end the same ships will still dominate, and it'll just mean people adjust their loadouts accordingly. Now you don't have to plan around jump drives or fuel scoops, so instead of packing granola bars and bottles of spring water, you'll take beer and dope (ammo). The people who argue that ships which aren't even configured in such a way that they'd even get to Jacques appearing, eh, suck it up buttercup, your little safe haven might not be quite so safe anymore, as people say, it's called "Elite : Dangerous" not "Elite : Peaceful", so you might get a bunch of skrillex riders drop in with pimped out ships, so? Arm up and shoot them, THAT'S WHAT GUNS ARE FOR!
Then we get to category three, I like to call these people the wilfully blind. They're the ones who defend everything that benefits them, but despise everything that benefits anyone else. They'll swing for the fences when it comes to Engineers "Because it's part of the narrative" despite the Engineers being mechanically the most broken, soul destroying piece of garbage that ever got foisted on a game, because they've persevered and now they've managed to luck out they're in a position to say "Got mine screw you", but the moment that their advantages start getting whittled away, well, we get threadnaughts like this. They act only out of self interest, and should be entirely disregarded.
Instant ships(tm) would not break the game as they won't transport cargo, nor would they allow pilots to warp THEMSELVES anywhere, they just save on the busy work of moving lots of little ships around to get big ships where they need to be. At BEST they save traders a chunk of a run, but based on the cost that might actually not work out that profitable if they have to repeat that trick (because remember, they'll have to pay to Warp that Asp back to the start point if they want to do it again).
So many of these so called exploits are not properly considered in their entirety, they're just blind yelling about the sky falling down and well, it doesn't stand up to scrutiny.
One for immersion! Ok, that's understandable. Basically same as i'm saying then, its simply a preference thing, and you are not trying to claim the apocalypse will arrive if it is implemented with no delay.
No. No apocalypse. I did post earlier on that it will likely be something I'll just have to sigh, accept, and pretend isn't there... like The Engineers.
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