A Guide to Minor Factions and the Background Sim
- Thread starter Walt Kerman
- Start date
Should be one day faster than that since you're beyond the minimum duration.
D+1 : exceed 15% difference, asset ownership should change, War state is still shown as active
D+2 : War state is no longer active
But I would wait the extra day in your schedule before reporting it as a bug
Have any other player factions encountered the minor faction displacement mechanics yet?
--
It seemed that any faction displaced from their home system by an expansion would send an escaped 'remnant' directly to the origin of the expansion, which is absurd enough. Note that this isn't because of any war or even struggle and no humans are being transferred. It is somehow because if a political group lose all influence somewhere they automatically reappear somewhere else. Or something. Also, the minor faction was displaced because of the limit on minor factions, which is then ignored when it flees, so that if it was displaced from a five faction system it can cause a six faction system when it reappears. Why?
--
This seems very poor logic. However, the mechanic also affects any minor faction colonies, so that any expansion of a faction will never be eliminated either. If a colony is unsuccessful it rematerialises somewhere else, as if when New York was no longer Dutch the Dutch had been compensated by Devon adopting Dutch culture.
--
Is there an example of a minor faction being displaced without this issue?
--
It seemed that any faction displaced from their home system by an expansion would send an escaped 'remnant' directly to the origin of the expansion, which is absurd enough. Note that this isn't because of any war or even struggle and no humans are being transferred. It is somehow because if a political group lose all influence somewhere they automatically reappear somewhere else. Or something. Also, the minor faction was displaced because of the limit on minor factions, which is then ignored when it flees, so that if it was displaced from a five faction system it can cause a six faction system when it reappears. Why?
--
This seems very poor logic. However, the mechanic also affects any minor faction colonies, so that any expansion of a faction will never be eliminated either. If a colony is unsuccessful it rematerialises somewhere else, as if when New York was no longer Dutch the Dutch had been compensated by Devon adopting Dutch culture.
--
Is there an example of a minor faction being displaced without this issue?
Data point:
We won an election where only two planetary outposts were up for grabs. One had a commodities market, the other did not. We took the one that did not. I was suprised a bit, as I thought you take 'the most valuable asset', and so I thought we'd take the one with the comm market. Ah well.
There is also a Orbis in the system, but it's owned by a third faction.
Inf levels at tick when outpost ownership was transferred: Us, 11. Them, 4.
Now we are waiting for the election state to go into cooldown before proceeding to take the other outpost.
We won an election where only two planetary outposts were up for grabs. One had a commodities market, the other did not. We took the one that did not. I was suprised a bit, as I thought you take 'the most valuable asset', and so I thought we'd take the one with the comm market. Ah well.
There is also a Orbis in the system, but it's owned by a third faction.
Inf levels at tick when outpost ownership was transferred: Us, 11. Them, 4.
Now we are waiting for the election state to go into cooldown before proceeding to take the other outpost.
Yes, we've encountered it plenty since 1.4 and agree it is totally illogical. QA has confirmed it's working as intended and has dodged all questions about the absurdity of the result.
And no, we have never seen a faction displaced that didn't end up in the expansion source system. I've said it before in this thread, but I think the reason has to do with not leaving open bounties / missions / bonds for the displaced minor faction that could cause client side issues if the faction was gone completely.
But just like everything else that doesn't make sense with the background sim, all we can do is understand the mechanic and determine the best way to use it to our advantage.
Yesterday we experienced a strange situation in Alrai.
We allready had 8 factions in Alrai.
An other faction expanded to Alrai.
Two foreign factions disapeared from Alrai during this process. I was not able to find them. They were not placed into the homesystem of the expanding faction.
We allready had 8 factions in Alrai.
An other faction expanded to Alrai.
Two foreign factions disapeared from Alrai during this process. I was not able to find them. They were not placed into the homesystem of the expanding faction.
dynamicbob
Banned
those vanished factions out of alrai could have been pushed up to 50ly away in any direction u may need to begin digging
Yeah !
Today we take control the outpost.
As you said, the war should end tomorrow.
It's possible to win a war with no CZ
!Just missions.
Can you tell us what the new Alrai minor faction and the displaced factions are called? It is not necessary for a multi-system faction to expand from its home system.
--
It seems possible that a minor faction would not be displaced into a system where it existed already. You could have a sort of Tower of Babel of many factions, used as an expansion system to eliminate minor factions rather than displace them.
--
However this sort of scheme has little relevance to plausibility, it is just a response to a ridiculous mechanic. I have to wonder what sort of rationale there is for the displacement of minor factions. Or for the daily influence system itself, it has no obvious origin. Governments have a monopoly of force, and do not allow armed factions to fight civil wars within their territory, or permit alternative legal regimes. Perhaps we will get answers from the BGS segment of Thursday's question sessions.
--
If these displacements are really as intended, perhaps there will also come a time when this multiplication of minor factions is recognised as a problem, and the apprentice is forced to hand back the design hat to the sorcerer, who will quell the flood.
--
It seems possible that a minor faction would not be displaced into a system where it existed already. You could have a sort of Tower of Babel of many factions, used as an expansion system to eliminate minor factions rather than displace them.
--
However this sort of scheme has little relevance to plausibility, it is just a response to a ridiculous mechanic. I have to wonder what sort of rationale there is for the displacement of minor factions. Or for the daily influence system itself, it has no obvious origin. Governments have a monopoly of force, and do not allow armed factions to fight civil wars within their territory, or permit alternative legal regimes. Perhaps we will get answers from the BGS segment of Thursday's question sessions.
--
If these displacements are really as intended, perhaps there will also come a time when this multiplication of minor factions is recognised as a problem, and the apprentice is forced to hand back the design hat to the sorcerer, who will quell the flood.
Hyperion Star Alliance ( a playerfaction from Hyperion ) expanded from Hyperion to Alrai on March the 15th.
Wolf 46 Purple Brotherhood and LP 7-226 Creative Network were displaced.
LP 7-226 Creative Network expanded from LP 7-226 to Alrai on January the 12th.
Wolf 46 Purple Brotherhood was displaced on February the 14th from Wolf 46 to Alrai during our ( Blood Brothers from Alrai ) expansion to Wolf 46.
Wolf 46 Purple Brotherhood and LP 7-226 Creative Network were displaced.
LP 7-226 Creative Network expanded from LP 7-226 to Alrai on January the 12th.
Wolf 46 Purple Brotherhood was displaced on February the 14th from Wolf 46 to Alrai during our ( Blood Brothers from Alrai ) expansion to Wolf 46.
We had this happen just today. Our group expanded into a system that was not our target. I have NO idea why or how we wound up there, but hours of analysis and recon work to fill in the 30 Ly "Bubble" around our home (where the Expansion was triggered) system went out the window.
1. The only system with less than 5 factions was 29.6 Ly away. It has 4 factions, and was designated the primary target. We did not go there.
2. The system 6 Ly away has 5 factions (closest with least number within 30 Ly) and we didn't go there...
3. We went to a system that had 6 factions and we bumped out one that came into our home system (which now has 7 factions). Yet they do not even have a presence in their own home system, which is 38 Ly from our system. (Their home system has only 5 factions, so how did they get bumped out of there?)
None of this made any sense to us, but we are ECSTATIC over the system we wound up in. So we're not going to complain. Was nice to not get a crappy system with 1 Op this time.
Last edited:
a few questions from my community: we have finaly conquer 3 system and in other 2 system we are in election pending and hope to take this 2 in some days, we have also an expansion pending and the answer is: theres a way to determinate the target system of next expansion?
For example i know the expansion usually go where there are tiny popolation, a few faction and may a low security.
SO there's a possibility to work in a System, for expample, with 1milions peolpe living, 4 faction and a large station to try to expanding in it?
-> the problem is: we have an incredible number of poor sistem with a pair of thousand of citizen near us, and may just a little outpost, because we stay in an extraction\refinery\industrial bubble away from the core.
We stay in a High Tech system with 5 milion citizen, have 4 four system every 4 are tiny system with very little population
thanks and sorry about my english, need to improve
For example i know the expansion usually go where there are tiny popolation, a few faction and may a low security.
SO there's a possibility to work in a System, for expample, with 1milions peolpe living, 4 faction and a large station to try to expanding in it?
-> the problem is: we have an incredible number of poor sistem with a pair of thousand of citizen near us, and may just a little outpost, because we stay in an extraction\refinery\industrial bubble away from the core.
We stay in a High Tech system with 5 milion citizen, have 4 four system every 4 are tiny system with very little population
thanks and sorry about my english, need to improve
Last edited:
It seems to prove the fact that the "Bubble" in which a (still randomly generated) Expansion can happen isn't 30Ly but 50Ly. Regarding the "bumping" [???] but since you ended up somewhere you liked [hehe]
I just want to make sure I have this right...
Two factions entered a War state today.
Two other factions were in 'election cooldown'.
The two factions that were in election cooldown are once again 10 and 11%. Shouldn't they have gone right from 'election cooldown' to 'election pending'?
Last few days inf and states...the two at 7 and 6 are now at war...the two at 10 and 11 I thought should have entered 'election pending':
Two factions entered a War state today.
Two other factions were in 'election cooldown'.
The two factions that were in election cooldown are once again 10 and 11%. Shouldn't they have gone right from 'election cooldown' to 'election pending'?
Last few days inf and states...the two at 7 and 6 are now at war...the two at 10 and 11 I thought should have entered 'election pending':
Factions do tend to fall back into election if it ends close enough. The problem here could be it looks like you are taking the rounded values from the nav panel instead of the more accurate values from the system map.
Even though the panel shows 10/11 it might actually be closer to 9/12 if you look at the system map.
I had not checked the system map. I was indeed using the right hand panel, as I thought if they were within a percent or 2, it would trigger. You might have been right though.
They are in pending election now. They both show as 11 % and both are at 11.6 in the system panel. I wonder if it was a minor difference in % inf, or just that it can't go from recovering election directly to pending election. Maybe a tick past the last state before the same state can trigger?? Has anyone seen 'recovering election' and 'pending election' at the same time?
No, you can't have a conflict start or go pending while another conflict is cooldown/recovery.
Maybe that's why then. The system had to see no state before allowing 'election pending' could be applied. It's like adding an extra day to the cooldown.
