Any grind, is in your mind.
- Thread starter shadragon
- Start date
Well, then you'd hear even more complaints about a lack of content...
Once again: it is expensive, but for a billionaire it shouldn't be.
Well a billionaire in ED can easily afford rebuys in the game as well. So no real issues. Of course if you keep losing you massive warship, i suggest not flying it until you get better at combat.
So no real argument again. Okay, enjoy the grind and dont forget to blame others.
I was merely listing examples that played against your assentation that OPs post made the standard MMO rank comparison grind a null argument. Just because this is Elite doesn't make it any different from any other game out there. We have a loosely built wire-frame game on a solid mechanical foundation. Frontier needs to finish filling in the gaps between the wires to turn this game into something truly enjoyable for more than just the handful of people who've managed to make something out of nothing.
I don't partake in the grind if I can avoid it. I just think that the argument presented for there being no grind in Elite is absurd.
Huh? Why not? If you spend a significant amount of your cash, it is expensive. If you want it to be cheaper, you either need to spend less of have more. Wealth doesnt work by just saying "Now I feel rich and everything should be cheap for me."
But at least players would leave happy and return for sequels/expansions. Taking months, or years, to unlock content you paid for is horrible game design.
Op I agree with you but we aren't going to change anyone's mind. We're all a thick-headed lot. The best we can do to combat "the grind" posts is to stop responding to them. They will get posted, we'll ignore them, and posts about more interesting subjects might live on the front page longer.
I am trying to avoid posting rebuttals to negative and divisive threads. No more nerf threads, no more grind threads, no more transfer threads, no more immersion threads. Instead I look for interesting threads about planetary smuggling techniques and thargoid conspiracy theories. The forum is a bit slower and a lot more interesting from this perspective. I'll admit that it's harder to find an interesting thread and if I avoided everything that looks like click bait I'd have missed some interesting discussions and a few funny jokes, but then again it's not a life philosophy or anything, I'm just trying to tune out some negativity... so if I wind up replying to a thread about the grind-mentality of elite gamers it's not a personal failure.
I am trying to avoid posting rebuttals to negative and divisive threads. No more nerf threads, no more grind threads, no more transfer threads, no more immersion threads. Instead I look for interesting threads about planetary smuggling techniques and thargoid conspiracy theories. The forum is a bit slower and a lot more interesting from this perspective. I'll admit that it's harder to find an interesting thread and if I avoided everything that looks like click bait I'd have missed some interesting discussions and a few funny jokes, but then again it's not a life philosophy or anything, I'm just trying to tune out some negativity... so if I wind up replying to a thread about the grind-mentality of elite gamers it's not a personal failure.
Quick everyone....look happy....the thought police are on patrol.
Nobody mention the 'g' word...and for goodness sake play the 'right' way...at least while they are looking, you can go back to the real ED once they've passed.
Nobody mention the 'g' word...and for goodness sake play the 'right' way...at least while they are looking, you can go back to the real ED once they've passed.
Oh, I know. I agree. I'm just saying that, without all the padding we currently have (why do you think Frontier nerfed a ton of mission types?), the game would get old quicker than it currently does.
An example of this is a nice little game called Rebel Galaxy. I got it on sale for ten bucks. Just like in Elite, you could buy better ships and upgrade them - with the difference that the best weapons were obtained through bashing the biggest enemies over the head, not with credits or random sliders. Unlike Elite, there were special mission types (not unlike the old Robigo missions, I suppose) that netted you a ton of money. The risk? You'd basically have to warp straight into the center of an enemy fleet, deliver some data, and get out alive. This was pretty much the most entertaining thing to do, since it was both extremely difficult and extremely rewarding. There wasn't a "high-wake" option: when you got hit, your jump drive cooldown got reset. So I would warp in, spamming the hotkey for the data delivery, and barely warp out before the eight capital ships surrounding the delivery point opened fire with every broadside gun and point defense turret they had.
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Make sure you don't commit Grindcrime. It's a double sentence if you're found guilty of Sothiscrime.
Reason why people complain about the grind is quite simply because there is a lack of compelling content and the shortfall is picked up by creating a glacial pacing which requires us to perform the same tasks over and over again, hashing out generic mission templates and so on.. This sort of thing is used throughout the game, particuarly with gaining access to the engineers and collecting the stuff to mod our ships.
So an example of a grind in ED is raising ones Fed or Empire rank. Rather than some sort of in depth military/science career, missions, storyline and engaging characters or variation of high feature experiences we instead have to repeat the same actions over and over, stacking missions, repeating mundane tasks, using mode switching. The only indication anything changes is a little up or down arrow and filling up xp bars. Upon getting your rank up mission its no different to any of the other missions and its no sense of irony that to get to Marquis I delievered some fruit and vegtables.
You could argue no one needs to do any of this, or play the game either (I'm sure Frontier would be suitably impressed if everyone did decide the game wasn't for them and buggered off, and left a scathing review), leaving only the white knights to fund and play the game. Nevertheless, the reason folks do this is for the reward at the end, i.e. the ships, and thats game content and I don't think its unreasonable to want access to that.
So with little variety and a shortage of game content, encounters and mechanics we are indeed required to grind for certain things. I think its fair to say that all MMOs have a grind to a certain extent, and its almost a requirement when we consider the technical challenge and scope of the game.
Where ED excels is in the flight experience, immersion, and the environments, stunning vistas, and a sense that we are cruising through the galaxy in command of our own destiny and starship. Where it is weak, perhaps because of what an excellent job has been done elsewhere, are many of tasks the game asks us to do and more often than not its a case of getting it over with so we can focus on what is enjoyable about the game.
I'm not going to give Frontier a trashing over this because there are quite clearly restrictions on what is possible, based upon current tech, their ability, time and resources. However, majority of the cool or interesting things that go on (call it the gameplay meta for the want of a better term) are what players do outside this framework. So examples are the Fuel Rats and the DW trip, canyon racing, and the player created PvP league that went on some time back; all player emergent gameplay. You have to ask yourself why folks are doing that if the PvE game driven experience from Frontier is so exceptional.
Some people enjoy playing teh BGS, some PP, and I can see why but I suspect they enjoy the result rather than the process. ED was obviously ridiculously ambitious, and perhaps nothing wrong with that, and has clearly got a long way to go to be what it can. I do think its getting there, just had a rather enjotyable passenger trip and saw a new place I'd never been to, and there are moments I have in game that are truly awesome, but lets not kid ourselves about where the game is weak. There are elements of grind, some to be expected for a game like this, some aren't bad at all (i.e. working towards Elite rank), but others are a frustrating and unrewarding experience. I just mined 50 tons of Bromellite, don't tell me there is no grind.
edit: having said all of this, and despite all my many critical comments over the years, I do actually love playing ED. Its great to have a new Elite game, a day I thought would never come, and I am so very pleased with its progress of late. I just hope it continues to improve in the fashion it has this year. See you round the galaxy commanders o7
So an example of a grind in ED is raising ones Fed or Empire rank. Rather than some sort of in depth military/science career, missions, storyline and engaging characters or variation of high feature experiences we instead have to repeat the same actions over and over, stacking missions, repeating mundane tasks, using mode switching. The only indication anything changes is a little up or down arrow and filling up xp bars. Upon getting your rank up mission its no different to any of the other missions and its no sense of irony that to get to Marquis I delievered some fruit and vegtables.
You could argue no one needs to do any of this, or play the game either (I'm sure Frontier would be suitably impressed if everyone did decide the game wasn't for them and buggered off, and left a scathing review), leaving only the white knights to fund and play the game. Nevertheless, the reason folks do this is for the reward at the end, i.e. the ships, and thats game content and I don't think its unreasonable to want access to that.
So with little variety and a shortage of game content, encounters and mechanics we are indeed required to grind for certain things. I think its fair to say that all MMOs have a grind to a certain extent, and its almost a requirement when we consider the technical challenge and scope of the game.
Where ED excels is in the flight experience, immersion, and the environments, stunning vistas, and a sense that we are cruising through the galaxy in command of our own destiny and starship. Where it is weak, perhaps because of what an excellent job has been done elsewhere, are many of tasks the game asks us to do and more often than not its a case of getting it over with so we can focus on what is enjoyable about the game.
I'm not going to give Frontier a trashing over this because there are quite clearly restrictions on what is possible, based upon current tech, their ability, time and resources. However, majority of the cool or interesting things that go on (call it the gameplay meta for the want of a better term) are what players do outside this framework. So examples are the Fuel Rats and the DW trip, canyon racing, and the player created PvP league that went on some time back; all player emergent gameplay. You have to ask yourself why folks are doing that if the PvE game driven experience from Frontier is so exceptional.
Some people enjoy playing teh BGS, some PP, and I can see why but I suspect they enjoy the result rather than the process. ED was obviously ridiculously ambitious, and perhaps nothing wrong with that, and has clearly got a long way to go to be what it can. I do think its getting there, just had a rather enjotyable passenger trip and saw a new place I'd never been to, and there are moments I have in game that are truly awesome, but lets not kid ourselves about where the game is weak. There are elements of grind, some to be expected for a game like this, some aren't bad at all (i.e. working towards Elite rank), but others are a frustrating and unrewarding experience. I just mined 50 tons of Bromellite, don't tell me there is no grind.
edit: having said all of this, and despite all my many critical comments over the years, I do actually love playing ED. Its great to have a new Elite game, a day I thought would never come, and I am so very pleased with its progress of late. I just hope it continues to improve in the fashion it has this year. See you round the galaxy commanders o7
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The only difference here is joy. If you enjoy the repetive thing you do, it´s not a grind.
If you don´t enjoy, it is a grind.
The same thing, different people = different feelings
WE are different. It´s not the thing we do which is different. It´s US.
So don´t try to convince people. No argument will do.
If you don´t enjoy, it is a grind.
The same thing, different people = different feelings
WE are different. It´s not the thing we do which is different. It´s US.
So don´t try to convince people. No argument will do.
Except it's quite easy to make a compelling argument against repetetive, samey missions. If you can't defend yourself from those arguments with a well-constructed rebuttal, don't blame the other guy.
Well said OP, and a perspective that MANY players need to understand. +1 rep added to your account! [up]
OP obviously doesn't even know what the term "grind" even means if he feels the way he does.
If you MUST do something repetitively to get a certain goal, whether you like doing it or not, it is a GRIND. Difference being in that enjoyment or lack there of. In ED's case, nearly all the grinds are exceptionally long, exceptionally boring, exceptionally tedious, and exceptionally unnecessary, hence the problem.
If you MUST do something repetitively to get a certain goal, whether you like doing it or not, it is a GRIND. Difference being in that enjoyment or lack there of. In ED's case, nearly all the grinds are exceptionally long, exceptionally boring, exceptionally tedious, and exceptionally unnecessary, hence the problem.
Yeah, they really need to understand that they're playing the game wrong! SHAME! SHAME ON THEM!
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Well, at least somebody gets it.
OK then I have to ask, why are you participating in this conversation? You don't find it grindy, you don't get why it's grindy and you enjoy the grindy elements. I'm not sure what you're contributing to the thread with posts like these.
You can't even agree that trading is a simplicistic, grindy mechanic when we've demonstrated it to be so. All I have to do is mention netflix and that's it, proof is in the pudding.
How is trading a positive influence on the game and how does it retain players?
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If that makes a lack of content, then it never had any in the first place.