Are founder's benefits not in the spirit of the game?

[Strangepork]

Look at the very specific language you used in your original post, that was no accident and I don't understand your "surprise" at some of the replies. Actually, that's a fib as I do understand both.

Apologies CMDR if my wording has been a bit clumsy, I guess I would like to know how people feel about backers taking an advantage a game, however small.

 

[Hamakua]

I... don't know what to make of this other than an attempted bait.

Is Code even still a thing? /wink

 

[Seonid]

Apologies CMDR if my wording has been a bit clumsy, I guess I would like to know how people feel about backers taking an advantage a game, however small.

Surely such "advantages" would only really have an effect at the very start, rather than a year into the game? And that wouldn't that also apply to starting any game a year after launch?

 

[Porina]

Last time I checked, this game isn't chess, or cricket for that matter. This isn't a race to some finish line. You don't have to beat everyone else. This is something you can play at your own pace.

I joined the kickstarter, and had beta access, but didn't actually start the game until a couple months after launch. Everyone who did play earlier (backer or not) were so far ahead of me, it made no difference if I had any benefits. Maybe those benefits will give me a fractional effective speed increase relative to someone playing a similar style without. But playing more often, or taking higher risk/reward actions would more than negate that difference if you choose to go for it.

 

[CMDR_Amanath]

Its a big and unfair Galaxy. I personally have no problem with it. Constant equalisation leads to very sterile boring games where nothing standsout. Im all for difference, good and bad because simulating our galaxy should be.

 

[rote1]

Dear OP:

I read your post and the first 20 posts after yours in detail and the glanced through the rest.
Enough people have responded to all the things in depth. Therefore I find it interesting that since your OP, you have defended your point of view and your right to raise this discussion. What you have actually not done at all since posting this thread is to respond the the in-depth responses you have given.

I never called anyone out on trolling before, but you do seem to like to fan the flames. Prove me wrong and lets us know how you feel about the responses to the issues you posted.

 

[Brian of Earth]

Does anyone else think it's cheesy that founders/backers asked for or were given in-game benefits, such as;

A locked off system,
free ships,
a starting CR bonus,
cheaper ships,
discounted insurance,
founders missions (that pay out better).
God-like powers!!


Sure, real world benefits like beta access, copies of the game, t-shirts and free access to the game, but it seems outwith the spirit of the game for them to have and use such powerful benefits over most of the player base.

For the record, you can go there after earning the right. The free ships aren't ones I would fly so that's no perk for me (not a backer).

I worked my ass off from April 2 to the middle of October to earn Elite and the honor of buying my ships at a discount and I also do most of my outfitting in Jameson as well.

Although I would have liked to have contributed as a backer, I am more proud of the fact that I earned my place there.

You have that opportunity too.

Not arguing, just saying..

 

[Strangepork]

Surely such "advantages" would only really have an effect at the very start, rather than a year into the game? And that wouldn't that also apply to starting any game a year after launch?

If that's the case Seonid, it's a bit like saying how skillfully you were able to play the first three moves in a game of chess, has no impact on the game later or the outcome.

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Last time I checked, this game isn't chess, or cricket for that matter. This isn't a race to some finish line. You don't have to beat everyone else. This is something you can play at your own pace.

I joined the kickstarter, and had beta access, but didn't actually start the game until a couple months after launch. Everyone who did play earlier (backer or not) were so far ahead of me, it made no difference if I had any benefits. Maybe those benefits will give me a fractional effective speed increase relative to someone playing a similar style without. But playing more often, or taking higher risk/reward actions would more than negate that difference if you choose to go for it.

CMDR Porina, computer game or not, isn't one of the founding notions or rule of games, that we all play fairly and with the same chances in the game, whatever destination in it we are seeking?

 

[excalibus]

As a beta backer... with a freegle, and cheaper insurance and (as it happens luckily enough) founders world access

I can assure you there is no 'real and tangible' advantage over those that brought into the game after release beyond the cheaper insurance...

Without the founders, There may well not have even been a release of ED last year... Without the millions of pounds pledged in the kickstarter and the additional income from those of us who are beta backers the first 2 seasons of the game might not have even been possible...

If you think the 'freegle' is a serious advantage then you really are mistaken IMHO...

The insurance reduction is really mostly an advantage later on when you have expensive ships costing millions in rebuy... until then, there is not very much advantage for us compared to non founders / non beta backers at all...

There are NO god like powers that have been given to founders that I am aware of.

I am glad that the founders birthright is access to founders world, were given even cheaper insurance than me, and have special missions that they can do from the outset (and the rest of us have to wait until we reach elite to do) and I would not begrudge them at all...

So to answer your question OP,

No I do not think its cheesy that they have been given these perks... Envy is rather unbecoming...

And as much as you claim your OP is not a troll post... it very very much comes across as one to me... especially as you seem to think we backers are 'taking advantage' when its not us taking advantage but being GIVEN 'advantages' for our early commitment to frontier...

 

[kepler84]

Apologies CMDR if my wording has been a bit clumsy, I guess I would like to know how people feel about backers taking an advantage a game, however small.

I don't care if they have advantages, since I'm not playing with them.

Unless solo mode is removed, I'm totally fine with other players having said advantages for supporting the project.

Oh, and I actually think they deserve them, I would never have known about this game if it wasn't for them.

 

[Strangepork]

Dear OP:

I read your post and the first 20 posts after yours in detail and the glanced through the rest.
Enough people have responded to all the things in depth. Therefore I find it interesting that since your OP, you have defended your point of view and your right to raise this discussion. What you have actually not done at all since posting this thread is to respond the the in-depth responses you have given.

I never called anyone out on trolling before, but you do seem to like to fan the flames. Prove me wrong and lets us know how you feel about the responses to the issues you posted.

While playing at the same time I have been CMDR, though it is seeming like even mentioning the topic of the notion of fairness in games with regard to Elite, is attracting, unfairly, instant calls of troll and some very strongly worded replies.

As I'd said earlier in response to CMDR GluttonyFang, if this were chess and some people had an extra pawn, or an advantage, however small, because they had something to do with the creation of the game it would not be considered fair game-play.

 

[Riktar]

Does anyone else think it's cheesy that founders/backers asked for or were given in-game benefits, such as;

A locked off system,

Makes
free ships,
a starting CR bonus,
cheaper ships,
discounted insurance,
founders missions (that pay out better).
God-like powers!!


Sure, real world benefits like beta access, copies of the game, t-shirts and free access to the game, but it seems outwith the spirit of the game for them to have and use such powerful benefits over most of the player base.

Without factoring "God-like powers" (And I would like an example of that.) into your question:

Given that this game may not have even materialized without them taking the risk, AND the fact that it does not effect my participation in the game one iota,,,,,

Respectfully, no. It's not cheesy.

 

[rote1]

While playing at the same time I have been CMDR, though it is seeming like even mentioning the topic of the notion of fairness in games with regard Elite, is attracting, unfairly, instant calls of troll and some very strongly worded replies.

Gotcha now
Pretty nice work 8/10

Something to think about: In a world called Elite - how much does fairness weigh?

 

[popuptoaster]

I didn't use any of the starting options I had and I've died 5 times since the game released so i haven't really used the insurance bonus that much.

Discounts at Jameson Memorial in Shinrarta Dezhra are quite handy but that system is open to anyone who can make "Elite" so it's not locked permanently, it's main benefit is that it's always really well stocked with pretty much anything you want to buy.

If you really want founders benefits, go find a game on Kickstarter that might never get finished and give them £200 of your own money, I'm sure they'll give you some in game extras you can feel happy about.

I walked to work for a month to cover my Kickstarter pledge for this game, not everyone who backed has money to burn and I put in cash to get the game released so I'm happy with my rewards, i'm keeping them and no you can't have them.

 

[Zieman]

As I had said earlier, if this were chess and some people had an extra pawn, or an advantage, however small, because they had something to do with the creation of the game it would not be considered fair game-play.

As has been pointed to you earlier, Elite: Dangerous is not chess.

 

[Nitek [pl]]

-A locked off system
Working my way to Elite to get there was the best and hardest journey in game. Getting it and EARNING it are sth different. When I got Elite I woke up my GF to tell her that only to hear that I am crazy and should go to sleep :]]]]

-free ships
Cheap ships that you can get in a couple of hours from the start.
-a starting CR bonus
Not relevant, that is really miniscule ammount
-cheaper ships
10% in shinrarta dezhra. You can go to li-yong-rui systems to get a 15% discount.
-discounted insurance
The only real benefit. I am really sorry that I have no insurance discount as a lifetime pass owner.
-founders missions (that pay out better).
Missions have been killed in 2.0. Founders/Elite missions are crap and pay nothing now. You miss nothing
-God-like powers!!
You can have that by practicing your skills :]

 

[excalibus]

While playing at the same time I have been CMDR, though it is seeming like even mentioning the topic of the notion of fairness in games with regard Elite, is attracting, unfairly, instant calls of troll and some very strongly worded replies.

As I had said earlier, if this were chess and some people had an extra pawn because they had something to do with the creation of the game it would not be considered fair game-play.

it's not in the mentioning of the topic my friend that gets peoples backs up, its the way you went about it in your OP...

Now please address the responses as you have been previously asked with regards to the actual benefits given and why they are 'unfair' in your mind for those who pledged / backed the game in its pre release / early vision state...

I am truely curious as to WHY you feel this is some unfair advantage of your game?

 

[Strangepork]

it's not in the mentioning of the topic my friend that gets peoples backs up, its the way you went about it in your OP...

Now please address the responses as you have been previously asked with regards to the actual benefits given and why they are 'unfair' in your mind for those who pledged / backed the game in its pre release / early vision state...

I am truely curious as to WHY you feel this is some unfair advantage of your game?

I thank you and think your right, I regret using the word cheesy CMDR.

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it's not in the mentioning of the topic my friend that gets peoples backs up, its the way you went about it in your OP...

Now please address the responses as you have been previously asked with regards to the actual benefits given and why they are 'unfair' in your mind for those who pledged / backed the game in its pre release / early vision state...

I am truely curious as to WHY you feel this is some unfair advantage of your game?

My query is more about "backed" computer games, and why a level playing-field, a notion common to all other games is not considered an absolute requirement of them. I have the utmost respect for anyone who had the foresight to back this game.

 

[popuptoaster]

I thank you and think your right, I regret using the word cheesy CMDR.

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My query is more about "backed" computer games, and why a level playing-field, a notion common to all other games is not considered an absolute requirement of them. I have the utmost respect for anyone who had the foresight to back this game.

No internet game is on a level playing field, even with two identiocally skilled players the guy with the better PC can run at higher frame rates ot longer draw ranges (or both) and will be able to shoot you first, the guy with the bigger monitor running at higher res will see you before you see him in the distance, the guy with the faster internet will suffer less input lag and be able to shoot you first, even something as simple as a wired vs wireless controller makes a difference.

life isn't fair, neither are computer games, in this game I paid to help the game get made and for that i get some bonuses, if you had paid extra you'd have them to, you didn't so you don't.

 

[rote1]

My query is more about "backed" computer games, and why a level playing-field, a notion common to all other games is not considered an absolute requirement of them. I have the utmost respect for anyone who had the foresight to back this game.

What good doth solid truth, whence grasped with teasing fingers?