Add "escape-shuttle" slot to every ship with moderate range, applications also for new C&P-system

[Myspace Kaitsu80]

Add "escape-shuttle" slot to every ship with moderate range, applications also for new C&P-system

Just as we had planetary approachment equipment added to every ship in Horizons with extra slot to fitting, we could have escape shuttle/pod (with moderate jump range and perhaps small fuel scoop also, but that´s all) slot also added to every ship for 3.0, automatically launching at ship destruction or like a fighter as an option (to abandon ship, say after running out of fuel or disabled by pirates).

It could help in new Crime&Punishment-system also, because murder could be made more complicated than it is now, as every victim of pirate(s) would have an option of survival even if ship is completely disabled or even destroyed.

Meaning more options how to act for both pirate(s) and a victim, perhaps after successful escape to station victim could call for a "tow" of his/her ship (or what is left of it) and suffer much less losses in costs of new ship rebuy (as it is now through insurance), and for a pirate there could be 4 different levels in new bounty system:

1. Attacking ship (includes cargo hatch operations),
2. disableing ship (so that victim can still tow it back to his nearest station for much reduced costs),
3. destroying ship allowing rescue ship to escape (both victim and pirate suffers more in losses and C&P, balance and scale for victims favour to counter griefing),
4. and then straight out murder (of even escape shuttle/ship/capsule/pod) that would be way most severe as killing even rescue ship shows great deal of commitment more towards griefing than loot itself (as should for every self respecting pirate)...

 

[Lestat]

We do have Escape pod.

Occupied Escape Pod

 

[Myspace Kaitsu80]

We do have Escape pod.

Occupied Escape Pod

Indeed, now we just need to be able to enter it, voluntary or not the case .

And for medium/large vessels (most likely targets of pirates, also largest losses in cargo/insurance) Escape Pod should be upgraded with small FSD and Fuel Scoop (not so important for small ships like Sidewinter/Eagle/Hauler etc. that are anyways rather more likely used for piratism itself or for small scale trade/missions inside "Bubble" station-systems with potentially much less losses, even in insurance).

 

[[Diplomacy] Carnegie]

Indeed, now we just need to be able to enter it, voluntary or not the case .

And for medium/large vessels (most likely targets of pirates, also largest losses in cargo/insurance) Escape Pod should be upgraded with small FSD and Fuel Scoop (not so important for small ships like Sidewinter/Eagle/Hauler etc. that are anyways rather more likely used for piratism itself or for small scale trade/missions inside "Bubble" station-systems with potentially much less losses, even in insurance).

What exactly do I gain from not immediately being back at the rebuy screen?

If my ship is destroyed thousands of LYs from home I'm not going to fly an escape pod home, even with an FSD and fuelscoop.

 

[varonica]

What exactly do I gain from not immediately being back at the rebuy screen?

If my ship is destroyed thousands of LYs from home I'm not going to fly an escape pod home, even with an FSD and fuelscoop.

Personally I'm trying to figure out the advantage of flying a sidewinder with an escape pod without a fuel scoop and fsd drive. Does this mean I just sit stranded on a planet or in space waiting for someone to come rescue me? Good luck if you are out near Sag A in your little sidewinder. Or maybe if I fly a sidewinder I get to instantly go to the rebuy screen but fliers of bigger ships get punished by being forced to fly 10kly+ back to Colonia or the next nearest outpost in an escape pod with a 10ly jump range, a 1a fuel scoop and 4t fuel tank.

Or...or...maybe your escape pod has an escape pod and hitting self destruct will leave you stranded in deep space in an "escape, escape pod, pod".

Then if you self destruct that you get put in an "escape, escape pod, escape pod, pod" that then lets you access the rebuy screen!

Hmm, the possibilities for emergent gameplay are endless in this one!

 

[[Diplomacy] Carnegie]

Personally I'm trying to figure out the advantage of flying a sidewinder with an escape pod without a fuel scoop and fsd drive. Does this mean I just sit stranded on a planet or in space waiting for someone to come rescue me? Good luck if you are out near Sag A in your little sidewinder. Or maybe if I fly a sidewinder I get to instantly go to the rebuy screen but fliers of bigger ships get punished by being forced to fly 10kly+ back to Colonia or the next nearest outpost in an escape pod with a 10ly jump range, a 1a fuel scoop and 4t fuel tank.

Or...or...maybe your escape pod has an escape pod and hitting self destruct will leave you stranded in deep space in an "escape, escape pod, pod".

Then if you self destruct that you get put in an "escape, escape pod, escape pod, pod" that then lets you access the rebuy screen!

Hmm, the possibilities for emergent gameplay are endless in this one!

It's escape pods all the way down.

 

[Myspace Kaitsu80]

What exactly do I gain from not immediately being back at the rebuy screen?

If my ship is destroyed thousands of LYs from home I'm not going to fly an escape pod home, even with an FSD and fuelscoop.

If you run out of fuel now "thousands of LYs from home", do you wait for Fuel Rats or self destruct?

Pretty much the same thing. Now you just self destruct Escape Pod instead of your ship.

But, especially if near systems with shipyards and you wanna save some money (towing ship for a low cost back to station instead of full rebuy costs), it might suddenly sound more of an option even for a billionare such as you:

In the end Elite is all about choices, do we wanna take part of anything that might be new and fun, though if it pays less than "grinding" passengers?
I bet passengers pay better than pvp/pve-piracy for most, but still we have pirates, even people running around planets in a SRV (try it in VR, super cool) for no credits at all, but just for the fun of it.

Though in the end this topic were not so much about if this feature would be useful or fun (for most) per itself, but more about how it could benefit new C&P system allowing more options/experiences for both pirates and their victims, and with more "levels of choices" help balance now very strick system where you are either murderer pirate just from disableing a ship or a victim sitting in a disabled ship and thus de facto murdered (eventhough not so) and feeling unjust (because pirate did not even get a bounty from murder) with perhaps big losses in credits (ship+cargo, as pirates have usually less financial risks and upperhand to begin with versus their targets).
Well for me anyways, so far those have seemed to be only options to choose from for FD searching balance to C&P.

 

[[Diplomacy] Carnegie]

If you run out of fuel now "thousands of LYs from home", do you wait for Fuel Rats or self destruct?

Pretty much the same thing. Now you just self destruct Escape Pod instead of your ship.

But, especially if near systems with shipyards and you wanna save some money (towing ship for a low cost back to station instead of full rebuy costs), it might suddenly sound more of an option even for a billionare such as you:

In the end Elite is all about choices, do we wanna take part of anything that might be new and fun, though if it pays less than "grinding" passengers?
I bet passengers pay better than pvp/pve-piracy for most, but still we have pirates, even people running around planets in a SRV (try it in VR, super cool) for no credits at all, but just for the fun of it.

Though in the end this topic were not so much about if this feature would be useful or fun (for most) per itself, but more about how it could benefit new C&P system allowing more options/experiences for both pirates and their victims, and with more "levels of choices" help balance now very strick system where you are either murderer pirate just from disableing a ship or a victim sitting in a disabled ship and thus de facto murdered (eventhough not so) and feeling unjust (because pirate did not even get a bounty from murder) with perhaps big losses in credits (ship+cargo, as pirates have usually less financial risks and upperhand to begin with versus their targets).
Well for me anyways, so far those have seemed to be only options to choose from for FD searching balance to C&P.

Seems to be a lot of development effort for what would most likely be a little-used feature.
Most combats end with a ship blowing up - disabling a ship is a rare event.
Since the 'Reboot/Repair' option allows you to become 'abled' again if you're not destroyed I can't see an actual use for a escape pods.

 

[Myspace Kaitsu80]

Seems to be a lot of development effort for what would most likely be a little-used feature.
Most combats end with a ship blowing up - disabling a ship is a rare event.
Since the 'Reboot/Repair' option allows you to become 'abled' again if you're not destroyed I can't see an actual use for a escape pods.

Point were for this feature to allow more complicated other features and gameplay in general, as a one example possible implementations it could allow to be done in C&P around it I mentioned earlier.

It is not our job to think here what FD Devs can NOT do with this feature because "X" is already there, but rather what they COULD do, especially in such obvious cases where maybe "X" is not always an option or gets (possibly) changed/removed/nerfed etc.


I would rather take more positive look on the matter, using your examples, that there might with this feature be more new reasons not to blow up ships so much instead of disableing them (and allow more means for FD Devs to make that possible and more likely scenario).
And for a victim make it an option to actually save money by abandoning ship with cargo so that maybe ship wont get blown up (or MAYBE it can be "towed" to station despite it being destroyed as long as victim escaped instance in his Pod before ship got destroyed, allowing for a victim tactical decision for abandoning cargo to save in rebuy costs).

And well [yesnod] [yesnod] [yesnod], you might not need an Escape Pod because you have materials ready onboard and know what to do after being disabled to repair/reboot your ship, but in my case despite being a backer and active player for years I never bothered to figure that part out... (have not had a need for it even once though, but as you earlier put it, why would I even bother when there is always self destruct?) ....and thus certainly dead without Escape Pod and a station nearby...

 

[varonica]

It is not our job to think here what FD Devs can NOT do with this feature because "X" is already there, but rather what they COULD do, especially in such obvious cases where maybe "X" is not always an option or gets (possibly) changed/removed/nerfed etc.

I'm not sure it works that way.

Player A) This is what FDEV should put in the game

Player B) and what gameplay advantages would that give us

Player A) I have no idea, that's up to FDEV to work out.

Well I think FDEV have plenty of things to already work out without taking onboard suggested features and then trying to work out what to do with them. If you are suggesting a particular feature then yes it is your job to flesh it out and fill in the details.

 

[Myspace Kaitsu80]

Oh. My. God.

What an AWESOME idea.

I would love to be able to pod another commander.

But then how are they going to respawn in a logical fashion?

Just as they spawn now (or as planned) perhaps?
Either closest station with Shipyard/towing or in a rebuy ship at latest port you docked?

I don´t see much problems keeping spawning of Escape Pods same as spawning from ship that exploded, in a programming sense.




----------------------

Well I think FDEV have plenty of things to already work out without taking onboard suggested features and then trying to work out what to do with them. If you are suggesting a particular feature then yes it is your job to flesh it out and fill in the details.

I like to think I have already done exactly that already earlier in this topic, though it can be taken further still (by me and others):

It could help in new Crime&Punishment-system also, because murder could be made more complicated than it is now, as every victim of pirate(s) would have an option of survival even if ship is completely disabled or even destroyed.

Meaning more options how to act for both pirate(s) and a victim, perhaps after successful escape to station victim could call for a "tow" of his/her ship (or what is left of it) and suffer much less losses in costs of new ship rebuy (as it is now through insurance), and for a pirate there could be 4 different levels in new bounty system:

1. Attacking ship (includes cargo hatch operations),
2. disableing ship (so that victim can still tow it back to his nearest station for much reduced costs),
3. destroying ship allowing rescue ship to escape (both victim and pirate suffers more in losses and C&P, balance and scale for victims favour to counter griefing),
4. and then straight out murder (of even escape shuttle/ship/capsule/pod) that would be way most severe as killing even rescue ship shows great deal of commitment more towards griefing than loot itself (as should for every self respecting pirate)...

Though in the end this topic were not so much about if this feature would be useful or fun (for most) per itself, but more about how it could benefit new C&P system allowing more options/experiences for both pirates and their victims, and with more "levels of choices" help balance now very strick system where you are either murderer pirate just from disableing a ship or a victim sitting in a disabled ship and thus de facto murdered (eventhough not so) and feeling unjust (because pirate did not even get a bounty from murder) with perhaps big losses in credits (ship+cargo, as pirates have usually less financial risks and upperhand to begin with versus their targets).
Well for me anyways, so far those have seemed to be only options to choose from for FD searching balance to C&P.[/I]

I can go even more all creative if you really wanna and ask me well enough, I have whole weekend ahead.

 

[Myspace Kaitsu80]

^Lets add to above, also saving credits (and for a pirate more options to stay out of unintentional murder) were among my suggestions in the post you answered (asking suggestions from me).

Thing is, we already have features like Multicrew that are there to allow future development (eventhough even FD might not yet know how in all aspects of it), and we already even got to every ship extra fitting slot (for planetary landings with Horizons, that either is not yet totally completed or propably even fully planned feature) not much different from what I am suggesting.

I see all game mechanics are there already for this, in a programming sense I bet from fighters/SRV we can go to Escape Pods pretty easy (and FD seems to have possibility to add extra specialized slots to ship fittings I mentioned for it), and avoiding/delaying Rebuy-screen through flying to a nearest station with a Shipyard where you could then get your ship back in certain time (just as we can now order our other stored ships at other stations to where we are for a fee, is tech already there also).

 

[varonica]

^Lets add to above, also saving credits (and for a pirate more options to stay out of unintentional murder) were among my suggestions in the post you answered (asking suggestions from me).

Thing is, we already have features like Multicrew that are there to allow future development (eventhough even FD might not yet know how in all aspects of it), and we already even got to every ship extra fitting slot (for planetary landings with Horizons, that either is not yet totally completed or propably even fully planned feature) not much different from what I am suggesting.

I see all game mechanics are there already for this, in a programming sense I bet from fighters/SRV we can go to Escape Pods pretty easy (and FD seems to have possibility to add extra specialized slots to ship fittings I mentioned for it), and avoiding/delaying Rebuy-screen through flying to a nearest station with a Shipyard where you could then get your ship back in certain time (just as we can now order our other stored ships at other stations to where we are for a fee, is tech already there also).

The last thing I want if I am attacked by a pirate is to be ejected into an escape pod, I see no game play mechanics there for me at all, in fact I detest all forms of PvP, so being attacked by a pirate, then being ejected into a pod because the pirate who is making my life a misery when I want to just get on with the game, then having to fly all the way back to a station to get my ship back is purely designed to extend my misery a further few rounds of undesired PvP to satisfy your desire to extend my misery.

If I get destroyed I want to get to the rebuy screen as quickly as possible, not faff around with escape pods endlessly flying through space. If I have to suicide to get back to the rebuy screen because some gormless non-consensual griefer/pirate decided to use me as part of his/her game play then I want that counted as a crime against the pirate, not a way for the griefer/pirate to escape criminal sanctions because they didn't kill me, just compelled me to commit suicide through boring and undesirable game play that I never wanted to be involved with in the first place. So unless you don't get it yet, the answer is a resounding NO!

I don't care how you dress it up in desirable game play mechanics because they are game play mechanics that are only desirable to you!

 

[Myspace Kaitsu80]

The last thing I want if I am attacked by a pirate is to be ejected into an escape pod, I see no game play mechanics there for me at all, in fact I detest all forms of PvP, so being attacked by a pirate, then being ejected into a pod because the pirate who is making my life a misery when I want to just get on with the game, then having to fly all the way back to a station to get my ship back is purely designed to extend my misery a further few rounds of undesired PvP to satisfy your desire to extend my misery.

If I get destroyed I want to get to the rebuy screen as quickly as possible, not faff around with escape pods endlessly flying through space. If I have to suicide to get back to the rebuy screen because some gormless non-consensual griefer/pirate decided to use me as part of his/her game play then I want that counted as a crime against the pirate, not a way for the griefer/pirate to escape criminal sanctions because they didn't kill me, just compelled me to commit suicide through boring and undesirable game play that I never wanted to be involved with in the first place. So unless you don't get it yet, the answer is a resounding NO!

I don't care how you dress it up in desirable game play mechanics because they are game play mechanics that are only desirable to you!

So, just self destruct or try to get pirate kill your escape vessel to get him/her even bigger problems in new Crime&Punishment system? Just a thought.

First of all I am not a pirate (yet, waiting for a good, fair all around and balanced C&P before I put one of my alts to that route instead of printing credits).

But I think Escape Pods (/"Shuttles") would allow for pirates possibility to not commit unintentional murder (there are/would be gentleman pirates out there), or even destroy ship, just it´s cargo hatch (say there is 3 levels of punisment, cargo piracy, ship destruction, and most severe of all murder of escape pod/shuttle).

Second of all, we get to other benefit of escape pod/shuttle for victims themselves as they can save credits (towing their vessel to station for a balanced fee instead of full Rebuy) and have some extra gameplay, if not intrested then just selfdestruct escape vessel and you are in Rebuy-screen again.
If you dont wan´t to save any money flying to nearest station or any gameplay in it, even ramming a pod to attackers ship, then that is your opinion alone and there are ways getting fast to Rebuy-screen even if you end up to escape pod/shuttle after ship destruction.




PS. I did recently fall a sleep and my ship kept going, woke up 1.05Ly from system star, fuel were low but I had still enough fuel to jump to next star to fuel scoop.
But could have been worse, and I could have runned out of fuel, thus pointing out potential uses for a CMDR´s Escape pod (but only if it were upgraded with small FSD, engine and Fuel Scoop compared to non-Pilot Federation npc´s (say inside bubble or near it, nobody wants to travel 1 Ly in Super Cruise...).

 

[Myspace Kaitsu80]

And let me emphasize again (should have done better in OP) how this system has mostly mechanics for it already in place,

1. escape vessel is for delaying original ships Rebuy screen (if you want so),
2. fighters are there (with SRV), just like ecape vessel could be (with self destruction),
3. extra special fitting slot for escape vessel can be added to every ship if FD so wants because they already did it with Horizons,
4. ships can be ordered for a fee to your station from other already so why not towing your ship after escaping to station?

5. Also, we have already different fines and bounties for different crimes, killing escape vessel or letting it go would bring in more options for both pirate (who might just want cargo, not ship or unintentional murders under new C&P) and victim (less money lost or even whole ship saved, as pirate didn´t wanna take bigger bounty and notoriority from destroying a ship, just disabling it).

 

[Kefhyr]

Yeah, another job for pirates. Slavery! Destroy CMDR ship, capture pod with cargo scoop, sell pod on market. Profit. What about cmdr? Well, his game is over ))

 

[Myspace Kaitsu80]

Yeah, another job for pirates. Slavery! Destroy CMDR ship, capture pod with cargo scoop, sell pod on market. Profit. What about cmdr? Well, his game is over ))

In that case I suggest he gets to pay in rebuy screen just what you got from the pod (even if you have not sold it yet, so in theory he could come after you and his old pod but unlikely because of distances/towing time/instancing issues), but still gets to either tow ship to that station (takes time as ship transfer now but saves money compared to rebuy) or then to proceed straight to Rebuy screen to access ship immediately.

 

[Myspace Kaitsu80]

^to add above, unfortunately logging out-/Rebuy-screen systems prevent selling us to slavery, even after space legs.

But as many things in this game, if your imagination is good enough and you can immerse below the "surface" of the game we can see, just as I imagine I´m helping building a new Star Trek kind of Utopia on one "Communist" (name suggests to more moderate leftist party) controlled planet now terraformed already..

Yeah, laugh away. (but really, thing here were not killing escape vessels, though part of it to some for sure, but as a new mechanics this would allow now/in future C&P/future other aspects by allowing more options, say between piratism and murder).
And most of all, using already existing mechanics.