<45fps in Resource sites.

[X-Terminator]

I'm only wondering whether you're after something that is not possible. Most players report <45 fps around RES & inside Stations and some stutter when exiting to Stations. I have had these also but things got much better since using a Powerline Adapter to gain all my fibre speed instead of 1/4 speed on WiFi. There's less stutter if any now exiting to Stations and the Asteroids load fast and only stutter for 5secs. Although fps may still drop it really is not any issue. At times I find you can get too focused on a problem and it preys on your mind. Just perhaps a better network could be the issue. IPv6 is coming in BETA so this may help matters.

 

[TorTorden_VR]

I'm only wondering whether you're after something that is not possible. Most players report <45 fps around RES & inside Stations and some stutter when exiting to Stations. I have had these also but things got much better since using a Powerline Adapter to gain all my fibre speed instead of 1/4 speed on WiFi. There's less stutter if any now exiting to Stations and the Asteroids load fast and only stutter for 5secs.

Although fps may still drop it really is not any issue. At times I find you can get too focused on a problem and it preys on your mind. Just perhaps a better network could be the issue. IPv6 is coming in BETA so this may help matters.

Your first statement pretty much nails it.
I might just want far more than anything can actually get me.
Basically what I want is to set all settings to high/ultra, and hmd quality to 1.25.
Well apart from AA and ambient occlusion.

And never go below 90.....
I might be asking a bit much.
Maybe a Volta ti?
Couple of years from now?

As for stutter/judder.
I actually don't have a lot of that, and I agree, networking is quite important for ED, suprisingly so for many.

As for me, I'm hardwired on a gigabit LAN to my 300/300 mb/s FIOS.
So I get very rarely any stutter/judder entering stations
It's almost to the point where my download speeds equate the write speed on some of my older disks....

Hmm, if I could get all I can get out of my hardware by just upgrading my cpu I could give that a whirl, and of course report any changes.

But seems wasteful to spend £350 if I'm replacing the entire rig inside a year.
But if I don't need to, well, that's a lot of money saved.

Or I end up with two quite vr capable rigs, and I do have both the rift and a Vive, but since 99% gaming time is spent in elite, and the rift is better for that so I don't use the vive as much as I would like.

Yeah, VR has made me a little nuts...

 

[X-Terminator]

I did find AA was best set at FXAA else the jagged cockpit lines are too bad. It really doesn't need any higher than this.
Ambient Occlusion is best OFF as there are few times when 2 objects are that close. I also found out that it worked more efficiently on the highest Ultra settings for everything but did need SS at 1.0 as though any other lesser settings held back the push of the card. Shadows are just not that great at even Medium so Low was totally fine and this has quite an impact on resources.

 

[TorTorden_VR]

I believe, unless ed has adjusted it in a patch i havent caught, both ambient occlusion and aa set to entirely off.
I'm constantly looking around at of angled anyway so it doesn't really bother me.

I did just now find an i7 4690k marked as demo, for about £250, so about £120 less than completely new, but it's still at least under store warranties etc so chalk that one up as a win.

So that's all I'm doing for the moment, swapping cpu.

 

[TorTorden_VR]

Had some time to test some more now, and I had the idea of setting up an OBS scene capturing the game window, hwmon and sinec I had room, Taskman's service list so I can see what each service is doing what.

And,, I actually couldn't reproduce my 'problem'.
And I know OBS use cpu (but I am encoding with nvenc so it is minimised).

Even though this was what I would consider a pretty great session I didn't get any real chop.
Most of those "horrible" fps encounters are done in large wings with lot's of SLF's etc etc as well.
And my wingmates aren't on tonight.

But the video keep showing me stuff like this.

Notice how CPU seem to be running about 30% higher than my GPU utilization.
And that's what I consider well enough, it can and goes worse, but yeah I wasn't able to recreate that.


Forget the min\max numbers, they where from loading and menu, which was running at 300fps before I put my rift on.

I might not be entirely barking up the right tree, but I think I'm in the right woods.

Will be interesting to see how a similiar (albeit unscientific test) will go once I get the new i7

 

[[HJ]-RedRaven]

This is just wrong. If that were the case, 4 core CPUs couldn't handle VR at all. Physics, audio, AI, the main game loop for example are calculated once.

@B1rdy - I said "the cpu load is double for the rendering portion of the stereo viewpoints" - which is a large chunk of the cpu work for ED's threads. Physics, AI is minimal. Main game loop and networking is tiny. Sound while good is simplistic too (the sampling is excellent). But doubling the render geometry load in VR can be enough to put lower-end cpus in trouble. The i5's have smaller cache memory, one thread per core and often, lower clock speeds in default setups, all this can contribute to stutter, and dropped frames.

Windows Task manager is very basic. Yes it's nice for a general view. But if you have the Oculus Debug Tool, with its various HUDs and figures on-th-fly, you can get a much better idea of the application-specific performance. Its not for everyone - Oculus developed the Debug Tool for developers. But it is much, much better than using Task manager, as it is monitoring the application calls and oculus driver timing, without any other Windows

Agree on the M2/PCI-e drives... but having Windows start up in 5-6 seconds is nice. You're right, it doesn't add anything to the frame rate, but you'll see less loading time and less load on sight judder when it loads a planet texture etc, so there are some in-game advantages. But not much over a nomal SSD.

We might see some decent performance gains when the new Win10 build ships, with its game-focussed mode. We'll see.

 

[[HJ]-RedRaven]

Most of those "horrible" fps encounters are done in large wings with lot's of SLF's etc etc as well.
And my wingmates aren't on tonight.

But the video keep showing me stuff like this.

http://i.imgur.com/mg2gDyO.png

Notice how CPU seem to be running about 30% higher than my GPU utilization.
And that's what I consider well enough, it can and goes worse, but yeah I wasn't able to recreate that.

With wingmates adding to network load, you may see more judder through updates to the game state coming through the network (whomever in your wing is actually the 'game server')

Plus the obvious extra geometry load due to frindly ships and SLF's.

Your gpu load is generally lower in VR than it is in 2D. In 2d, there's only one viewpoint, and no tracking. But more importantly there's no fixed draw deadlines to meet set by SteamVR or Oculus run-time. In 2D you just render as fast as you can, and update the frame buffer with a completed frame when its done. When the screen/monitor refreshes, it just gets that latest frame. AND, most monitors are only showing 60fps.

But in VR, the need for tracking etc adds the necessity for timers and deadlines. If the render isn't completed, you must leave enough time to complete an ATW or ASW synthetic frame so the VR user doesn't feel disoriented. This is made harder due to the forced 90fps we have for the Rift and Vive. Missed deadlines, ATW and ASW all mean little bits of idle time creep in, even though its a higher-load application.
The overall load on the gpu is less, but more tightly controlled by the driver.

I'd expect when ASW kicks in and framerate drops to 45fps, the cpu load should reduce a bit, and the gpu load will go up a bit (probably depends on the scene).

We should see significant advances in driver and application control of VR hardware in the future... we will need it because Jensen Huang at nVidia and AMD won't be able to double or quadruple the power of a GTX1080Ti any time soon. And we need more power for higher resolutions and extended fields of view. - even with foveated rendering.

 

[Gortron]

I just posted this on another thread but it was I originally did it to help out with this one but never got around to posting it. Here it is so sorry for the sort of double post:

Ok so I did a fairly detailed test on this last weekend...

VR ultra setting but SS1.0 HMD 1.25, Ambient occlusion low, FXAA and high shadows (I think)

i5 4670k @4.3Ghz
16Gb Corsair DDR3 @ 1600Mhz
EVGA GTX 1080 FTW
Asus Z97-Pro Gamer

ASW switched off

Docked in station hanger
ED CPU: 60 to ~84%
CPU overall 72% - 100%
Ram 6.1/15.9

FPS Mostly 87- 90 very rare drops to 54

Fuel scooping
ED CPU: ~51%
Oculus service CPU: ~8 %
CPU overall ~63%
Ram 6.2/15.9

FPS 90

High RES
ED CPU: ~65%
Oculus service CPU: ~8 %
CPU overall ~77%
Ram 6.3/15.9

FPS 90

Sat on outpost landing pad
ED CPU: ~51%
Oculus service CPU: ~8 %
CPU overall ~64%
FPS 90

Morgan Depot Landing Pad 5
CPU up to 93%
Ram 6.8/15.9
FPS 61 – 90 (normally ~80)
FPS very variable especially low when looking at Starport towers.

Conflict Zone High
(Difficult to get much because I kept being attacked)
CPU Pegged at 100% ED 90%+
FPS 90 much of the time but also had moments hovering ~80%

VR MARK

Orange room: 9071
Avg FPS: 197.5

Blue room: 2400
Avg FPS: 52.31

3DMARK Fire Stike (for high performance PC’s)
Overall score : 15955
Graphics Score: 23250
Physics score: 8603
Combined score: 7704
Graphics test 1 FPS: 112.86
Graphics test 2 FPS: 91.54

 

[TorTorden_VR]

That is some serious effort Gort I would rep twice if I could.

I have kind of forgotten to update this.

What has happened is I have replaced my i5 4670k with an i7 4970k.
And it was a definite improvement, I can at least dial up a little on quality settings.
And utilise the gpu a little more.
Still using the 980ti.

I get more instance of 90 fps where ASW would trigger before.
I suppose I still need it, but the cases before where I would drop even lower than 45 has somewhat disappeared completely.

Cpu peak during play has gone from 99-100% to just under 80% peak.
This was not the norm like before, could have been some jump between systems loading or something like that.

Funnily It seems core 2 is taxed more than the others, the rest of my cpu is rarely breaking 60%, again I suspect this to be a witchspace load.
And I have reset my windows install.

Basically I conclude with something we kind of know already.
Cpu matters in VR, not as much as gpu does, but it matters.
And quite possibly, for Elite in VR a 4 series i5 might not be entirely up to it.

And anyone who says they run 90 always with a 980 at ultra has been running the sothis/ceos loop a few times to many.

And now I'm trying really hard not to buy a 1080ti....

 

[TheChafing]

I'm seeing the same thing. I haven't noticed sub-45 FPS, but with 5820K, I'm seeing a lot of places where 90FPS apparently isn't doable.

The game is playable for me, but my OCD desperately wants a stable 90FPS. About the only thing that might be an upgrade, though, is a 7700K, and I'm not convinced that's $500+ worth of better to justify the upgrade.

 

[Gortron]

That is some serious effort Gort I would rep twice if I could.

I have kind of forgotten to update this.

What has happened is I have replaced my i5 4670k with an i7 4970k.
And it was a definite improvement, I can at least dial up a little on quality settings.
And utilise the gpu a little more.
Still using the 980ti.

I get more instance of 90 fps where ASW would trigger before.
I suppose I still need it, but the cases before where I would drop even lower than 45 has somewhat disappeared completely.

Cpu peak during play has gone from 99-100% to just under 80% peak.
This was not the norm like before, could have been some jump between systems loading or something like that.

Funnily It seems core 2 is taxed more than the others, the rest of my cpu is rarely breaking 60%, again I suspect this to be a witchspace load.
And I have reset my windows install.

Basically I conclude with something we kind of know already.
Cpu matters in VR, not as much as gpu does, but it matters.
And quite possibly, for Elite in VR a 4 series i5 might not be entirely up to it.

And anyone who says they run 90 always with a 980 at ultra has been running the sothis/ceos loop a few times to many.

And now I'm trying really hard not to buy a 1080ti....

Switching to a i7 4970k was exactly what I was going to do but because it is discontinued it cost more than a 7700k when I was looking. Didn't want to risk spending that much on a sideways step in case it didn't work.

Glad it's worked out for you. Am half considering it again as there are a few on eBay for around £300. It is that or wait for the GTX 2080Ti and do the CPU the same time in a year or so..... this VR lark is knocking my bank balance about something chronic!!!

 

[TorTorden_VR]

Switching to a i7 4970k was exactly what I was going to do but because it is discontinued it cost more than a 7700k when I was looking. Didn't want to risk spending that much on a sideways step in case it didn't work.

Glad it's worked out for you. Am half considering it again as there are a few on eBay for around £300. It is that or wait for the GTX 2080Ti and do the CPU the same time in a year or so..... this VR lark is knocking my bank balance about something chronic!!!

Tell me about it.
Even after doing this, I am still tempted to jump into a brand new kaby lake build, that somehow would have ended up costing just under $3000..
Ummmm no...


I'm now fairly sure I'm getting what I can get out of the 980ti.
And no, I certainly wouldn't have like to overpayed for this and I found a refurb unit I jumped on.
Propbably used in a in store\test bench or something for 300.
Just missing the fan.
That's fine, the stock intel coolers are kind of like Ikea furniture, you cant put them together twice anyways.

But it doesn't help when I read articles from Roadtovr, I think, that was basically saying the difference between a 980ti and 1080ti was almost a full 100% performance increase...

Update:
Found it.

Existing owners of a GTX 980ti face the proposition of gaining up to and beyond a 100% uplift in standard gaming performance should they upgrade to the 1080ti. But the 1080ti also offers up tantalising and tangible experiential benefits for virtual reality enthusiasts. Yes our tests here are intentionally over the top, at anything over 1.8x supersampling levels, your experience will be limited by the VR headset panels and not the rendered image. But, the ability to push VR titles at these resolutions, achieving in many cases a fully-rendered (i.e. with no need for reprojection and ASW) 90FPS mean your investment will very likely see you through to the next generation of VR headsets and beyond.
-RoadtoVR, in the bottom of the conclusion section.

Yes, statements like this doesn't help my willpower, or bank balance any...

 

[Strangepork]

Might as well put this first.
My hardware is currently is from 2014, apart from the gpu that was an upgrade around christmas 2016.
Rift.
980ti,
i5 4670k @ stock.
16gb ddr3 @ 1600mhz

I have been doing some thinking, and then a little bit of obsessing, but I have not been able to get what I would consider stable and good performance in my Rift during combat.

This is not new, it's basically been like this since I started on VR, and the Rift seem a bit more optimized than the Vive.

And I have mostly been saying to myself 'Yup VR is first gen, we will need more hardware power and optimisation before it gets good' But I have a 980ti.

It should be able to do a little more than 45 fps in combat, and I just tested, regardless of ASW or not, it drops as low, and even below the 45 fps mark even if ASW is disabled.

And if the amount of npc's drop or things calm down, I can see fps in the high 70's or more.
Graphics quality settings doesn't really do much either, currently running at medium, and supersampling and HMD quality at 1. No AA.

in supercruise, I get 90.
I get 90 or just about inside stations, unless it's also a busy instance with lots of npc's, but Resource sites, or just busy combat or on planets I start to struggle a bit.

My current working theory is the npc AI and my cpu is holding me back a bit.
I have been peeking through my nose gap at HWmon (I use CPUID HWMonitor) And I see some cores, mostly all of them, reach 80-90% utilization, then ASW kicks in and they drop to 60%.

It might just be me fooling myself, but doing things like shutting down the running AV shields, and other not really used programs seem to smooth some things out.

And in game, things like deploying SLF has an impact.
Another thing that seems to impact me is wingmen, if I have just one or two wingmen in instance I can be fine, but add a fourth and things can get real shaky when the bullets and lasers are flying.

I have tried over clocking the cpu before, but didn't really do anything.

So at the current moment I believe I am being throttled by my CPU (and possibly my slow RAM).
The fact that makes me feel rather certain on this is I see my cpu cores utilization reach about 90%, then ASW kicks in.

This new notion, and the hype around Ryzen has me thinking.
Due to VR I have been considering a new build, but I don't believe the performance gap between a 980ti and a 1080 is worth the cost.

I was hoping to at least get to next series on this card, but if it is the rest of my PC that's keeping me back.....

The thought I am having now is to maybe get a Ryzen build, keep the 980ti, and upgrade to a 2080/1180 (depending on what Nvidia decides to name it) when they release.

Currently looking at this build, but as always I really shouldn't spend the money.
But then again I don't have a SO to complain about why we have been eating oatmeal for a month...

CPU - AMD AM4 RYZEN 7 1800X 8-core
CPU cooler - Cooler Master Hyper TX3 Evo CPU cooler (It's included in the upgrade package)
Motherboard -ASUS AM4 CROSSHAIR VI HERO
RAM - 2x(32GB total) Crucial Ballistix Sport DDR4 16GB
Case - Fractal Design Define R5 Sort
OS - Microsoft Windows 10 Home, (USB drive)
PSU - Corsair CX750M, 750W PSU (ATX 12V V2.3, 80 Plus Bronze, Semi-Modular. 4x 6+2pin PCIe, 8x SATA, 6x Molex
Disk 1,2 - Kingston SSDNow UV400 240GB 2.5" SSD OEM (one for OS, one for games)
Disk 3 - Seagate Barracuda 3TB 3.5'' HDD (big storage)

Would run me about €2k.

Thoughts, comments, or opinions ?

I'm locked at 37.5 FPS with an Oculus at stations, anyone else experiencing this?

 

[TorTorden_VR]

I'm locked at 37.5 FPS with an Oculus at stations, anyone else experiencing this?

Seems a bit low.
Just to clarify is that a cv1 or a dk2?

The dk2 is 75hz isn't it, and then that number would track as being 50% and spacewarp engaged.

Have tried pressing ctrl + num pad 1 for about a second

This should disable ASW and push as high as you can.
Or you can use the debug tool to disable spacewarp.

 

[TorTorden_VR]

Felt up for some further poking.
These are my current settings.

Spoiler

And here is my first attempt at doing some FcatVR capturing.
(http://www.geforce.com/hardware/technology/fcat)

Spoiler

This was from me basically looping around the station a few times.
Part of me is ambivalent,
First things first, I have virtually no headroom.
My unconstrained fps is at 99.7.
Average delivered FPS at 87.5

And I'm _Thinking ASW isn't the problem, but the lag spikes. those are basically running my render time from 10ms to nearly 30ms, and that's no good.
I'l try doing some more tests.

Did another run.
With these settings:

Spoiler

And new fcat graph.
Quite wide, might want to open seperately.

Spoiler

Clearly these are in uncontrolled game, just me looping around the outside of a station.
So can't really say much outside of a general opinion.
Also.
Gpu load peaked at 91%
CPU at 76%

 

[Milopapa]

Sorry to necro the thread but I finally managed to hit 90fps in a RES for about 95% of the time.
What it took:

i7-3770K @ 4.6GHz
1080 Ti @ GPU: 2025 / Mem: 1488MHz
SteamVR SS: 1.3
HMD Quality, in-game SS: 1.0
All other ingame gfx settings mostly low (textures high)
async reprojection: OFF
interleaved reprojection: OFF
always-on reprojection: ON

It does go into stutter occasionally (haven't figured it out when exactly, mostly when there are a lot of ships around)

 

[TorTorden_VR]

No apology needed.
Kind of confirms it as far as I'm concerned.
Resource sites are a bit poorly optimised still, and we need to brute force it.

A 1080ti is a reasonable start, but maybe not a full cigar just yet.
it's awfully tempting to get something better though since atm I can just barely play in resource sites after 2.3.